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Old 09-26-2014, 10:27 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by luckydude View Post

I have a retirement account at Fidelity so I decided to call Fidelity and find out what verifications they perform for redemption requests. It turns out that other than SSN, address and birth date information, Fidelity really doesn’t do any other verification, which is more than a little disconcerting to me. So if a fraudster has someone’s SSN, address and birth date, he/she could conceivable just call up Fidelity and ask that an account be liquidated.

Your thoughts?
You would have to set up a bank account with the name, address, birthdate, and SSN before you called Fidelity for the transfer. So it's not quite as simple as just calling Fidelity and asking for a transfer. Not that an organized crime person could not set up such an account by forging a bunch of documents. But Joe Blow fraudster wouldn't be able to do that so easily.
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Old 09-26-2014, 10:45 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I don't think I've ever been in a state where my SSN is on my license. My address is though. If the SSN was on there, a quick photo would be the way for someone to get it, because afterward they'd have more time to read zoom in on the photo and read the data.

Edit: I googled DL images and see that Missouri does put the SSN on. That's pretty stupid. Really stupid, because not only are you exposing it every time you check in at an airport, or at a bar (if you're somewhat young) or other places where ID is asked for, if you lose your wallet or it is stolen your identify is also at very serious risk.

I didn't check every state, but the 15 or so I did first didn't have it.
MO. offers a non-SSN number and suggests you do that. Been availble since last century. IIRC.

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Old 09-26-2014, 10:52 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I don't think I've ever been in a state where my SSN is on my license. My address is though. If the SSN was on there, a quick photo would be the way for someone to get it, because afterward they'd have more time to read zoom in on the photo and read the data.

Edit: I googled DL images and see that Missouri does put the SSN on. That's pretty stupid. Really stupid, because not only are you exposing it every time you check in at an airport, or at a bar (if you're somewhat young) or other places where ID is asked for, if you lose your wallet or it is stolen your identify is also at very serious risk.

In MO, you have the option (which I use) to have a separate Driver's License number in lieu of SSN.


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Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
I didn't check every state, but the 15 or so I did first didn't have it.

From Social Security History

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Use of the SSN in State drivers license systems is already authorized by Federal law, and 29 States currently use the SSN as the drivers license number or show it on the license. The 1996 immigration reform provision on improved identification-related documents requires the SSN to be included on State drivers licenses by the year 2000. Thus, the drivers license and Social Security card can both be used to verify the SSN.
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Old 09-26-2014, 10:57 AM   #24
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Did you close your account?
I did not because it's a 401(k) account with my current employer. But since I will FIRE early next year, I plan to roll the account into Vanguard.

I just didn't get the warm and fuzzy from the rep I talked to. Aside from verifying SSN, address and birth date, the rep told me that "we would become suspicious if, for example, we heard paper shuffling on the background as if someone is looking up the information." That's just not what I wanted to hear as a method of fraud detection.
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Old 09-26-2014, 10:57 AM   #25
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An easy fix: either scratch out or put a sticker over the SSN.
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Old 09-26-2014, 10:57 AM   #26
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For a normal withdrawal, transfer, liquidation, etc., Fidelity requires the receiving bank account to have the same name. And they spend some time verifying this too, which is why adding a linked account online usually takes 10 business days.

For a wire transfer (not a liquidation) to another entity you have to fax in a form and they at least compare to your signature on file.
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Agree, something doesn't sound quite right about what OP's friend told him.
+2 I can't recall with Fidelity, but I know with Vanguard (and I assume it is the same/similar), they require the name/s to match on the bank account, and they go through a verification process on that account before they will transfer money. And I get email updates on any of this activity.

Now, if the person was able to open a bank account with a name matching your Fidelity account (and maybe they could, if they already had your SS and other info?), maybe they could pull this off. But that is more of an identity theft issue than a lapse on Fidelity's part, I think. And I would be very concerned about the potential identity theft.

And unless they hi-jacked your email as well, you should be getting notices of this sort of activity.

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Old 09-26-2014, 11:04 AM   #27
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For a normal withdrawal, transfer, liquidation, etc., Fidelity requires the receiving bank account to have the same name. And they spend some time verifying this too, which is why adding a linked account online usually takes 10 business days.

