Blogger Joe Udo says 25x expenses not enough for early-retirees

[purplesky]

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Originally Posted by rodi I see your point, but I think you're missing mine. Divorce can devastate one's finances and financial plans... especially if it's close to retirement age (or post retirement) so there isn't the time/means to recover. A housemate addresses the costs - but doesn't address the division of assets. We both have income streams that contribute to our retirement. I'm going to call us both retired.

Mrs. Retireby40 definitely allows mr retire by 40 to call himself retired by bringing her money and health insurance to the table.

A divorce would require mr retire by40 to go back to the corporate world again.

Together their numbers look pretty good.

[bclover]

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Originally Posted by Aerides A small side gig while retired can still be retired. It's if you DEPEND on that gig for income and spend hours approaching a full time job... then it's harder to call yourself retired.

Very true but I think that's part of my point. many of these blogs have such wildly (IMO) conditions that I wouldn't qualify them as retired (although I'm not expert). As another poster mentioned, I've read blogs giving "retirement" advice while the blogger admits that the spouses income is needed and they need her job for medical benefits.
Call me a skeptic but that's not retired, that's simply a one salary household. If it were that simply I could claim the years I was a stay at home mom, I was retired.

[Toocold]

Before being too judgmental and being overly critical here, you should read this link about the genesis of Joe's blog. He started the blog to answer the question to himself about whether he could retire by 40, not as a "how to" for others, but to document his personal journey. I read his blog and like it, as I figure out my personal path.

About Retire By 40

[FUEGO]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toocold Before being too judgmental and being overly critical here, you should read this link about the genesis of Joe's blog. He started the blog to answer the question to himself about whether he could retire by 40, not as a "how to" for others, but to document his personal journey. I read his blog and like it, as I figure out my personal path. About Retire By 40

Yeah, but it's easier to criticize others and bring them down (in spite of getting the details wrong!) than to actually understand what someone else is talking about or doing. Where's the fun in that?

[ExFlyBoy5]

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Originally Posted by FUEGO Yeah, but it's easier to criticize others and bring them down (in spite of getting the details wrong!) than to actually understand what someone else is talking about or doing. Where's the fun in that?

Preach it!

I have a few folks who have asked why I don't do a blog. Well, I have a number of reasons; but being judged incessantly by people I don't know is at the top of the list. And hey, I would like to *stay* retired, and obviously if I have a blog, then I am in NO WAY RETIRED!

So...Fuego...shouldn't you be getting BACK TO W*RK!?!?

[tmm99]

Although I try to keep my spending below 4% (and I am 57, so I am closer to the full retirement age compared to someone in the 40's...), I never understood this 4% SWR fully. Does that factor in social security benefits or it doesn't? I am thinking it doesn't include social security, since Firecalc (where I include my future social security, although I only include 77% of what they said I would get) tells me I can spend way over 4%. (Actually all planners I have used tell me I can spend more than 4%).

[W2R]

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Originally Posted by tmm99 Although I try to keep my spending below 4% (and I am 57, so I am closer to the full retirement age compared to someone in the 40's...), I never understood this 4% SWR fully. Does that factor in social security benefits or it doesn't? I am thinking it doesn't include social security, since Firecalc (where I include my future social security, although I only include 77% of what they said I would get) tells me I can spend way over 4%. (Actually all planners I have used tell me I can spend more than 4%).

Your SS is irrelevant; it is only taking your portfolio and withdrawals into consideration. Plus, your portfolio is to be invested with a specified AA and so on; here is more information.

I'd run like the wind from those planners, personally. If you run out of money when you are old, where will they be? Probably wealthy and retired in a gated community somewhere out of reach. Unfortunately nobody cares as much about our financial situation as we do.

[W2R]

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Originally Posted by ExFlyBoy5 I have a few folks who have asked why I don't do a blog. Well, I have a number of reasons; but being judged incessantly by people I don't know is at the top of the list. And hey, I would like to *stay* retired, and obviously if I have a blog, then I am in NO WAY RETIRED!

Even posting on a forum we are judged incessantly by people who don't know us, and yes it does get tiresome at times. Still, I love the exchange of ideas here because I regard the ER Forum as one of the most intelligent groups of people I have encountered online in recent years. I know, "go figure".

