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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 02:32 PM   #21
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Notth
One explanation...we have a well made military (shhh nords, most people dont know* and know how to fight wars quite well.* Buy our country, own our military?
Gee, could we really be that, er, mercenary?

One of the primary missions of the U.S. Army Rangers is to train the security forces of other nations. Your tax dollars at work, folks...
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 03:18 PM   #22
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK
Remember that the reason you can stand on your lily white soapbox is because of people prior to you and now ;are doing the hard work for liberty and freedom.

Quoting the one sided media and slanted websites does not account for the good we are doing. Are we perfect heck no. But you and I both have chose to live in this the best country in the world.

When was the last time people wanted to sneak into France? or Germany or Russia? Or immigrate to China?

God Bless our soldiers, law enforcement, and government officials.

I support your right to object but take the responsiblity to appreciate what we are and the responsibility that it comes with.

It is to easy to complain.... Do something to help the effort.
You are watching way to much Fox news.

People come to the US for a better job (economic opportunity). Freedom and democracy has little to do with it. For example, take Puerto Rico, a US territory with no national voting rights. They also don't pay taxes and don't seem to mind the 'trade-off'.

According to my National Geographic World Atlas, France has a higher percentage of immigrants than the US (so does Austrailia). They go there for the same reasons that they come here -- a better job.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 03:29 PM   #23
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Re empire decline

I'm currently reading Jarrod Diamond's "Collapse -- How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed".

His thesis is that societies fail for one or more of the following reasons:
- damage their environment beyond repair
- natural climate change
- hostile neighbors
- reduced support from friendly neighbors (trading partners)
- how their political and social institutions and respond to these problems. Their cultural values.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 04:52 PM   #24
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Some would say objecting to the death of our soldiers fighting in a country that didn't attack us, wasting billions, and all the while eroding the rights given us in our constitution rather than sitting by and doing nothing IS doing something. Saddam had an election where 100% of the population voted for him.

Laurence - difference between me and you - I run the train...
not stand in front of it. Comparisons are comparisons - you don't like the Russia comparison yet use North Koreans going into China as an argument point? ROTFLMAO

I always admire the Liberal bent - Know nothing - and have nothing at risk... Thank God there are people willing to take a stand to defend your right to pontificate.

Maybe as I get older I will know As much as you do.



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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 05:06 PM   #25
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dex
9/11 attack was based upon the same assumption. Since the Vietnam war and all actions up to and to some degree the first Gulf War (afraid of fighting in the streets of Bagdah) was perceived by the enemies of the USA that the US people are too soft and materilistic to make the sacrifices to fight a protracted action.
Since the Vietnam war and all actions up to the current war excluding only Afghanistan we aren't trying to defeat another nation but invading and trying to divide or shape it to our liking while keeping the locals friendly.

In WWII we conquered the military and peoples of Germany and Japan. In Iraq we're trying to make the locals feel good, but among them are our enemy.

It's been a long time since I heard anyone complain about Afghanistan, and they were a small minority. The lack of enthusiasm is because the public doesn't know what why we're in Iraq but know that Osama isn't there.

Knocking over the Taliban destabilized Afghanistan, but it's been a long time since I heard from anyone who thinks it wasn't necessary and proper. Knocking out Saddam destabilized Iraq--while we still have a destabilized Afghanistan and Osama hunt, by the way--and there was a lot of uncertainty from the start what this accomplishes for us.

Quote:
I think others in the USA (military and politicians) belive the USA will accept high casuality rates. This is why so much money is spent on long distance and high technology armaments.
In Afghanistan and other countries that threaten us, yes. In *selected* countries that don't get along with us but don't pose an immenent threat, no. The reasons given for going into Iraq could've been applied to probably 50 other countries.

Quote:
So if what you say becomes reality then it does not portend peace. It would lead to more attacks by not only in the middle east but posability the likes of China, and N. Korea.
China or N. Korea would get happily nuked if they attacked us. Don't be silly. And China wouldn't attack us because it's currently bootstrapping itself into the modern world with our money. Afghanistan showed this country's thirst for blood. Iraq shows our distate for dying to reform other states. I see what you mean that leaving Iraq would show weakness, but the administration and military should've known this would happen before we went in. That's where the mistakes were made, and now we're stuck with two lose-lose scenarios: stay, die and continue to lose public support or leave and lose face in front of the terrorists.

