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Old 02-11-2009, 02:36 PM   #41
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Sometimes the things people ask make you realize that they are so out of touch with reality, that it's probably not a good idea to be friends with them.
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Old 02-11-2009, 03:38 PM   #42
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Any "friend" that asks my opinion, doesn't like it and then stops being my "friend", clearly wasn't a friend. I try to be supportive, but at the same time honest with all my friends and it works out well. They do the same for me.

I think many people (not saying the OP) tend to categorize acquaintances as friends.
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Old 02-11-2009, 03:48 PM   #43
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Any "friend" that asks my opinion, doesn't like it and then stops being my "friend", clearly wasn't a friend.
I wonder if you see a flaw in this line of reasoning? What do we do, ask our executor to examine our life history and determine who was and was not a friend?

That is like saying that any wife who decided to move on wasn't really a wife. Maybe she, and the friends whom you put in some other category after an event, just didn't like the way things went down.

Ha
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Old 02-11-2009, 06:19 PM   #44
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Had married friends waay back when I was young an single, they told me about them wanting to buy into a partnership in a bar. 50/50 proposition with some other folks.

Never been known as a diplomat, my first question blurted out, you really want a messy divorce?

Long story made short: they dis buy into the bar, 2 yrs later began a messy divorce, three years later divorce finalized. Huge expense in money and emotions expanded by both of them. Lost them as friends as well.

Now I offer no advice even if asked. My usual response is, I really don't know enough about the nuts and bolts of (insert proposition here) to even consider giving advice.

It is nice to watch ships sail, some put on quiet a show, some never make it out of the harbor.
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Old 02-11-2009, 08:19 PM   #45
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If I had any friends, and they asked me about something like this, I'd say something like "Man, I'd never have the 'nads for something like that. Best of luck to you, and make sure you have a backup plan. "
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Old 02-14-2009, 10:42 AM   #46
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I wonder if you see a flaw in this line of reasoning? What do we do, ask our executor to examine our life history and determine who was and was not a friend?

Mr. Ha, you raised an interesting question. Given that most people would agree there's a difference between friendly acquaintances and friends, and you can't tell the difference until something happens that tests the relationship, the only reason the difference even matters is that we all have a limited amount of time, so it makes sense to maximize the time spent with 'real" friends, who'll stick by you if need be, rather than "surface" friends who'll dump you with ease.

In other words, if nothing bad or crosswise ever happens, then you can be just as content having lots of friendly acquaintances, as having friends.

(Spouses are a whole different ball game, IMHO...separate rules apply)
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Old 02-14-2009, 06:48 PM   #47
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To bring it to the present, Friday night I went out with a group of young people that invites me to functions from time to time...he has become philosophically at odds with the corporate world, and so he wants to go together with a couple of semi-employed anarchist philosopher guys to do web design...way better ways to live that scrambling for low end web business.
...So, I said WOW, GROOVY at the idea, but I feel not great about it.
What do you folks do?
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Disclaimer: I am a very direct person, so keep that in mind as you read this.
If they are just brainstorming, no harm done. Dreaming is good for the soul. Everyone wants to grow up to be a video game programmer these days.

If they are serious about ditching real paycheck generating j*bs for virtual j*bs, going for the pie-in-the-sky, more power to them. Suggest they visit the local Small Business Admin office or refer them to talk to any persons (known to you) who may have already tried this. You have no obligation to approve of or be supportive of the manner in which they earn their living.

If they are telling you their idea so they can try to hit you up for startup funds, run like hell.
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Old 02-14-2009, 07:39 PM   #48
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Disclaimer: I am a very direct person, so keep that in mind as you read this.
If they are just brainstorming, no harm done. Dreaming is good for the soul. Everyone wants to grow up to be a video game programmer these days.

If they are serious about ditching real paycheck generating j*bs for virtual j*bs, going for the pie-in-the-sky, more power to them. Suggest they visit the local Small Business Admin office or refer them to talk to any persons (known to you) who may have already tried this. You have no obligation to approve of or be supportive of the manner in which they earn their living.

If they are telling you their idea so they can try to hit you up for startup funds, run like hell.
I find it hard to know what people might be thinking. I do not think they would have much hope of getting money from me, because I am not the sort who plays millionaire, either at home or on TV.

Anyway, I have known these guys and most of the women for several years and I like them as much as I have ever liked anybody. Maybe I am just not paranoid enough to be a proper member of E-R.org.

Ha
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Old 02-15-2009, 07:39 AM   #49
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Disclaimer: I am a very direct person, so keep that in mind as you read this.
If they are just brainstorming, no harm done. Dreaming is good for the soul. Everyone wants to grow up to be a video game programmer these days.

