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09-21-2007, 07:50 AM
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#1
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,066
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would this bother you?
Moderators, feel free to remove this thread if you feel it is too controversial...
Yesterday I attended a work lunch. The CEO was present. After our entrees arrived, someone suggested the food be blessed. The CEO then offerred a prayer.
OK, so I am from the north, transplanted here in the deep South. This just would NEVER happen in the north. I just feel it is wrong to assume everyone has the same beliefs and/or impose your beliefs upon them, especially in a work situation. It's not that I'm not religious. However, what if I weren't? What if I was an aetheist, agnostic, or some other religion that wasn't Christian?
I feel there should be a separation of church and work, and that just isn't happenning here at all.
__________________
simple girl
less stuff, more time
(55, married; Mr. Simple Girl, 59. FIRED 12/31/19!)
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09-21-2007, 07:58 AM
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#2
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,085
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Sounds inappropriate to me. Also asking for a lawsuit.
__________________
"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."
- George Orwell
Ezekiel 23:20
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09-21-2007, 08:00 AM
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#3
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simple girl
Moderators, feel free to remove this thread if you feel it is too controversial...
Yesterday I attended a work lunch. The CEO was present. After our entrees arrived, someone suggested the food be blessed. The CEO then offerred a prayer.
OK, so I am from the north, transplanted here in the deep South. This just would NEVER happen in the north. I just feel it is wrong to assume everyone has the same beliefs and/or impose your beliefs upon them, especially in a work situation. It's not that I'm not religious. However, what if I weren't? What if I was an aetheist, agnostic, or some other religion that wasn't Christian?
I feel there should be a separation of church and work, and that just isn't happenning here at all.
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I think it's harmless, but the "deep South" is the "Bible Belt". Just don't pray along if you don't want to.....
__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)
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09-21-2007, 08:03 AM
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#4
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Central MS/Orange Beach, AL
Posts: 9,072
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Happens all the time in the south. Never bothered me though.
__________________
Retired 3/31/2007@52
Investing style: Full time wuss.
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09-21-2007, 08:03 AM
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#5
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 854
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This happens all of the time. For work, I have been to school board meetings, legislative meetings, and other similar events for public business. It always makes me uncomfortable, although most prayers in these settings are non-denominational, this is not always the case.
I am also a northern transplant - been in the south over 25 years. They don't call it the bible belt for nothing.
I cope by standing as others do, respectful, but not participating. Yea, I don't think it's appropriate, but I also don't think I'm going to change it - especially since I am usually present in a professional capacity. As long as no one insists I join in, I let them be as well.
__________________
I would not have anyone adopt my mode of living...but I would have each one be very careful to find out and pursue his own way, and not his father's or his mother's or his neighbor's instead. Thoreau, Walden
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09-21-2007, 08:12 AM
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#6
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,005
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I think evil thoughts to counteract all the positive thoughts that come from the folks praying.
Seriously, I experience this 1-2 times/yr at our company thanksgiving dinner and the like. I always feel a little uncomfortable since the prayer doesn't reflect my personal faith. But some of my coworkers (whom I respect) do practice this particular brand of faith, so I don't mind too much. I just spend the 30-60 seconds of prayer making my "plan of attack" on the catered buffet line. Well, either that or thinking in my mind what I am thankful for. I'd say get over it, suck it up, and move on.
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09-21-2007, 08:18 AM
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#7
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-Central Illinois
Posts: 3,228
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Been there, done that. Doesn't bother me. If I went somewhere and a Buddhist monk, or a Hindi, or whatever, did something similar, that wouldn't bother me either. My only concern would be that they keep it "short-n-sweet"......don't want that food to get cold!!!
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09-21-2007, 08:27 AM
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#8
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 8,827
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Yes, it would and has bothered me. The question is whether "doing something about it" is worth the effort. In the workplace, it may well be inappropriate, but I share Sandy's coping strategy.
It used to bother me more, but gradually I realized that it probably isn't intended the way I perceived it. The underlying (if inaccurate) perception is that everyone present believes in God and group prayer and a silent blessing is a generic gesture. It doesn't feel "generic" to me, it feels decidedly religious.
I just wait it out, don't join in, don't close my eyes, and hope the break put everyone in a good mood. I try to think of it like a toast. But I'd be happier skipping it at work.
If I'm a guest at someone's house, I try to at least appear more sensitive and respectful to the host's wishes. One time we had a dinner party and one of our guests attempted (at our house) to initiate blessings before dinner (something we do not do); now that's awkward. Managed to mumble something about if anyone wants a moment of reflection, feel free while I get the string beans.
I harbor no hostility or disrespect over these matters, just wish others would be more aware that not everyone shares their spiritual routines.
__________________
Rich
San Francisco Area
ESR'd March 2010. FIRE'd January 2011.
As if you didn't know..If the above message contains medical content, it's NOT intended as advice, and may not be accurate, applicable or sufficient. Don't rely on it for any purpose. Consult your own doctor for all medical advice.
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09-21-2007, 08:28 AM
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#9
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lawn chair in Texas
Posts: 14,183
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"Good food, good meat. Good Lord, let's eat!!"
__________________
Have Funds, Will Retire
...not doing anything of true substance...
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09-21-2007, 08:46 AM
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#10
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 13,566
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Done all the time here, I'm used to it, it just isn't a big deal. Well, unless someone asked me to do the prayer. Only then would I be uncomfortable. But I've worked for Habitat for Humanity and had a minister working for me, so I'm pretty much immune to being shocked by religious stuff at work. In fact, I started a morning prayer routine at work while I was there--gold star for Sarah--it was brought up as a plus in my review. I think the public prayer is pretty harmless, but I'm a native of the "belt".
