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04-26-2017, 09:11 AM
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#21
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: May 2011
Location: St. Paul
Posts: 1,847
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Hmmm...every thread I read sways me either one way or the other way about renewing my LTC insurance policy. Now I think I should do it, despite the premium rise. Honestly, there's just no good answer to this dilemma!
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04-26-2017, 10:28 AM
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#22
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50
It's worth noting that you have a far higher net worth than many on this forum. That kind of expense just might not be possible for many here.
-ERD50
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Yes, I understand that. Nevertheless, $90k per year isn't exactly chump change for me either.
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04-26-2017, 10:36 AM
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#23
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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I did worry about how my mother would finance years of high quality long term care. She would have had liquid assets sufficient to pay for several years, but most of her net worth was in her house, which she adamantly refused to sell. As it happened, her illness and infirmity was relatively short, months rather than years. Fortunately, I was w*rking during that time. I would gladly have worked longer to pay her expenses, but only if she had been willing to liquidate her own assets. Had she insisted on keeping the empty house while I spent down my retirement savings, I think that would have been a major source of conflict between us.
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04-26-2017, 10:49 AM
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#24
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadbh
I did worry about how my mother would finance years of high quality long term care. She would have had liquid assets sufficient to pay for several years, but most of her net worth was in her house, which she adamantly refused to sell. As it happened, her illness and infirmity was relatively short, months rather than years. Fortunately, I was w*rking during that time. I would gladly have worked longer to pay her expenses, but only if she had been willing to liquidate her own assets. Had she insisted on keeping the empty house while I spent down my retirement savings, I think that would have been a major source of conflict between us.
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Yes, I can see how it would, especially if you had siblings. I made it very clear to my sibs (and my mother) that I would only pay her expenses once all her assets were gone. Otherwise I would be effectively giving the funds to my sibs. Everybody understood and agreed.
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04-26-2017, 10:55 AM
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#25
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53
DH and I discussed getting a divorce on paper because he was 15 years older but we never could make ourselves do it.
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I don't really think I could make myself do it either.
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04-26-2017, 10:59 AM
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#26
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 158
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It's one thing to help someone out if they have put some effort into planning and tried to be responsible and just fell on hard times...it's harder when you have watched someone make bad decisions their whole life and then they expect you to take care of them. That's just so much harder for me to reconcile.
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Are you figuring in the cost of taking care of an aging parent or spouse?
04-26-2017, 11:31 AM
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#27
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 7,322
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Are you figuring in the cost of taking care of an aging parent or spouse?
I agree. I'm a bit concerned about DS' in-laws. Nice people, hard-working, good grandparents, but I suspect pretty modest means. I hope DS and DDIL don't have to prop them up financially in old age. Right now I'd guess they're in their late 50s and both working.
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04-26-2017, 11:39 AM
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#28
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 7,001
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When I put my friend in a home I chose because it was a decent place with good care for half the price then in our town. The only down side is that she is an hour drive away. I also made sure that the home would take Medicaid once her level of care increased. About a year later her rent doubled and she qualified for Medicaid as long as she did not half more then 2k in the bank. Once she ran out of $ the home did not get paid the fulla mount until Medicaid kicked in.
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04-26-2017, 11:41 AM
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#29
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danmar
Yes, I can see how it would, especially if you had siblings. I made it very clear to my sibs (and my mother) that I would only pay her expenses once all her assets were gone. Otherwise I would be effectively giving the funds to my sibs. Everybody understood and agreed.
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I have no siblings.
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04-26-2017, 12:07 PM
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#30
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 6,129
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For parents it mostly has not been an impact. Dad and FIL both died after short (6 month) cancer battles. Mom had a decline of about 18 months, but since thankfully her mind stayed sound and it was more her body wearing down rather than cancer, we were able to hire a day nurse for that time. With that, Mom living with one of my sisters who was happy to take care of her, and me and 5 other siblings able to step in at various times to help, it was manageable and not that costly, particularly when split 7 ways.
For MIL we have no plans... she is 86 but in very good health, and has money. In fact, enough to have DW's siblings still dependent on her. What will likely play out is that they will fight to take care of her when she declines... with the goal, after she dies, of claiming all of her money and assets are now theirs because they took care of her. That is what played out to some degree with DW's father.
__________________
FIREd date: June 26, 2018 - "This Happy Feeling, Going Round and Round!" (GQ)
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04-26-2017, 12:41 PM
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#31
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 9,358
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I'm conservative in retirement spending compared to what we could spend based on most of the retirement calculators in order to cover our LTC costs or needing to help out relatives in general. I have friends who ended up raising grandchildren for one reason or another, one with early onset Alzheimer's, one couple now both need specialized care of different kinds for age related disabilities, and other friends who have a special needs grandchild who hadn't even been born yet when they retired. I probably won't be able to get a tech job again when I'm 80, so I think it is good to keep a savings buffer for these kinds of situations, since the odds of something big and expensive happening over 40 years are not small.
