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Old 09-16-2014, 10:09 AM   #321
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Totally agree.



But there's another (more likely IMO) explanation. Since BMW's are seen as status symbols, some status seeking jerks will buy them if they can scrape up the money for a lease. These same people would be jerks if they didn't have the BMW.

And to be clear, I'm saying jerks may be attracted to BMWs, not that people who drive BMWs are jerks in general.

-ERD50
While this may be true, the other assertion about people who drive BMWs certainly doesn't fit my observation. I'm out walking on city streets often. BMW drivers, like most drivers of nice cars, respect the crosswalks. Who do I fear? Somebody driving an older American piece of junk with various dents all over the metal.

I did get t-boned in a 4-way stopped intersection while I still had a car, by a BMW. But it was driven by a felon. A drunk ilegal who with his 15 year old blond gf had stolen it minutes before. The car was tangled with mine, and the perps took off running and hid in a parking lot where they were apprehended by the SPD, not that this helped me at all. My uninsured driver coverage did, so I had no deductible. The car was totaled, and I decided to try life without one.

Ha
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Old 09-16-2014, 10:46 AM   #322
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I've concluded that "Awkward Wealth" has more than one meaning after considering some of the replies in this long, long thread:

I find it interesting the rather large minority of posters that express feelings of superiority to others because of their own ability to “control” spending; and, the sense that anyone driving/living/wearing something expensive (which translates to better than what they are driving/living/wearing) has to be because the person is living above their means (and/or is a jerk) rather than they have more (significantly more) assets than you do.

Full disclosure: We own two BMWs, a Porsche and a Lotus; and by own I mean own, not leased, not financed, but bought and paid for without compromising our lifestyle one iota.

Helmet on, back in bunker, waiting for incoming…
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Old 09-16-2014, 10:55 AM   #323
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If you ever watch old TV shows from the late 50's and early 60's, if they want to depict someone as a playboy, trust fund baby, or just well-off, haughty D-bag, they tended to put them in a T-bird.

In fact, I recently caught the episode of "Make Room for Daddy" that served as a spin-off for "The Andy Griffith Show", and at the beginning of it, they show Danny pulling on-screen in a '59 T-bird, being brought into town by Sheriff Taylor for running a stop sign. And Danny Thomas was pretty mouthy in that episode, calling Andy a hayseed, pulling out a big wad of cash to pay the fine, and being dismissive in general.
I don't remember that one, probably a bit before my time (although I loved the Andy Griffith show as a kid).

Found the clip you were talking about here. Wow, he sure did mouth of

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Old 09-16-2014, 11:01 AM   #324
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Full disclosure: We own two BMWs, a Porsche and a Lotus; and by own I mean own, not leased, not financed, but bought and paid for without compromising our lifestyle one iota.

Helmet on, back in bunker, waiting for incoming…
Awww, the mention of a Lotus brings back great memories. When I worked on the farm, my dad's business partner had a Lotus. What a neat little car! He worked on it a lot, but it was his pride and joy, and a real head-turner in our town (he was quite the bachelor). He even had an engine shipped in for it, which he replaced himself, with much cursing!
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:09 AM   #325
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Seriously? Go tell all the underemployed college grads in the lost generation who live in their parents basement.

There are millions of workers who cannot buy a house or save properly for retirement due to job changing.

Good for you though. But job hopping isn't easy for everyone in the middle income range.
I know you would prefer living in a socialist worker's paradise, but just in case you can pry yourself away from the sob stories for a moment:

