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Old 09-29-2008, 08:44 PM   #21
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Yes. Thank God you didn't retire this year!


No sh#&!

I've pointed that out to myself more than once in the last week or two.
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Old 09-29-2008, 08:47 PM   #22
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I've pointed that out to myself more than once in the last week or two.
...and 37 times today - so far.
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Old 09-29-2008, 08:49 PM   #23
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Absolutely! Here's my positive......


But, hell, no need to worry about that anymore. I know now I can run out of money very, very easily even if I don't live so long. Sooooo...... hey time to renew my acquaintance with a coupleof old friends from down at the pub that I've been missing:
Sounds like a plan. It's greasy fries and cheese burgers from now on. Gonna cut out the cholesterol pill too.
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Old 09-29-2008, 08:56 PM   #24
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Maybe America's capital, talented people, and corporate focus will return to doing "real things"--producing actual products (that people want to buy), and performing valuable services (that actually improve lives). For the last 10 years or so we've focused on arbitrage, hedging, making money from the ever-expanding financial house of cards, etc. We'll be better off when our economy returns to making, marketing, and delivering readily explainable and understood goods and services. Maybe the folks who do these things won't be thought of as throwbacks or suckers who just are too clueless to have discovered how to make money in the "new economy."
I agree with this totally. Also,

Our financial firms will stop exporting CDOs (doubt that international investors would buy them anyway)

Also, people our age will take a hit in the stock market, but maybe the younger generation will see what happened and create a society that is built on production and not upon debt.
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:31 PM   #25
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...and 37 times today - so far.
Thanks for the reminder -- make it 38.

But I'm not one to gloat (it is not a good idea in my particular line of work), and no doubt something like this will strike again during the course of a hopefully long retirement, maybe even a few times. Granted, there is much reassurance in still being in the work force, but at the moment I happen to be on the lucky side of the fence; my day will come (soon, I hope), so my hat's off to those just a small bit ahead of me.

When I imagine how I would be reacting to this had I just retired, I see myself more worried, tightening the belt, wishing I'd worked just one more year... but all of that in moderation. I think my Buckets type plan is reassuring to me.

Meantime I'm mentally filing all this away so that when it strikes again I'll remember not to panic, to stay the course, and have faith that sooner or later it will cycle back.
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:32 PM   #26
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I agree with this totally. Also,

Our financial firms will stop exporting CDOs (doubt that international investors would buy them anyway)

Also, people our age will take a hit in the stock market, but maybe the younger generation will see what happened and create a society that is built on production and not upon debt.
People seem unaware that modern finance is truly global and the products are so esoteric, and interdependent with other products, so that events in one sector of finance could have serious consequences throughout the system. Derivatives and hedge funds come to mind. Pay attention to how the two European banks were resolved this weekend along with Wachovia. Mortgage backed securities, which have been around almost 40 years, are simple products in the current world of modern finance, and yet they have gummed up the system.

Credit is the engine of the financial system -- once it becomes limited or unavailable, all bets are off.
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:49 PM   #27
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... I think my Buckets type plan is reassuring to me....
-
YES!
Remember the sign in the donut shop:

"As you voyage along through life, let this be your goal,
always look upon the donut and not upon the hole."

So as a recent retiree I say,

Always look upon the buckets and
not upon the water sloshing out of them.
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:50 PM   #28
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I'd add
- frugality might become all the rage. Waste not, want not. I wouldn't feel like such a weirdo!
Perhaps a 15 year old beater car will be like a badge of honor or a status symbol ("I'm more LBYM than you are!") Keeping "down" with the Jones so to speak.

At the very least, I hope to see more people actually consider affordability when they purchase a home and keep the payment % a reasonable amount of their household income. I'll bet most lenders are going to abolish the practice of giving borrowers enough rope to hang themselves.
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:55 PM   #29
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Sounds like a plan. It's greasy fries and cheese burgers from now on. Gonna cut out the cholesterol pill too.
Hey, if your stash goes down you can either cut spending or shorten your life span.

Cinnabons with bacon in them, anyone?
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Old 09-29-2008, 09:58 PM   #30
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Here two positives that stick out for me:

- it's nice seeing some of the folks who aided and abetted this mess (e.g., Paulson) squirming in the spotlight. Of course they still probably go home to sleep on silk sheets in their mansions, but still.

- it's a healthy reminder that in the long run, money is a material possession that can disappear even quicker than it appears, despite your best efforts. Treat it wisely, but don't invest your well-being and security in it.
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Old 09-29-2008, 10:06 PM   #31
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Well I did 2 things. First I looked up financial panics in the US. I looks like we had one in , 1785, 1792,1819,1837, 1857, Then we had that little unpleasantness that destroyed most of the Southern United States, then again in 1857,1873, 1884, 1890, 1893, 1909, then another little space in there from 1930 through1933 with lots of bank failures. Then we had a little shootem up that lasted from 1941-1945, Then that little inflation deal in the the 1970's, the RTC/ S&L deal n the early 80's and some stock market whoopty doos in 1987 and again in 2000. This whole thing in starting to look to me like a perfectly normal economic cycle.