I think Afghanistan was a very clear sign that we're not tolerating terrorism anymore. Leaving Iraq will fuzz that up a bit, but the mistake was going in, not getting out.

Quote:
2. It is the culture and idea of the USA that is the real threat to the terrorists.
I hear that a l lot. I think that's total BS. I bought that for fighting communism, but not our current terrorist enemies. Oppressive governments like Saudi Arabia use our money and our weapons to continue their people's oppression while shifting blame for the plight to the U.S.. It's complex, but I think the terrorists target us because they think it will improve that group's power back in the middle east. I doubt they really care what we do over here with our culture. We sure don't care what other nations do as long as they don't hurt us or cost us too much money.

Quote:
Yes the death toll in Iraq will reach 2,000. I think 2,500 US solders died on D day alone.
What % of the U.S. opposed that action? And by the way, Saddam is no Hitler.

Quote:
Getting out of Iraq before a government is established may make us feel good in the short term but, it will sow the seeds of future attacks.
I can't argue with the substance of that statement, but again I say the error was made going in. After Vietnam, Korea and Gulf I they should've known the public wouldn't stand for a long steady flow of U.S. blood in the Gulf.


I've seen the word liberal thrown around, but interestingly the people being called this aren't SG, Cut-Throat and I (until I posted here). I guess there's lots more liberals now. Scary, huh?
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 05:54 PM   #26
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

I call this the "radicalization" of politics. What passes for information is sound bites, shouting matches, name-calling, etc.

What's sad is that many seem unable to muster an attention span long enough to delve deeper into an issue. Not many in this forum, of course. In general, I don't think anyone here is spouting outright BS, but what many fail to recognize or admit is that rarely are "absolutes" absolute; i.e. life is messy, and one size does not fit all.

In some ways, the argument of whether we did the right thing is moot, except for future reference. We're there...
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 06:24 PM   #27
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

JB: Thanks for the book title, but . . . . I keep it pretty simple, I think this country is falling apart thru self abuse and stupidity, which includes all the ideas you mentioned .

I'm a Platonist, an Idealist. I always look for the following elements in everything and everyone: Wisdom (correct knowledge or truth), Courage (correct action), Moderation (correct achievement), and Justice (correct fulfillment). They're also connected laterally: If your 'smart,' you'll probably do the correct action. If you do the correct action, it will lead to moderate results. Moderation, nothing in excess, delivers justice to the individual and society. These four components make up The Good.

As you probably know, Plato was not particularly impressed with democracy, especially when it devolves into mob rule. When this happens, intelligence has been squeezed out of the system, up becomes down, evil becomes good, the procuring of inanimate objects (acquisitive war) becomes more important than human life.

Well, that's my world anyway. It's all mental :. Joking around is primarily an escape valve. Best if I stay away from talking too much about serious stuff.

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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 07:18 PM   #28
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

BigMoneyJim,
My posts states:
"It is not the American military that gets defeated. It is the American people. They (we) lose the will to fight (this is not intended to be a coment of the value to start the war or continue being there)."

You misinterpertated what I wrote. Focus on the above. The key point is "(we) lose the will ot fight."

In WWII the use had about 405K US solders killed with a population of apx 129M
http://au.geocities.com/thefortyseco...stats-wwii.htm

With today's population that would equal about 1 million. Would the USA be willing to do that today?

Re: china - China does not have to attack the USA - it could attack Taiwan (we have a treaty to defend Taiwan) or it could attack Vietnam (again) over oil. But China could do what we did to Britain when it wanted to attack Egypt in 1955 over the Suez Canel. The USA threathened to dump UK sterling on the world market thereby devaluing the curreny and causing all types of economic problems for the UK. China has large reserves of US currency.

Again focus on the part of my original post to understand the remainder of the post. The key point is that the USA is preceived by our enimees as weak and will not fight over long periods of time with casualities. This is the main point you would need to address. I'm not sure if you agree with it or not from what you wrote.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 08:02 PM   #29
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK
Some would say objecting to the death of our soldiers fighting in a country that didn't attack us, wasting billions, and all the while eroding the rights given us in our constitution rather than sitting by and doing nothing IS doing something. Saddam had an election where 100% of the population voted for him.