For a wire transfer (not a liquidation) to another entity you have to fax in a form and they at least compare to your signature on file.
Thanks for the info. Unfortunately the rep didn't mention this to me. If this is standard policy then I feel much better about leaving my money with Fidelity.
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:11 AM   #28
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I'm shocked that the bank told your friend anything about the name and SSN (even if simply confirming it wasn't hers) of the other account.
I was too but my friend is a big wig in corporate finance and is by nature very aggressive and persistent. I am sure she gave the bank rep an earful and badgered the rep into submission.
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:13 AM   #29
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I also don't see how the friend got the target bank account number.
That was given to her by Fidelity, which asked her to confirm the bank account number.
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:22 AM   #30
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Additionally you can get RSA secureid key which one needs to use in addition to password when login online.

I would not open account without RSA key and I know Fidelity will not give you one while Schwab will.
That's a good idea. I'm going to call Schwab and get one of those.

One thing I don't like about Schwab is that they seem to insist on a physical address as your mailing address. There's been some instances of mail theft in my neighborhood, and even my locking mailbox has been broken into at least once, so I don't like correspondence coming to my house mailbox. I have a PO Box I use for everything, but Schwab won't accept PO Boxes as addresses.

Has anybody else run into this with them?
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:28 AM   #31
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That's a good idea. I'm going to call Schwab and get one of those.

One thing I don't like about Schwab is that they seem to insist on a physical address as your mailing address. There's been some instances of mail theft in my neighborhood, and even my locking mailbox has been broken into at least once, so I don't like correspondence coming to my house mailbox. I have a PO Box I use for everything, but Schwab won't accept PO Boxes as addresses.

Has anybody else run into this with them?
You can set up all communication via email account.

I feel MUCH safer when any communication to anybody in Schwab is verified with verbal password and any loging to acount is protected by hardware RSA key.

If I would login into YOUR Fidelity account and sell lets say 1 Million dollar of your securities.... How Happy would you be that they would send you an email about it

BTW Fidelity will not allow their employees to login without RSA key, yet for customers they will not provide it.
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:42 AM   #32
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Since its a 401k account it may well be a question of the way the 401k is set up. I know for my 401k you need a special password (its at vanguard), and you can't move money from the 401k to a regular account directly.
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Old 09-26-2014, 06:57 PM   #33
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As rep working world wide, I had a RSA security fob to access Megacorp VPN. My Schwab security fob is made by VASCO.

The RSA fob had an expiration date printed on it, we would replace fobs every couple years, the Vasco does not have a date on it. I will ask for a new fob ever couple years, being locked out when you were overseas was not fun.
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Old 09-26-2014, 08:20 PM   #34
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Additionally you can get RSA secureid key which one needs to use in addition to password when login online.

I would not open account without RSA key and I know Fidelity will not give you one while Schwab will.
May be you have both firms mixed up. Fidelity does provide added security. I use VIP access from Symantec which I need to enter after my normal login into Fidelity. VIP is a free app I run on my iPhone which regenerates keys every 30 seconds. I tried to get the same from Schwab but it was not available.
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Old 09-26-2014, 08:49 PM   #35
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According to this article some offer a token and some dont:

http://thefinancebuff.com/security-t...ab-etrade.html

Looks like more are going to this model. Maybe I'll give a call. Of course these tokens are just a tool, really depends how the security is implemented.

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Old 09-27-2014, 05:50 AM   #36
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According to this article some offer a token and some dont:

Protect Your Investment Accounts With A Security Token: Fidelity, Schwab, E*Trade

Looks like more are going to this model. Maybe I'll give a call. Of course these tokens are just a tool, really depends how the security is implemented.

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Yes that is what I had on my mind. BTW Etrade offers hardware token similar to Schwab.

I really prefer stand alone hardware key which hangs on your key chain. Maybe I am old fashioned. And that is exactly why on numerous posts I recommended either Schwab or Etrade for brokerage account.

When I called FIDO I was told they do not offer such account protection....but this may had changed. (Though I don't want software app on iphone, but stand alone hardware key)

As a Software Engineer I trust such hardware key most......
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Old 09-27-2014, 08:54 AM   #37
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.....snip... good stuff.....

As a Software Engineer I trust such hardware key most......
I do too. I've done in depth reviews of some implementations of a few providers, couple of years ago(none that were mentioned in the article). A percentage had big enough security holes, you could throw a cat through them(no cats were actually harmed).
I guess as consumers it's up to us to keep demanding better security. FYI in the comments section phone #'s of what group to contact were provided. Best wishes.
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