Yep, if you graduated into a recession, it sucks. I came out in the tail end of the early 90s recession and suffered for it as well. I delivered pizza for a while after graduating, then worked 3 or 4 sh!tty jobs (including the only job I was ever fired from) until the economy improved enough that people like early/mid 20s me could start getting a decent job. We moved to get to a much bigger job market and ended up living almost 2 years in my parents' house as a married couple (a joy, I can tell you). But you know what? I kept testing the market, going back to school at night, saving my pennies and being aggressive about moving on when a better opportunity showed up. Today's (spoiled) millenials will eventually get there, too. The ones with an ounce of common sense and drive will get there faster than their layabout peers that the media loves to highlight with all the sob stories.
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:11 AM   #326
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Awww, the mention of a Lotus brings back great memories. When I worked on the farm, my dad's business partner had a Lotus. What a neat little car! He worked on it a lot, but it was his pride and joy, and a real head-turner in our town (he was quite the bachelor). He even had an engine shipped in for it, which he replaced himself, with much cursing!
I am the off spring of a certified car nut. My dad, back in the early '60's had the third Lotus Elan imported into the US! And my dad, a man of style, had it in yellow! Thank you for reminding me of that memory!!
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Old 09-16-2014, 12:39 PM   #327
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I am the off spring of a certified car nut. My dad, back in the early '60's had the third Lotus Elan imported into the US! And my dad, a man of style, had it in yellow! Thank you for reminding me of that memory!!
Nice! I bet that yellow Elan was a beauty! The one I so admired was a red Esprit. He also had a newish (for the time, maybe mid 80s) Jaguar sedan that I got to borrow a few times...automotive highlight of my life! Alas, though, since I saw him work on both of them a lot, and curse Lucas Electric many, many times, it cured me of wanting one of my own.
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Old 09-16-2014, 01:00 PM   #328
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I had to "teach" zipper merging to a dude in a BMW SUV yesterday during rush hour. Seems that he was less willing to risk his paint job than I was on my old Chevy Blazer, lol.
Back when I was hauling a 5th wheel I drove a big black HD diesel F250........someone (a car driver) mentioned that Toronto drivers wouldn't let you into their lanes.........I said that I didn't have any problem, just flipped my indicator and changed lanes.
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Old 09-16-2014, 02:33 PM   #329
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I haven't ordered a pizza since I quit delivering back in 2001, but just out of curiosity, I checked an online menu. Papa John's is offering a deal with 2 large 2 topping pizzas, plus a 2-liter soda, for $25.00

I remember back in the day, in the store we'd often run a special of 2 large 1 topping pizza for $16.99 or $17.99. So factor in the cost of the extra toppings, as well as the soda, and the current special is probably priced similarly.

I still remember that with tax, those prices came out to $17.84 and $18.89, respectively. We tended to make more on the $16.99 special, because customers would often give us a twenty and say keep the change.
Heh that's funny, because I just got an email from Papa last week for 2-topping large pizzas @$7.77 each with promo code UGA (for football), good until 11/29/14. You do have to get two so it's $15.54 total, but I have no idea how they're making money at those prices.
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Old 09-16-2014, 02:46 PM   #330
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They probably are not making money if that is all you buy, but they hope you'll add some wings, soda, etc.
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Old 09-16-2014, 03:00 PM   #331
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Nice! I bet that yellow Elan was a beauty! The one I so admired was a red Esprit. He also had a newish (for the time, maybe mid 80s) Jaguar sedan that I got to borrow a few times...automotive highlight of my life! Alas, though, since I saw him work on both of them a lot, and curse Lucas Electric many, many times, it cured me of wanting one of my own.
My dad used to say that you wanted a car designed by Italians, built by Germans with manuals written by the British.
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Old 09-16-2014, 03:20 PM   #332
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I know you would prefer living in a socialist worker's paradise, but just in case you can pry yourself away from the sob stories for a moment:

Yep, if you graduated into a recession, it sucks. I came out in the tail end of the early 90s recession and suffered for it as well. I delivered pizza for a while after graduating, then worked 3 or 4 sh!tty jobs (including the only job I was ever fired from) until the economy improved enough that people like early/mid 20s me could start getting a decent job. We moved to get to a much bigger job market and ended up living almost 2 years in my parents' house as a married couple (a joy, I can tell you). But you know what? I kept testing the market, going back to school at night, saving my pennies and being aggressive about moving on when a better opportunity showed up. Today's (spoiled) millenials will eventually get there, too. The ones with an ounce of common sense and drive will get there faster than their layabout peers that the media loves to highlight with all the sob stories.
Sob stories. I don't think so. The media is just reporting the reality of "the new jobless recovery". Even Fox news acknowledges it(they blame Obama of course) It also effects the 50 something demographic.

20 years ago most college grads could easily find a good paying job(living wage).

In 2014 most college grads are having trouble just finding a full time job that pays $12hr. Things have changed since you finished college. Didn't you get
the memo? Its a global outsourced economy. Blah blah blah

So what is the student loan debt crisis a fake story also?

It sounds like you have done well for yourself.

The real funny thing is that many Americans work 3 jobs now. Just like you did.

So big deal. Working 3 jobs is the new normal.

Obviously some will do well with hard work and persistence like you did and I did also but in 2014 luck is a much bigger factor.
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Old 09-16-2014, 03:31 PM   #333
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And to be clear, I'm saying jerks may be attracted to BMWs, not that people who drive BMWs are jerks in general.

