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10-24-2012, 05:16 PM
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#61
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 21,305
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iTunes (and others) let you choose how much compression you want up to none (lossless). I can't hear the difference (especially with 58 yo ears), and I seriously doubt most people can when listening in a car, through earbuds, or an iPod dock of some sort. You can choose in iTunes settings, but IIRC lossless files are about 10X the size of the most common mp3/AAC compression files.
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57
Target AA: 50% equity funds / 45% bonds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 1.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
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10-24-2012, 05:17 PM
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#62
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 21,305
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And then
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57
Target AA: 50% equity funds / 45% bonds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 1.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
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10-24-2012, 06:11 PM
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#63
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 16,603
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The tv guide magazine. Who would ever need that now? The guide is on directv, cable, and on smartphones/tablets.
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10-24-2012, 06:17 PM
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#64
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Midpack
... I can't hear the difference (especially with 58 yo ears), and I seriously doubt most people can when listening in a car, through earbuds, or an iPod dock of some sort. ...
but IIRC lossless files are about 10X the size of the most common mp3/AAC compression files.
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Close, some lossless formats (Like the open source FLAC, or Apple's ALAC/ALE) reduce the file size by ~ 1/2, w/o any losing data. So closer to ~ 5x the size of a 128Kbs mp3.
1411 kbps for raw CD format, ~ 1/2 for lossless, around 700kbps.
So by the time you get to the higher quality mp3, say 192 or 320 kbps, you haven't saved that much from lossless.
But even if one thinks they can't hear the difference, it's good to keep an original lossless file- you can recreate any bit rate or format from that 'master' later, for whatever purpose.
-ERD50
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10-24-2012, 07:17 PM
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#65
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
RE: Vinyl records and CDs...
I've actually compared the compressed mp3 by inverting it and subtracting it from the original. You play that and you hear what is missing - it is like a weird echo/ghost of the original. All that detail is missing from the music. It's not the same. Much of the 'life' has been sucked out of it.
-ERD50
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Can you tell me how to do this inverting and subtraction? Can it be done on iTunes or Audacity? I've already converted my audio files but am curious about what was lost.
When I did convert my music collection, I did a test where I'd take the uncompressed song and compare it with the compressed mp3 file using headphones. I determined that, when I was using headphones and listening closely, I could tell a difference, but it was very minor. On some songs, I could not make out any difference, though.
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10-24-2012, 07:23 PM
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#66
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Nowhere, 43N Latitude, NY
Posts: 9,037
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Forms that require the use of a No. 2 pencil to fill in circles
A short but easy to read description is here
http://www.howeverythingworks.org/page1.php?QNum=1529
J*b applications in hardcopy format
Cartridge pens (Shaefer brand, I think)
Click/spring type ballpoint pens
Almost but not quite gone the way of the dodo bird...coin operated telephone booths and US Postal Service metal mailboxes on public streets
__________________
"All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them." - Walt Disney
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10-24-2012, 07:43 PM
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#67
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David1961
Can you tell me how to do this inverting and subtraction? Can it be done on iTunes or Audacity? I've already converted my audio files but am curious about what was lost.
When I did convert my music collection, I did a test where I'd take the uncompressed song and compare it with the compressed mp3 file using headphones. I determined that, when I was using headphones and listening closely, I could tell a difference, but it was very minor. On some songs, I could not make out any difference, though.
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I used Audacity, so it looks like you are set.
1) Load the original WAV or FLAC in one set of stereo tracks
2) Load the compressed file in a 2nd set of stereo tracks.
3) Invert one set.
4) Mix and Render. Play the result.
I just did a test on Jeff Beck's Goodbye Pork Pie Hat, but just used a high quality compression versus low quality (the original FLAC is on another drive in the other room, and I am lazy). I got mostly weird cymbal crash sounds and some other drum hit sounding things.
As I said earlier, it's actually tough for me to hear the difference in an A-B, but it does seem to become noticeable to me over time. Apparently, all that stuff missing from the sound just makes it kind of life-less. Some kinda spooky echo-y sounds too.
I've heard some people say this is just phase-shift, that you wouldn't hear it as a difference w/o that reference. Maybe, but when I zoom in bit-by-bit, the phase relationships look extremely close. And some of these difference amplitude are about half scale. That would take a full 90 degree phase shift.
It could be in my mind, it's pretty hard to really test this thoroughly. I suppose I could have a random playlist selection, note my impression after 20 minutes, and repeat that a bunch of times and see if I guessed right. But that would be work, and the extra disk space really isn't an issue for me, and I'd want to keep the raw original anyhow if I had to re-encode. So I just listen to FLAC normally, except when I move something to a portable player for causal use.
-ERD50
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10-24-2012, 08:48 PM
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#68
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohyes
Those big old heavy, heavy huge televisions...before flat screens? We purchased them for our kids years ago for Christmas. They were still in the house because, well, because they were so heavy.