If they are serious about ditching real paycheck generating j*bs for virtual j*bs, going for the pie-in-the-sky, more power to them. Suggest they visit the local Small Business Admin office or refer them to talk to any persons (known to you) who may have already tried this. You have no obligation to approve of or be supportive of the manner in which they earn their living.

If they are telling you their idea so they can try to hit you up for startup funds, run like hell.
You can make a crap load of money (or none at all) as a video game programmer. Look at Lord British. He recently paid $20 million to fly to the Russian space station. I knew that he had money from all the games. I just didn't know that he was rich enough to part with $20 million bucks for one trip.
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Old 02-15-2009, 08:34 AM   #50
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Maybe I am just not paranoid enough to be a proper member of E-R.org.
I'm guessing you have many other qualities that qualify you for membership; if you think about it.
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Old 02-15-2009, 10:01 AM   #51
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Maybe I am just not paranoid enough to be a proper member of E-R.org.

Hmm...Ha, I know you're only making a bitter little joke, but here's what it made me think of:

My bright, artistic nephew is a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic, and hates it. Even though his meds have unpleasant side effects, he takes them faithfully so he won't have to suffer from the voices and hallucinations telling him that people are trying to harm him. It is heartbreaking to hear him describe the things his mind does to him.

Then again...he doesn't have to work, since he is on total disability....so he qualifies, at 25, as really, really ER. Knowing him, he'd find the idea funny.
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Old 02-15-2009, 12:26 PM   #52
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In my family I have the reputation of saying exactly what I think. Here is how I got it.

About 6 years ago my parents came to our annual family get together mulling over two large decisions:
1. Retiring. Dad wanted to, could easily afford it, but was concerned about the loss of his insurance benefit.
2. Buying a brand new $30k truck.
They talked about it with us kids off and on over an afternoon. Finally, I couldn't stand it anymore. In front of everyone I looked at dad and said "I don't get what the BFD is. Sell the current truck. Bank the bucks you were going to spend on the new one and buy an old beater. Use that $35-40k for insurance-it will cover you for a long time. Tell your employer where to shove it." Everybodies jaws dropped wide open-nobody was ever that open in my family. And the subject was dropped for the weekend.

Dad bought a new truck a month later. And retired four years after that.

Now I have the reputation as the family loudmouth. I enjoy it, even play it up a bit. I'll leave it to you if that is a reputation you want. Most people only want to hear affirmation of what they've already decided.

PS-I'm a little less forthright with friends, but still give opinions WHEN ASKED.
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Old 02-15-2009, 12:38 PM   #53
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In my family I have the reputation of saying exactly what I think. Here is how I got it.

About 6 years ago my parents came to our annual family get together mulling over two large decisions:
1. Retiring. Dad wanted to, could easily afford it, but was concerned about the loss of his insurance benefit.
2. Buying a brand new $30k truck.
They talked about it with us kids off and on over an afternoon. Finally, I couldn't stand it anymore. In front of everyone I looked at dad and said "I don't get what the BFD is. Sell the current truck. Bank the bucks you were going to spend on the new one and buy an old beater. Use that $45k for insurance-it will cover you for a long time. Tell your employer where to shove it." Everybodies jaws dropped wide open-nobody was ever that open in my family. And the subject was dropped for the weekend.

Dad bought a new truck a month later. And retired four years after that.

Now I have the reputation as the family loudmouth. I enjoy it, even play it up a bit. I'll leave it to you if that is a reputation you want. Most people only want to hear affirmation of what they've already decided.

PS-I'm a little less forthright with friends, but still give opinions WHEN ASKED.
This is pretty funny. But I don't think I could ever adopt this approach. For one thing, I have seen that the most extreme chances can pay out big. It may be unlikely, but it can happen. I don't want to be blamed for being the wet blanket that prevented someone from "his one big chance". And it seems that blame is more easily allocated than gratitude.

Overall this thread has helped me a lot, as I can play out various scenarios in my mind, helped by the different posts. I realize that part of what was happening to me is that I was unconsciously assuming something of the role of parent or uncle, a guy with more experience. But really, with everyone but one's own minor children, we are all presumed equal and equally responsible for our own decisions.

I doubt I would have been able to tolerate friends or family helping me to avoid dumb decions. "They may be dumb, but they are mine, all mine!"

Ha
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Old 02-15-2009, 12:57 PM   #54
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I'd recommend that maybe they do it as a part time job until they got it going. Maybe they would realize the mistake that they might be making on their own before getting in too deep.
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