Laurence - difference between me and you - I run the train...
not stand in front of it. Comparisons are comparisons - you don't like the Russia comparison yet use North Koreans going into China as an argument point? ROTFLMAO

I always admire the Liberal bent - Know nothing - and have nothing at risk... Thank God there are people willing to take a stand to defend your right to pontificate.

Maybe as I get older I will know As much as you do.
You run the train, nice. Why don't you go tell some amputees from the war that. And the line about thanking God people are willing to defend your right blah blah blah is so tired it's dead. As far as knowing nothing, you know nothing about me, assume because I don't tow the party line and drink my kool aid that I'm a lib and miss my point on Russia. My point is if you have to compare the U.S. to Russia to look good, that's pretty sad!!!

No weapons of mass destruction, no ties to Al Qaeda, bombs instead of flowers in the street. Just keep beating that drum, TK, whatever. Which war did you serve in again? It seems to me the only one who didn't dodge the draft in the last election WAS THE LIBERAL!! Does the term chicken-hawk mean anything to you? But nevermind, you and reality don't seem to be on a first name basis.

Dex, you are so on the money about China, I am very concerned with the amount of debt held by China, and that's the very scenario I imagined playing out.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 08:09 PM   #30
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Hey you know, I signed up earlier this year, and I've managed to get the lefties and the righties mad at me. Must be doing something right! CHP.....
HAPPY FATHER'S DAY TO ALL.....
Tk and Dex,
Appreciate your concern for the U.S. Empire. Question: Would you please identify the relative (child, grandchild, mother, father, nephew, niece, cousin, sibling, etc). that you would like to donate to the cause? One point of Fred's article was that people were dying and getting maimed. After you identify this relative, be sure and let him/her know that you don't mind them dying for the empire. Because somebody has to do it, don't ya know? If you say none of the above, then how about you guys? You ever been in a war zone? Mebbe you have, I don't know, just checking. If you're not willing to identify a relative or yourself to die for this noble cause, then you are a HYPOCRITE. Or a politician. You are just mouthing platitudes. You see, actions have consequences.

DW and I voted for Reagan twice, Bush the Elder once, and GWB twice (also voted for him as Texas governor). If I had to label myself, it would be libertarian. I did go (didn't do much) to Vietnam in 1966-1967. Fred, the author of the Choo-Choo Train article is a grizzled curmudgeon, and if I remember correctly, a marine, who got to shoot at and be shot at in 'Nam. So, let's not begrudge Fred his opinion. Did you, by any chance, read his blog? You'll have a helluva time calling him a liberal. The last time I quoted Fred, the lefties were all over me.

My soapbox is green, green with envy of your certitude.

I love America, and argue against her critics a lot. Some of the folks on this forum will attest to that.

Can I fit Fred's entire column? Let's try... just to make sure you read it.
Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Children At The Helm
June 18, 2005

The crumbling has begun, methinks. Congressmen, a few only now, speak of withdrawal from Iraq. A small thing, but for the White House a worrisome step toward vertebracy in that body of polyps. The numbers of the dissenting will grow as they see that they do not get hurt. Military recruiting is way down, and will stay down: The gullibility of the young cannot forever be relied upon. The House has summoned the courage to vote against parts of the Patriot Act. The president’s polls drop and drop.

The crumbling has begun, methinks.

Is this surprising? If I may risk repeating myself tiresomely, the way to defeat the American military is to avoiding giving it clear targets, keep the body bags flowing into Dover or Travis, and wait. It is that simple. The insurgents know this. They are doing it, and it is working. Five Marines today, three tomorrow, twelve GIs one week, nine another. On and on. So far we have killed 1700 of our soldiers, closing in on 2000. Sooner or later, even Middle America will notice.

Is victory still possible, if it ever war? The military can’t stop the bleeding, or it would have. Short of a miracle, of perhaps a serious attack within the United States, actually or apparently by terrorists, the casualties will continue. The public will weary of the war, and it will all be over. No?

Wars are marketed as involving moral principles or geo-strategic necessity, but they can become grudge matches, contests of vanity grown stubborn. A president who has led his country into a war has his ego on the line. He cannot easily say, “In the light of events, the adventure appears to have failed, and so we will return home.” The world would regard him as a fool and a knave. Further, humble men do not become presidents. Such a man will struggle on desperately, unwisely, with no real purpose any longer than to avoid the personal ignominy of defeat. When his pride has been engaged he can’t stop. For this men die.