At yard sale this weekend, we sold one for $2.00 and gave the other one away. We were SO HAPPY to be rid of them---and i think they cost us about $350 each.
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I still have mine from 1997. Works fine. Almost never watch it, except for Olympics and such. It's in the spare room, where it doesn't take up valuable space in the living room.
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10-24-2012, 08:52 PM
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#69
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kumquat
Some guys just don't know what an attractive young lady is. It's also possible that they don't know how to drive.
DD holds a record AFAIK. Came over the hill kinda quick, saw the mounties too late, braked, got pulled over. Cop says "good brakes on your car". She says "huh?". He says "zapped you 3 times, 160, 140 and 110" (all in KPH). He says "license and registration please", she hands it over. He says "you're an RCMP sargeant?" She says "huh?". He says "slow down". At the time she was a civilian employee of the RCMP. Says she may have had too many pieces of paper with the license and registration, DW says "did he get a date?".
DD's name is Mary. Her friends call her Andretti.
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There's a hill in Saskatchewan? Who knew! LOL
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10-24-2012, 09:02 PM
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#70
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Indialantic FL
Posts: 1,330
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ice cube trays
yellow pages
operator assisted calls
__________________
JimnJana
"The four most dangerous words in investing are 'This time it's different.'" - Sir John Templeton
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10-24-2012, 09:03 PM
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#71
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimnjana
ice cube trays
yellow pages
operator assisted calls
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I, the pleb, still use ice cube trays, and I'm sure many LBYMs do too.
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10-24-2012, 09:10 PM
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#72
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Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 23,041
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List of things I own and still use regularly:
1. Rotary dial phones
2. Vinyl records and turntable
3. Tube amplifier
4. Manual typewriter
5. Wind up mechanical alarm clock
6. Wristwatch
7. Paper maps
8. Paper appointment calendar
9. Paper books
10. Cars with manual transmission
11. Paper checks
12. Fancy Waterman pen to sign my checks
13. Analog thermometer
14. Hand cranked meat grinder
15. Hand cranked pasta maker
__________________
Living an analog life in the Digital Age.
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10-24-2012, 09:46 PM
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#73
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 1,894
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Windows Fax and Scan software is includes in all of the windows 7 versions. As long as you have supported hardware, here is a link to set it up.
Set up your computer to send and receive faxes
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10-25-2012, 02:44 AM
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#74
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Upstate
Posts: 699
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
Lots of great reasons:
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Those may be great reasons for you to do it, but they're not for me.
Eliminating wear & tear comes close, but we've always taken better than average care of our vinyl, and offhand I can't think of one that we've had to replace for wear & tear (other reasons, yes, but not w&t).
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10-25-2012, 02:49 AM
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#75
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Upstate
Posts: 699
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadbh
I, the pleb, still use ice cube trays, and I'm sure many LBYMs do too.
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+1 We just bought a new refrigerator, and DW insisted on saving the $200 for an automatic icemaker + added energy cost.
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10-25-2012, 02:55 AM
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#76
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Upstate
Posts: 699
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gumby
List of things I own and still use regularly:
1. Rotary dial phones
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We would if the phone company hadn't changed the dialtone to digital-only. We held out until we had to make an outgoing call one day...
Don't have a wind-up clock, but I have & use a wind-up pocket watch. (Does that kill 2?)
I'm with ya on everything else except maybe the typewriter. We have one, but haven't used it, and I admit I have been seduced by the dark side of MS Office...
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10-25-2012, 06:21 AM
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#77
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Cavalier
Posts: 2,317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimnjana
ice cube trays
yellow pages
operator assisted calls
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I, also, still use ice cube trays and the yellow pages along with my LPs and CDs. I don't think I will ever be willing to store anything important in the cloud.
__________________
"Don't take life so serious, son. It ain't nohow permanent." Pogo Possum (Walt Kelly)
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10-25-2012, 06:32 AM
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#78
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 25,346
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Dwell meters.
Even my lawn mower has a form of electronic ignition.
How to Use a Tach Dwell Meter | eHow.com
__________________
When I was a kid I wanted to be older. This is not what I expected.
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10-25-2012, 07:40 AM
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#79
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NC
Posts: 21,305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
But even if one thinks they can't hear the difference, it's good to keep an original lossless file- you can recreate any bit rate or format from that 'master' later, for whatever purpose.
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Since everything I've ripped to iTunes is from CD's I own, I'll always have a lossless source, don't need another taking up filespace on my HD, iPad, iPods...what am I missing?
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57
Target AA: 50% equity funds / 45% bonds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 1.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
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10-25-2012, 07:48 AM
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#80
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 14,328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbmrtn
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Thanks. My computer does not have a FAX modem. Maybe one more thing to add to the list.
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