__________________
Even clouds seem bright and breezy, 'Cause the livin' is free and easy, See the rat race in a new way, Like you're wakin' up to a new day (Dr. Tarr and Professor Fether lyrics, Alan Parsons Project, based on an EA Poe story)
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04-26-2017, 01:16 PM
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#32
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 25,299
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For us both of our parents have passed away so taking care of them is not an issue anymore. It was for FIL in large part because he did not want to face the reality of growing frail and wanted to stay in his house. We could see it coming and at least persuaded him to go with us to an elder law attorney. He pointed out that a local (to FIL) CCRC was about to open a large new apartment building that had wiped out the waiting list and still had a dozen or so apartments available. He qualified for that in independent living and they admitted him. In this CCRC if you run out of assets they will not kick you out but you have to have enough to private pay for a year or so. He spent one night in the apartment and then DW took him to the emergency room the next day because he was sleeping so much.
It turned out he had very high sugar levels (he was diabetic being treated with drugs) and that had done so much damage he couldn't walk and was then admitted to full nursing care. I was so grateful that my mother had bought into a similar CCRC about eleven years before she passed. She took part in many of the activities and had a great time before she had to move to assisted living, and stayed there for about six months before passing.
We learned the lessons and are currently on a waiting list for a CCRC just over the PA state line. This one also will not kick you out if assets are exhausted. Hopefully neither of us will need assisted living or full nursing care before then. This is one reason we're both going to the gym every other day and go on walks on days when we don't go to the gym.
__________________
When I was a kid I wanted to be older. This is not what I expected.
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04-26-2017, 01:55 PM
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#33
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Flyover country
Posts: 25,198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt34
Hopefully neither of us will need assisted living or full nursing care before then. This is one reason we're both going to the gym every other day and go on walks on days when we don't go to the gym.
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IMHO that's the best health plan you could have.
Check this gal out:
World Masters Games: Man Kaur wins 100m gold -- aged 101
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04-26-2017, 01:57 PM
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#34
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 40,581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dixonge
For us, we'd rather live our final years in Mexico. Amazing care, 3 meals a day, $900-2000/month. That's just in the expat area we prefer. I'm sure there are many areas that would be cheaper. Or other countries, even.
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This is not a bad alternative, but it does have risks. One is the cost of living increases significantly over the next decade, and then stays high. Another is the country just goes all to heck. If anyone thinks this can't happen, our plan was to retire in Venezuela, we already the property where we would live, and had everything in place to move back.
I think spending one's final years abroad, in a low cost of living area, is a good option for some, but you need to have a plan B.
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04-26-2017, 02:00 PM
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#35
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 25,299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by braumeister
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Impressive!
__________________
When I was a kid I wanted to be older. This is not what I expected.
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04-26-2017, 03:10 PM
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#36
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: New York City
Posts: 2,838
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your adding to fake news
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB
With all due respect, this is one area where laws and such make a big difference, and each state has its own regulatory system. So advice here needs to consider the laws of location and specific circumstances of the OP and should be reinforced with elder care legal advice.
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u cut out my quote that included your statement that criticized mine
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04-26-2017, 03:15 PM
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#37
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 40,581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Collar Guy
u cut out my quote that included your statement that criticized mine
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If I misunderstood your post, please feel free to correct me. But the "fake news" comment is unnecessary.
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Are you figuring in the cost of taking care of an aging parent or spouse?
04-26-2017, 04:08 PM
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#38
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 3,024
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Are you figuring in the cost of taking care of an aging parent or spouse?
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylatedollarshort
I'm conservative in retirement spending compared to what we could spend based on most of the retirement calculators in order to cover our LTC costs or needing to help out relatives in general...
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+1 We have no specific plans for these costs, but this is the primary reason we're being conservative with spending early on, about 35% below FIRECalc at 95%. We have no LTC insurance for ourselves. But more imminently, the in-laws are both in their mid 80s, poor health, and dwindling assets. They are increasingly reliant on us for nearly everything... driving, coordinating with doctors, managing money, communicating with the lawn guys, taking the correct pills on time, changing light bulbs, setting the thermostat, to name a few.
They started off quite well... retired early-ish (~60) and traveled the world extensively until multiple health issues slowed them down in their late 70s. They now live on SS and withdrawals from his IRA, which is down to about $100K. They downsized to a modest house and have a small life insurance policy for him. But still, if one or both required assisted living or nursing care for any length of time, they would exhaust those assets very quickly.
We've done some cursory research into Medicaid and other forms of financial assistance available in Texas. DW cringes every time I mention Medicaid. I think she just has trouble envisioning her parents as destitute and dependent on government assistance. I think she'd rather just pay the shortfall ourselves along with possible help from her one sibling. For now, we're just playing it by ear and hoping for the best, while being conservative on our own retirement spending, just in case.
__________________
Retired at 52 in July 2013. On to better things...
AA: 85/15 WR: 2.7% SI: 2 pensions, SS later
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04-26-2017, 04:20 PM
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#39
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 7,001
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Being on Medicaid does not mean you will be in a bad place. Both my grandmas were in the same nursing home. One paid her way and one went on Medicaid when her $ ran out.
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04-26-2017, 07:36 PM
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#40
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 235
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DH is 7 years older than me. I am curious how this works if he needed 24hr care. Do we have to spend down my 401k too before qualifying for Medicaid or just his 401 and joint accounts?
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