One sees a similar approach in the gambler who, having lost his car, bets his house in hopes of redeeming himself.

As the news worsens the lying, begun long ago, increases. Democracies of course have to be lied into aggressive wars, since no one really cares about the form of government in an obscure and remote nation. Thus as losses mount, the enemy’s successes are described as defeats, as the last throes of a failing force. (I would not be surprised to find that Tokyo described the bombing of Hiroshima as a sign of American desperation.) The government forbids reporters to photograph the coffins, punishes soldiers who talk to the press. The horribly wounded are discreetly hidden. Generals who are not upbeat are fired. Dissidents become labeled as traitors. War crimes become isolated incidents: Only those which are discovered have occurred. Etc.

Historians tend to see wars as consequent to abstract currents of history. They speak of the balance of power, the clash of civilizations, of economic rivalry, and it all sounds dispassionate, reasoned, and occasionally majestic. It might be more accurate to say that wars are the hobbies of half-informed children who have somehow come into possession of the levers of power. Can anyone possible believe that Mr. Bush knew anything about the Arab world when he set out to conquer it? That Hitler understood the Russians, or the Japanese Army, America?

Getting into wars is so often easier than getting out. In terms of national and presidential vanity, the prospects of Iraq, short always of a miracle, vary between bad and ghastly. If the United States pulls out, in a sort of exploitus reservatus, the One Remaining Superpower will be seen not to be. No one will be afraid of us any longer. In particular, countries like Iran will not be afraid. One wonders whether this may not be what Mr. bin Laden had in mind.

Of course in material terms the United States will not be weaker. If driven out of Iraq, America will still be superior in remarkable aircraft and fast carriers and extraordinary submarines. But submarines are of use only in certain kinds of wars, which the enemy will avoid. The good ship USS Thundertrinket can destroy Japan, yes. It cannot defeat a few thousand determined men with rifles. Militaries seem never to learn this.

It is curious. The French, having underestimated both the enemy and the potential of guerilla warfare, got thrashed at Dien Bien Phu. The Americans, equally full of themselves, then went into the same country and got similarly thrashed. The French, having learned nothing, tried again in Algeria, with the same result. The Israelis tried to hold down southern Lebanon, encountering the same problems and equally losing. The Russians, having seen all of this, invaded Afghanistan and got thrashed. Now the United States is in Iraq. For militaries, the learning curve seems to be flat.

The problem is not that soldiers are stupid. They are not. Rather it is (I think) that they become excessively taken with the technology and power of their weapons, with the computers and precision and speed, with themselves, and just do not stop to ponder the difficulty of killing hornets with a howitzer.

The future? Having restored the Vietnam complex, presumably the US will be very hesitant for a decade or so to throw its weight around. Then, having forgotten again, it will invade another country defended by only a few contemptible men with rifles who, in any case, will be expected to throw flowers.

If America loses the White House war—what? I suppose that Mr. Bin Laden will come out of his hole a hero in the Moslem world, laughing pointedly at Mr. Bush. I do not know what part he actually had in the events in New York, but he gets credit for them, which is enough. He would be able to say that he had goaded the Great Satan into a losing war in Arabia that left America defanged and no longer able to give orders to Moslem nations. Isn’t that what he set out to do?

What price nothing? A couple of thousand dead kids, countless cripples who will remain crippled when the current administration has been forgotten, a country wrecked, God knows how many dead Iraqis (I know, they don’t count), thousands of sisters and mothers remembering Bobby every Christmas and looking at his last year book from high school, a tremendous diminution in America’s influence and prestige as China rises, unforeseeable consequences in the Middle East. For what, Mr. Bush? For what?
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 08:41 PM   #31
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle43
Hey you know, I signed up earlier this year, and I've managed to get the lefties and the righties mad at me.* Must be doing something right! CHP.....
HAPPY FATHER'S DAY TO ALL.....
Tk and Dex,
Appreciate your concern for the U.S. Empire.* Question:* Would you please identify the relative (child, grandchild, mother, father, nephew, niece, cousin, sibling, etc). that you would like to donate to the cause?* One point of Fred's article was that people were dying and getting maimed.* After you identify this relative, be sure and let him/her* know that you don't mind them dying for the empire.* Because somebody has to do it, don't ya know?* If you say none of the above, then how about you guys?* You ever been in a war zone?* Mebbe you have, I don't know, just checking. If you're not willing to identify a relative or yourself to die for this noble cause, then you are a HYPOCRITE.* Or a politician. You are just mouthing platitudes.* You see, actions have consequences.*

