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Old 01-04-2014, 11:51 AM   #21
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I thought that was interesting that the main machinists union forced the Puget Sound chapter to have a vote on the deal.
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Old 01-04-2014, 12:31 PM   #22
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My guess is that they would vote "NO".
My guess is wrong! Preserving their jobs into the future seems to be a much bigger concern than making some concessions to pensions and health care benefits.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:04 PM   #23
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Now watch, Boeing will have record profits and then the next time a new contract comes up, the company will bend over the workers again.
Every single worker at Boeing was paid for their day's work....regardless of profits or losses by the corporation...

There was NEVER any guarantee that everyone in the company would be paid what the CEO is paid, or even close. That is not realistic, and not even relevant. In fact, I always was glad my Megacorp did well, and if the CEO was paid well to help make my retirement dreams possible, that was OK. DO you want a CEO to make 30,000 a year?!?!?!??

I think a better way to look at it is... a ten year contract, with great wages and a retirement program ( not necessarily a "pension") and a chance for everyone employed there to put in a day's work, get paid, and NOT buy every new thing that comes along.

They are fortunate-they have a finite contract, and if they begin TODAY to start to save like crazy for ten years, they will be posting here in 2025.

I read somewhere recently that young employees are beginning not to to even expect "pensions"...Maybe that term/time has passed.....

Anyone who thinks Boeing, or any other company, is "sticking it up thier A**" can always apply somewhere else.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:17 PM   #24
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...........
I read somewhere recently that young employees are beginning not to to even expect "pensions"...Maybe that term/time has passed................
That is real progress. Hopefully they eventually won't even expect to earn enough to pay for housing and healthcare on a single wage earner's salary.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:26 PM   #25
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As a younger worker I can attest to my generation not expecting a defined benefit retirement plan. When I was in high school we had to take a finance / adult life class ('07) and it was made clear to us that pensions would not be feasible in the future, so don't expect them. We were also warned to not count on social security or Medicare. I have taken those thoughts to heart in my retirement planning. As have many of peers.

Glad to see the yes vote. We have a small Boeing plant in Gresham (Oregon) and this also guarantees those jobs till 2024 which is good for the region.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:34 PM   #26
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That is real progress. Hopefully they eventually won't even expect to earn enough to pay for housing and healthcare on a single wage earner's salary.
Glad to see you are getting with the program.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:43 PM   #27
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That is real progress. Hopefully they eventually won't even expect to earn enough to pay for housing and healthcare on a single wage earner's salary.
I didn't say anyone would not expect to earn enough to pay for housing and healthcare..

What I suggested was that TODAY a single wage earner providing for a family is kind of unrealistic....Just like passenger trains in the 1950s or stage coaches in the 1900's...

All I am saying is that is IF you have a great paying job at Boeing, here is an opportunity to SAVE like crazy for the next ten years...who knows what will happen in ten years but one thing is certain...In 2024 if you are pining about the "newest, greatest" thing you bought in 2014..and now you can't afford to retire....is that Boeing's fault?!>?!?!?

If people haven't learned anything in the last 6 years, and they can't get with the new reality (SAVE more, spend LESS..or in other words, live BELOW your means).., then no contract will save them.
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Old 01-04-2014, 04:05 PM   #28
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Very level headed comment. At wages of $80k/yr, and many benefits and a 401 K matches, these poor guys are really hurting.

Take any of them, along with 80% of government workers, and see if they could even come close to matching their current deal elsewhere.

Ha
Will be interesting to see how that compensation holds up relative to how well Boeing does over the life of this contract.

Could be microcosm of how the middle class has been faring. They have no better choice but to take what employers offer them but what they're being offered are wages that are at best stagnant in real terms.
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Old 01-04-2014, 04:37 PM   #29
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One area of the contract that I didn't hear discussed much was early retiree health care. According to the IAM site, "Retiree health care remains protected for 10 years" and "Retiree medical plan contributions continue under current contract provisions. However, the same changes that apply (increased co-pays, deductibles, etc) will apply to retiree medical."

Although I'm was in SPEEA rather than IAM, this is big for me, as I currently get very good health coverage for myself and DW for $40 per month. Hope that will carry over the SPEEA contract that will be negotiated in a few years.
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Old 01-04-2014, 04:54 PM   #30
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Although I'm was in SPEEA rather than IAM, this is big for me, as I currently get very good health coverage for myself and DW for $40 per month.
I hope it carries over for you also.

$40 a month for 'very good health coverage" for two people is a deal these days. I suspect that a lot of the previous 'NO' voters looked around a bit, and found out that they will not get benefits like this at most other jobs. Then they became 'YES' voters.

I am not in favor of a race to the bottom for employee compensation. But, I am also not in favor of placing one's head in the guillotine because one's nose is drippy.
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Old 01-05-2014, 12:59 PM   #31
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One area of the contract that I didn't hear discussed much was early retiree health care. According to the IAM site, "Retiree health care remains protected for 10 years" and "Retiree medical plan contributions continue under current contract provisions. However, the same changes that apply (increased co-pays, deductibles, etc) will apply to retiree medical."

Although I'm was in SPEEA rather than IAM, this is big for me, as I currently get very good health coverage for myself and DW for $40 per month. Hope that will carry over the SPEEA contract that will be negotiated in a few years.
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That is a good point on retiree medical. I"m not represented (I work in Information Technology) and if I were to retire pre 65 my medical would also be $20 a month per person. In the past what SPEEA negotiates seems to drive what we will get (up or down). My non-Boeing friend who is self employed pays $490 a month for the coverage I would have. Quite a difference there in $$.

I mentioned before there is a strong rumor that our pension will also be frozen in 2016 for us non-represented folks. Maybe they will up the 401K match or add another savings plan like they did for the IAM...
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