As for not being retired due to having a blog, I hope you are joking! What if you have a blog with no ads on it that makes zero money for you? It's just writing in the English language (usually), that's all. I would write a blog except that (1) nobody would read it, and (2) it might cost money for the server space. I do love to write, though. Guess that is no big secret.

[ExFlyBoy5]

Quote:

Originally Posted by W2R Even posting on a forum we are judged incessantly by people who don't know us, and yes it does get tiresome at times. Still, I love the exchange of ideas here because I regard the ER Forum as one of the most intelligent groups of people I have encountered online in recent years. I know, "go figure". As for not being retired due to having a blog, I hope you are joking! What if you have a blog with no ads on it that makes zero money for you? It's just writing in the English language (usually), that's all. I would write a blog except that (1) nobody would read it, and (2) it might cost money for the server space. I do love to write, though. Guess that is no big secret.

There is a little judgement here (on ER.org, not your post), but it's pretty minimal in my opinion. I also have learned more from this forum than all the retirement blogs combined...by far. Blogs tend to be one sided and outside of the comments that might disagree or show a falacy, (which I do not read) when there are issues (or they are flat out wrong) you may not know that. Here, if you say something that isn't accurate, well, you are corrected immediately.

As to my comment where blogging=w*rking (not retired); it was indeed meant to be sarcastic in nature. I am a firm believer that retirement is defined on an individual basis. By all normal indicators and definitions, I am indeed retired, but I can guaranteed that out in the real world, most folks would not accept that assertion since I am obviously way too young to be retired (more sarcasm).

[tmm99]

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Originally Posted by W2R Your SS is irrelevant; it is only taking your portfolio and withdrawals into consideration. Plus, your portfolio is to be invested with a specified AA and so on; here is more information. I'd run like the wind from those planners, personally. If you run out of money when you are old, where will they be? Probably wealthy and retired in a gated community somewhere out of reach. Unfortunately nobody cares as much about our financial situation as we do.

I meant "online planners" like FIDO RIP, i-orp, flexible planner, Firecalc, etc. I didn't mean the live, greedy kind

[W2R]

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Originally Posted by tmm99 I meant "online planners" like FIDO RIP, i-orp, flexible planner, Firecalc, etc. I didn't mean the live, greedy kind

Oh good! I'm glad.

[purplesky]

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Originally Posted by Toocold Before being too judgmental and being overly critical here, you should read this link about the genesis of Joe's blog. He started the blog to answer the question to himself about whether he could retire by 40, not as a "how to" for others, but to document his personal journey. I read his blog and like it, as I figure out my personal path. About Retire By 40

The retire by 40 blog is definitely informative and entertaining. Joe seems cool.

But looking at his numbers it's very clear that joe is relying on his wife's. Income and health insurance to be a stay at home dad. They are still in the accumulation phase.

Joe is just throwing his life journey out there on a blog and sharing. But joe is a smart guy and producing income from web traffic was part of the plan.
Nothing wrong with that.

[Major Tom]

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Originally Posted by W2R I would write a blog except that (1) nobody would read it, and (2) it might cost money for the server space. I do love to write, though. Guess that is no big secret.

There are number of blogging sites that are free to the user. Wordpress.com is the first one that comes to mind. I've had a blog there since 2009, about my hobby of ham radio. It hasn't cost me a penny.

As to your first point that nobody would read it, you might be surprised. I started my blog with the intention of simply keeping an online journal of my radio activities. There was no expectation - I simply wanted to enjoy the process of writing about, and documenting, my personal journey in the hobby. My first surprise was when I made some comment about maybe taking a break from blogging, and a popular and noted blogger in our world commented on it in his blog, "Seems like Tom is taking a break from blogging. We hope he'll come back soon" or something like that. "Holy cow!" I thought, "People who are actually somebody in this little hobby world of ours are reading my blog!" Slowly, my traffic grew, and I noticed that posts would get re-posted and blogged about on other sites too, some of them quite notable, such as the Make site, and Hackaday. I didn't ask for any of this attention - I just blogged.

So I guess what I'm saying is that as you obviously like to write, there is nothing stopping you from starting a (free) blog. Do it for the fun of it, and you might get some followers. Even if you don't get that many (but you probably will) it's still fun.

PS - there are lots of us here who will read it!