DW and I voted for Reagan twice, Bush the Elder once, and GWB twice (also voted for him as Texas governor).* If I had to label myself, it would be libertarian.* I did go (didn't do much) to Vietnam in 1966-1967.* Fred, the author of the Choo-Choo Train article is a grizzled curmudgeon, and if I remember correctly, a marine, who got to shoot at and be shot at in 'Nam.* So, let's not begrudge Fred his opinion.* Did you, by any chance, read his blog?* You'll have a helluva time calling him a liberal.* The last time I quoted Fred, the lefties were all over me.* *

My soapbox is green, green with envy of your certitude.

I love America, and argue against her critics a lot.* Some of the folks on this forum will attest to that.

Can I fit Fred's entire column?* Let's try... just to make sure you read it.
Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Children At The Helm
June 18, 2005

The crumbling has begun, methinks. Congressmen, a few only now, speak of withdrawal from Iraq. A small thing, but for the White House a worrisome step toward vertebracy in that body of polyps. The numbers of the dissenting will grow as they see that they do not get hurt. Military recruiting is way down, and will stay down: The gullibility of the young cannot forever be relied upon. The House has summoned the courage to vote against parts of the Patriot Act. The president’s polls drop and drop.

The crumbling has begun, methinks.

Is this surprising? If I may risk repeating myself tiresomely, the way to defeat the American military is to avoiding giving it clear targets, keep the body bags flowing into Dover or Travis, and wait. It is that simple. The insurgents know this. They are doing it, and it is working. Five Marines today, three tomorrow, twelve GIs one week, nine another. On and on. So far we have killed 1700 of our soldiers, closing in on 2000. Sooner or later, even Middle America will notice.

Is victory still possible, if it ever war? The military can’t stop the bleeding, or it would have. Short of a miracle, of perhaps a serious attack within the United States, actually or apparently by terrorists, the casualties will continue. The public will weary of the war, and it will all be over. No?

Wars are marketed as involving moral principles or geo-strategic necessity, but they can become grudge matches, contests of vanity grown stubborn. A president who has led his country into a war has his ego on the line. He cannot easily say, “In the light of events, the adventure appears to have failed, and so we will return home.” The world would regard him as a fool and a knave. Further, humble men do not become presidents. Such a man will struggle on desperately, unwisely, with no real purpose any longer than to avoid the personal ignominy of defeat. When his pride has been engaged he can’t stop. For this men die.

One sees a similar approach in the gambler who, having lost his car, bets his house in hopes of redeeming himself.

As the news worsens the lying, begun long ago, increases. Democracies of course have to be lied into aggressive wars, since no one really cares about the form of government in an obscure and remote nation. Thus as losses mount, the enemy’s successes are described as defeats, as the last throes of a failing force. (I would not be surprised to find that Tokyo described the bombing of Hiroshima as a sign of American desperation.) The government forbids reporters to photograph the coffins, punishes soldiers who talk to the press. The horribly wounded are discreetly hidden. Generals who are not upbeat are fired. Dissidents become labeled as traitors. War crimes become isolated incidents: Only those which are discovered have occurred. Etc.

Historians tend to see wars as consequent to abstract currents of history. They speak of the balance of power, the clash of civilizations, of economic rivalry, and it all sounds dispassionate, reasoned, and occasionally majestic. It might be more accurate to say that wars are the hobbies of half-informed children who have somehow come into possession of the levers of power. Can anyone possible believe that Mr. Bush knew anything about the Arab world when he set out to conquer it? That Hitler understood the Russians, or the Japanese Army, America?

Getting into wars is so often easier than getting out. In terms of national and presidential vanity, the prospects of Iraq, short always of a miracle, vary between bad and ghastly. If the United States pulls out, in a sort of exploitus reservatus, the One Remaining Superpower will be seen not to be. No one will be afraid of us any longer. In particular, countries like Iran will not be afraid. One wonders whether this may not be what Mr. bin Laden had in mind.