I'm not a practicing anything, but I'm not really opposed to these kinds of religious observances. Welcome to the South! It is everywhere. I don't think I've ever been to a meeting of any sort of work organization (except the heathen sailing outfit--and they were from somewhere else--midwest, I think) that didn't have a prayer before meals. Never thought anything about it.
Interesting how others take offense to it--I do what Justin does--prepare my buffet strategy!
__________________
“One day your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it's worth watching.”
Gerard Arthur Way
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09-21-2007, 09:01 AM
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#11
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,005
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God, please bless this plastic spork so that it doesn't break and snap off as I'm trying to cut this honey-baked ham. Please look after me so the two ladle-fulls of gravy don't overflow the mashed potato crater Your munificence guided me to construct. Lord, please have mercy on that prime, white juicy turkey breast that's calling my name. Holy Father who art in heaven, give me the strength to return to the buffet line for bountiful seconds and gracious thirds. Please grant me the willpower to eat lots of desserts after three heaping plates of the main dishes. Lord, please protect this nice, clean white shirt of mine from the evil advances of errant cranberry sauce. In your name we pray, Amen.
(that's the prayer I'm going to offer after I know I've got my FIRE stash saved up. I'll be FIRE'd for sure after that...)
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09-21-2007, 09:09 AM
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#12
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Duesseldorf, Germany
Posts: 1,202
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To the insiders it looks harmless. But if you do not share the same religion you are left out for something that you cannot change without sacrificing your own religion.
And this in a situation - work - where by law you should not be discriminated for your
religious beliefs.
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09-21-2007, 09:11 AM
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#13
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Northern IL
Posts: 26,896
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Wow, I guess I've lived a sheltered life! I've NEVER experienced anything like this, and am a bit shocked that it is common in some areas.
Now, if they explained that they are a religious based organization at the interview, that would be one thing - accept it then.
Technically, if this makes you uncomfortable, it would seem to fit under some of the religious discrimination EEO laws. But unless you are prepared to make a martyr of yourself (ironic use of that term?), it's probably best to go with the flow.
I like justin's 'think evil thoughts' idea.
Quote:
God, please bless this plastic spork so that it doesn't break and snap off as I'm trying to cut this honey-baked ham.
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That is just too funny!
I'd probably take the time to mentally calculate my net worth and FIRE date.
-ERD50
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09-21-2007, 09:19 AM
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#14
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,895
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what is the difference between public prayer and masterbating in public or, might i bring back to the forum, sex in a public toilet? the difference is that public prayer is more obscene. why? because your relationship with god is even more personal than your sexual relationships.
when we live in a world ruled from the outside in, we live in a world which is all too often inside out. we would proselytize our faith before admitting to our sexuality. and we exchange our money before giving away our sex.
yet naturally we wear our sexuality out in the open upon our faces (the most sexual part of a naked body is the face), we keep our money in our pockets (where no one can see) and our gods in our hearts (where they belong). that is the natural order of things; not praying to god in either a public toilet or at a business lunch.
__________________
"off with their heads"~~dr. joseph-ignace guillotin
"life should begin with age and its privileges and accumulations, and end with youth and its capacity to splendidly enjoy such advantages."~~mark twain - letter to edward kimmitt 1901
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09-21-2007, 09:26 AM
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#15
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lazygood4nothinbum
praying to god in either a public toilet
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"Oh Gawd, please don't let the guy I am about to hit on in the next stall be a cop."
- Sen. Craig
__________________
"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."
- George Orwell
Ezekiel 23:20
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09-21-2007, 09:31 AM
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#16
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Gone but not forgotten
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 6,924
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Wasn't there something in the Bible about making a public show of prayer?
Of course, its real purpose is to remind everyone of their place in the power structure.
__________________
"Knowin' no one nowhere's gonna miss us when we're gone..."
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09-21-2007, 09:37 AM
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#17
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,105
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I agree it is not appropriate. It is just as inappopriate for management to discuss politics or display porno in the workplace.
Here is a suggestion - get a Yahoo email account and email the head of the Human Resourses dept with your concern. Tell him you do not feel comfortable giving your name or anyway for them to identify you.
__________________
Sometimes death is not as tragic as not knowing how to live. This man knew how to live--and how to make others glad they were living. - Jack Benny at Nat King Cole's funeral
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09-21-2007, 09:39 AM
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#18
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 18,085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dex
Here is a suggestion - get a Yahoo email account and email the head of the Human Resourses dept with your concern. Tell him you do not feel comfortable giving your name or anyway for them to identify you.
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Bad idea. Great way to ignite a witch hunt.
__________________
"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."
- George Orwell
Ezekiel 23:20
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09-21-2007, 09:40 AM
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#19
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,895
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brewer12345
"Oh Gawd, please don't let the guy I am about to hit on in the next stall be a cop."
- Sen. Craig
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now that's funny! talk about a smorgasbord.
__________________
"off with their heads"~~dr. joseph-ignace guillotin
"life should begin with age and its privileges and accumulations, and end with youth and its capacity to splendidly enjoy such advantages."~~mark twain - letter to edward kimmitt 1901
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09-21-2007, 09:46 AM
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#20
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 47,500
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I wouldn't like it especially (being agnostic), but to me it is No Big Deal.
Personally I'd just bow my head (out of respect for others' beliefs) but would not mutter along with the prayer, and afterwards just let it go.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities. - - H. Melville, 1851.
Happily retired since 2009, at age 61. Best years of my life by far!
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