[purplesky]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExFlyBoy5 Preach it! I have a few folks who have asked why I don't do a blog. Well, I have a number of reasons; but being judged incessantly by people I don't know is at the top of the list. And hey, I would like to *stay* retired, and obviously if I have a blog, then I am in NO WAY RETIRED! So...Fuego...shouldn't you be getting BACK TO W*RK!?!?

Apparently you don't need the income from blog traffic to keep the lights on.

The mr money mustache business model calls for extreme frugality and web traffic income. From a blog.

There are many people trying to make a living copying mr money mustache and there is nothing wrong with that.

click. Click. Click.

[FUEGO]

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Originally Posted by ExFlyBoy5 So...Fuego...shouldn't you be getting BACK TO W*RK!?!?

Well, I do plan on squeezing in a couple hours of "work" to write an article to come out Tuesday morning. If I can squeeze it in between hanging out with friends/family, napping, strolling through the park, playing video games, netflixing, reading, researching our summer 2017 Europe trip, and playing with the kids, that is.

A guy gets pretty busy you know. Hard to squeeze in this "work" you talk about. I wish I could retire one day. I hear it's pretty awesome.

[W2R]

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Originally Posted by Major Tom There are number of blogging sites that are free to the user. Wordpress.com is the first one that comes to mind. I've had a blog there since 2009, about my hobby of ham radio. It hasn't cost me a penny. As to your first point that nobody would read it, you might be surprised. I started my blog with the intention of simply keeping an online journal of my radio activities. There was no expectation - I simply wanted to enjoy the process of writing about, and documenting, my personal journey in the hobby. My first surprise was when I made some comment about maybe taking a break from blogging, and a popular and noted blogger in our world commented on it in his blog, "Seems like Tom is taking a break from blogging. We hope he'll come back soon" or something like that. "Holy cow!" I thought, "People who are actually somebody in this little hobby world of ours are reading my blog!" Slowly, my traffic grew, and I noticed that posts would get re-posted and blogged about on other sites too, some of them quite notable, such as the Make site, and Hackaday. I didn't ask for any of this attention - I just blogged. So I guess what I'm saying is that as you obviously like to write, there is nothing stopping you from starting a (free) blog. Do it for the fun of it, and you might get some followers. Even if you don't get that many (but you probably will) it's still fun. PS - there are lots of us here who will read it!

Wow!!!! Thank you! I had NO idea that it was that easy to set up a free blog and that somebody or other might actually read it. Wow, wow, wow.... now you have me thinking about it. I'll need to go check wordpress out.

[RobLJ]

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Originally Posted by thefinancebuff I wasn't talking about economy of scale. If you want a housemate you can always get one. With adequate savings someone can not rely on the working spouse's income. Others can't. That makes the difference between retired and having a working spouse and stay-at-home parent having a working spouse.

I use semi-retired (or maybe alt-retired) since I'm still working 10-20 hours a week online from home in "modified employment." I could simply draw from retirement accounts, but the goal is to get the younger DW semi-retired ASAP. I don't think she'll quit working entirely, because she likes to feel useful.
It's good to have options--like dipping first toes, then the ankle, and perhaps the whole kneecap. "First Chill--then Stupor--then the letting go."

[ExFlyBoy5]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobLJ I use semi-retired (or maybe alt-retired) since I'm still working 10-20 hours a week online from home in "modified employment." I could simply draw from retirement accounts, but the goal is to get the younger DW semi-retired ASAP. I don't think she'll quit working entirely, because she likes to feel useful. It's good to have options--like dipping first toes, then the ankle, and perhaps the whole kneecap. "First Chill--then Stupor--then the letting go."

Alt-retired, eh? I'm hearing this 'alt' prefix being used a lot lately.

Sent via mobile device. Please excuse any grammatical errors.

[RobLJ]

I suppose reducing from 50+ hours/week to 10-15 at my own schedule is working but it feels a lot more like alt-retired than "working." Alt-retired has more "truthiness."

[Fermion]

A lot of the people on MMM have made it past the 1st bend and some the 2nd bend in the SS earnings, even in their 40s (we have). A 4% WR drops down to about 2% for them at age 62 or 1% at age 70 when you factor SS. So really you are talking about someone age 45 needing just 17 years at 4% then the remaining at 2%. We are talking about people with spending in the $30k to $50k range, not $100k+ of course.