Of course in material terms the United States will not be weaker. If driven out of Iraq, America will still be superior in remarkable aircraft and fast carriers and extraordinary submarines. But submarines are of use only in certain kinds of wars, which the enemy will avoid. The good ship USS Thundertrinket can destroy Japan, yes. It cannot defeat a few thousand determined men with rifles. Militaries seem never to learn this.

It is curious. The French, having underestimated both the enemy and the potential of guerilla warfare, got thrashed at Dien Bien Phu. The Americans, equally full of themselves, then went into the same country and got similarly thrashed. The French, having learned nothing, tried again in Algeria, with the same result. The Israelis tried to hold down southern Lebanon, encountering the same problems and equally losing. The Russians, having seen all of this, invaded Afghanistan and got thrashed. Now the United States is in Iraq. For militaries, the learning curve seems to be flat.

The problem is not that soldiers are stupid. They are not. Rather it is (I think) that they become excessively taken with the technology and power of their weapons, with the computers and precision and speed, with themselves, and just do not stop to ponder the difficulty of killing hornets with a howitzer.

The future? Having restored the Vietnam complex, presumably the US will be very hesitant for a decade or so to throw its weight around. Then, having forgotten again, it will invade another country defended by only a few contemptible men with rifles who, in any case, will be expected to throw flowers.

If America loses the White House war—what? I suppose that Mr. Bin Laden will come out of his hole a hero in the Moslem world, laughing pointedly at Mr. Bush. I do not know what part he actually had in the events in New York, but he gets credit for them, which is enough. He would be able to say that he had goaded the Great Satan into a losing war in Arabia that left America defanged and no longer able to give orders to Moslem nations. Isn’t that what he set out to do?

What price nothing? A couple of thousand dead kids, countless cripples who will remain crippled when the current administration has been forgotten, a country wrecked, God knows how many dead Iraqis (I know, they don’t count), thousands of sisters and mothers remembering Bobby every Christmas and looking at his last year book from high school, a tremendous diminution in America’s influence and prestige as China rises, unforeseeable consequences in the Middle East. For what, Mr. Bush? For what?
----
Now, I must get another glass of wine and watch San Antonio nuke Detroit.*
Not bad for a CHP

JG
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 09:03 PM   #32
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Notth
* Its insulting to my intelligence.
You are an easy target

JG
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 09:08 PM   #33
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U
You are an easy target
Welcome back, JG. I see you are refreshed and ready to take on...whatever.

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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 09:57 PM   #34
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MRGALT2U
You are an easy target
How very fortunate for you...
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 09:57 PM   #35
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

What is CHP?
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 09:57 PM   #36
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

cocktail hour post.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 10:00 PM   #37
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Thanks Notth,
I usually state in my posts how many glasses of wine I had. (The spelling errors are unaffected by wine.)
It never ceases to amaze me what people read into what is posted. That is why I try to keep it as simple as possible.

"Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 10:43 PM   #38
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Eh, I think a lot of people already have a lot of opinions formed and are simply waiting for someone to utter the right words that let them express that preformed opinion. So dont take it personally
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Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-19-2005, 11:53 PM   #39
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dex

Re: china - China does not have to attack the USA - it could attack Taiwan (we have a treaty to defend Taiwan)
Actually we don't have a treaty with Taiwan. We tell China that we won't tolerate reunification by force and at the same time tell Taiwan not to expect much help. Any kind of hard commitment from us to defend Taiwan would almost certainly provoke the island to declare "actual" indepenence, which China (as of this year) is now legislatively required to declare war over. It's a very tricky, delicate, and possibly dangerous balance.

Of course theres little doubt we would help out democratic Taiwan in the case of war with China, but how much is the subject of great debate. There's a whole range of scenarios from just selling them weapons to sending a few Navy ships to actual boots on the ground. I think the latter becomes less likely the further Iraq drags on.
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?
Old 06-20-2005, 07:41 AM   #40
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Re: Who Is Running This Choo-Choo Train?

Absolutely

I vote Democrat - no matter who the bum is - that's because the other guy is usually a Republican.

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