-ERD50
That's probably an accurate summation.
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Old 09-16-2014, 03:33 PM   #334
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I've concluded that "Awkward Wealth" has more than one meaning after considering some of the replies in this long, long thread:

I find it interesting the rather large minority of posters that express feelings of superiority to others because of their own ability to “control” spending; and, the sense that anyone driving/living/wearing something expensive (which translates to better than what they are driving/living/wearing) has to be because the person is living above their means (and/or is a jerk) rather than they have more (significantly more) assets than you do.

Full disclosure: We own two BMWs, a Porsche and a Lotus; and by own I mean own, not leased, not financed, but bought and paid for without compromising our lifestyle one iota.

Helmet on, back in bunker, waiting for incoming…
I just see a big car payment. I have 3 people on my street with new Mercedes and they did not pay cash.

It sounds like you can easily afford your cars.

I think most people would just admire your Porsche and ignore you.
When I see somebody in a Porsche I just think they have great taste in cars.
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Old 09-16-2014, 03:50 PM   #335
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We now have three BMWs. All paid for with cash.

Granted, the three of them together cost less than the cheapest new car you can buy and have an aggregate 785,000 miles. '89 325i, '97 318ti with California roof, and '00 528 wagon. Some people buy BMWs because they are great handling cars, which may be part of the reason BMW drivers appear to believe they are above the laws of man and physics. Almost always likely that the BMW is more capable than the pilot IMO.
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Old 09-16-2014, 04:10 PM   #336
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But you're a high income worker. Purplesky was referring to people who earn around $50K/yr. Take a factory worker for example. She may work her way up to $20/hr over 10 years. If she gets layed off she may have a hard time finding a similar job that will pay her even $12/hr. Not sure why it works that way for some professions and not for others. Some people, like you, can quit one job and get a raise by going to another company doing the same work. Factory workers and other similar jobs often have to start over at the starting pay for that new company which is probably not higher than what she was making after 10 years at the other company. It worked for you and that's great but doesn't work for everyone in the lower income jobs.
Yes I am talking about the average 50k income level for white and blue collar workers.

To build wealth at this income level you cannot afford long breaks from employment. Too many people lose their job and start over making much less pay. White collar workers are also hit hard.
If you have kids it gets really tough and people start the credit card trap.

Police,teachers,fireman,union workers,etc are in this ballpark income wise.
They could easily become a millionaire next door with investing discipline.

I remember when I made 50k and I was able to save 20% per year for retirement and it definitely helped to get my portfolio rolling.
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Old 09-16-2014, 04:25 PM   #337
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In 2014 most college grads are having trouble just finding a full time job that pays $12hr.
Link? I am sorry, but when you throw quality lines out like that, you should be able to point to a credible third party source.
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Old 09-16-2014, 05:07 PM   #338
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Originally Posted by LARS View Post
I've concluded that "Awkward Wealth" has more than one meaning after considering some of the replies in this long, long thread:

I find it interesting the rather large minority of posters that express feelings of superiority to others because of their own ability to “control” spending; and, the sense that anyone driving/living/wearing something expensive (which translates to better than what they are driving/living/wearing) has to be because the person is living above their means (and/or is a jerk) rather than they have more (significantly more) assets than you do.

Full disclosure: We own two BMWs, a Porsche and a Lotus; and by own I mean own, not leased, not financed, but bought and paid for without compromising our lifestyle one iota.

Helmet on, back in bunker, waiting for incoming…
Yes this is what many of us feel I guess it is because fact you have two BMWs and ...... "Room for a pony" very often does not translate into wealth. Those items will impress gas station attendants though .
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Old 09-16-2014, 05:16 PM   #339
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I saw him work on both of them a lot, and curse Lucas Electric many, many times
Ah, yes.

Lucas - Prince of Darkness - Lucas Electrical Humor Jokes
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Old 09-16-2014, 05:39 PM   #340
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While this may be true, the other assertion about people who drive BMWs certainly doesn't fit my observation. I'm out walking on city streets often. BMW drivers, like most drivers of nice cars, respect the crosswalks. Who do I fear? Somebody driving an older American piece of junk with various dents all over the metal.

Ha
I see you Ha as a bit older, well behaved California millionaire in nice Cadillac.... if you would splurge on car

In general people who splurge on Cadillac or Lexus are less of the snobs/show off types compared to BMW types and personally I would most likely associate with "real" money Cadillac drivers.

It is just my observation. I may be very wrong here.
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