The second thing that I did was figure out how much debt the House saved me by not passing this bail out. lets see $2300/ person x 4 = $9200.00. I feel rich. I might Trade my old jeep in for a new one. They will pass some thing so my only chance to keep the money out of their hand in to spend it. Yahoo! DIE BROKE!
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Old 09-29-2008, 10:06 PM   #32
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Hey, if your stash goes down you can either cut spending or shorten your life span.

Cinnabons with bacon in them, anyone?
If you want to shorten your life span using bacon, this could be the ultimate meal. If I was on death row and facing execution, this may be my choice for the last meal.

Thrillist : Fool's Gold Loaf
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Old 09-29-2008, 10:09 PM   #33
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As a man who ate several pounds of greasy meat from a smoker yesterday, I'm unimpressed by a sandwich full of peanut butter and jelly
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Old 09-29-2008, 10:29 PM   #34
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But I'm not one to gloat (it is not a good idea in my particular line of work), and no doubt something like this will strike again during the course of a hopefully long retirement, maybe even a few times. Granted, there is much reassurance in still being in the work force, but at the moment I happen to be on the lucky side of the fence; my day will come (soon, I hope), so my hat's off to those just a small bit ahead of me.
On another positive, we'll all die one day. So, one way or another, we all eventually have a way out of this mess. Many years down the road, as you lie on your death bed, you can look back and say "I'm glad I worked that one more year when the market seemed bad for a bit."
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Old 09-30-2008, 01:12 AM   #35
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The only other thing I could do is cut out golf. That's the only thing I spend money on. Might as well go back to work.
No no no, this is the time to perfect your short game to take advantage of all those guys in the financial business who are hoping to double down on the golf course this weekend. Their overconfidence could keep you in greens fees for a long time!

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Thanks for the reminder -- make it 38.
But I'm not one to gloat (it is not a good idea in my particular line of work), and no doubt something like this will strike again during the course of a hopefully long retirement, maybe even a few times.
Speaking of your line of work, it probably takes about two microseconds there to put the stock market in its true perspective.
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Old 09-30-2008, 06:53 AM   #36
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I thought of something else that is positive about yesterday's market plunge.

It was very instructive and a big help as an asset allocation testing tool. As we all know, it is hard to nail down a perfect asset allocation. Often people allocate too much to the equity side, and get frightened and sell low when the market drops.

Well, those of us that did not sell low out of panic know that our asset allocation is probably sufficiently conservative. The odds are that we will not see a more severe one day drop in the future.

Hope I didn't "jinx" the market by saying that!

(Now that we have all tested our asset allocations, it can go back up, thankyouverymuch.)
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:01 AM   #37
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I thought of something else that is positive about yesterday's market plunge.

It was very instructive and a big help as an asset allocation testing tool. As we all know, it is hard to nail down a perfect asset allocation. Often people allocate too much to the equity side, and get frightened and sell low when the market drops.

Well, those of us that did not sell low out of panic know that our asset allocation is probably sufficiently conservative. The odds are that we will not see a more severe one day drop in the future.

Hope I didn't "jinx" the market by saying that!

(Now that we have all tested our asset allocations, it can go back up, thankyouverymuch.)
Lord help us. The kiss of death. I'm playing golf today. Come home, go to bed and hopefully get in a good nap. Do not plan to look at the market until well after it closes. At least that's the plan.
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:16 AM   #38
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Here are some positive things that came to mind:

-Less "McMansions"
-Less interest in material goods like fancy cars and TVs
-More concern about friends, family and community
-More interest in helping our country be better
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:22 AM   #39
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Lord help us. The kiss of death. I'm playing golf today. Come home, go to bed and hopefully get in a good nap. Do not plan to look at the market until well after it closes. At least that's the plan.
Well, at least I didn't post a thread beginning with "Whee!!!"

Good plan, in either case, by the way.

Yesterday I lost 3.42% of the value of my entire portfolio. Today is supposed to be worse! I suspect the market might surprise everyone and go up, though. We shall see.

Meanwhile, that nice Wellesley dividend last week is reassuring, even though it doesn't come anywhere near making up for the drop in the market. The guys at Wellesley could have sent out a smaller dividend than they did, and used the rest to buoy up the share price. They didn't, though, which must be a huge relief for those who are already retired and need that money for groceries.
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:26 AM   #40
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Awww...we're still alive and will get thru this, too, is my attitude. (And, boy! am I ever glad I planned to start some kind of business when my family duty is done here, anyway. What a drag all this would be if I hated to work...)
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