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Old 06-25-2016, 01:21 PM   #21
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The Brexit vote was also about leaving a failing socialist union and regaining independence and control over their own future.


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That's definitely a core issue but so is the need for making concessions in a globalization economy vs independence.

Two often competing interests...

Seems to me it's better to engage in dialogue/negotiation to hash out compromises. I worry about minorities all over the world being unrepresented/ignored/abused by their current governments, but dividing the world into ever smaller pieces has its own set of problems.
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Old 06-25-2016, 01:50 PM   #22
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Seems to me it's better to engage in dialogue/negotiation to hash out compromises. I worry about minorities all over the world being unrepresented/ignored/abused by their current governments, but dividing the world into ever smaller pieces has its own set of problems.
+1

I think that many of those who voted for Brexit didn't fully think it out. The UK will need to renegotiate with the EU, as result of which, they will inevitably have to agree to certain levels of immigration they other wise would not, in order to retain other benefits. You have to give something in order to get something.

In our modern world, pulling up the drawbridges is not an option.
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Old 06-25-2016, 02:16 PM   #23
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I am British, and no matter how much I want it, the petition will not overturn the vote. The PM has resigned and things are already moving toward exit.
The petition has 2.000.000+ signatures now. But it is not going to change anything, even though referendums are not legally binding and that parliament can't reject the result if it wants (hypothetically).
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Old 06-25-2016, 02:27 PM   #24
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That's definitely a core issue but so is the need for making concessions in a globalization economy vs independence.
Translate "making concessions" to paying more for others that are not paying as much as you are (Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Ireland, immigrants, etc.)
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Old 06-25-2016, 02:28 PM   #25
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That would be "Texit"...
Yes it would.

From Brexit to Texit? Renewed calls for Texas secession after EU vote - CBS News

https://www.rt.com/usa/348303-brexit...xas-secession/

Quote from the article, "The Lone Star State was the 28th to join the Union in 1845, following nine years of being an independent republic. And based on its present day $1.6 trillion economy, if it did become a separate nation, it would be among the 10 top economies in the world, Miller says."
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Old 06-25-2016, 02:44 PM   #26
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That does sound reasonable, but there is no provision for a revote in Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty.

Article 50

Yes, and there is the small matter of the counterpart saying "Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out".
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Old 06-25-2016, 02:52 PM   #27
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Instead of working to overturn the will of the people and dismissing a decision that was made fairly and peacefully, why don't the Remain people and the EU spend some time trying understand why so many people wanted to Leave? Seems to me like this is an appropriate time to consider some necessary reforms.

Europe's economy has been pretty stagnant in recent years, unemployment rate remains high, labor participation rates have declined, the Euro is weak, negative interest rates in many of the member countries.

When I was growing up, everyone talked about the West German economic miracle. What happened? The EU format was supposed to unleash an era of economic growth, prosperity and innovation, but that doesn't seem to have happened. Why not?


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Old 06-25-2016, 02:56 PM   #28
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When I was growing up, everyone talked about the West German economic miracle. What happened? The EU format was supposed to unleash an era of economic growth, prosperity and innovation, but that doesn't seem to have happened. Why not?
Spenders changing into savers or savers changing into spenders does not happen quickly. Nor do changes in other habits.
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:06 PM   #29
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After Brexit Vote, Britain Googles 'What Is The EU?' : All Tech Considered : NPR
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:09 PM   #30
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:26 PM   #31
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I am British, and no matter how much I want it, the petition will not overturn the vote. The PM has resigned and things are already moving toward exit.
The petition has 2.000.000+ signatures now. But it is not going to change anything, even though referendums are not legally binding and that parliament can't reject the result if it wants (hypothetically).
What if it takes a few months before a new PM is installed, and Parliament gets around to voting to trigger Article 50? If the new PM is not as ardently pro-leave (in other words, not Boris), the market has seriously tanked, and the general economy is showing signs of being affected, the general population might be secretly relieved if a new PM were to don Superman underpants and "pull them back from the precipice". It might even be considered politically expedient for a new PM to do so.

I am not very knowledgeable in this area, so it may be naive of me to even be thinking this. However, if we pull out and start negotiations, the UK could very likely end up with many of the same rights, fees, and concessions as before, except without a say in how EU regulations are written (think Norway). I suppose that with this option, the politicians can then say to their followers, "Look - we got you out of the EU!" while effectively still being in the EU.

I am so worried that I am attracting Porky with this kind of talk.
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:39 PM   #32
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What? Texas is leaving?
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That would be "Texit"...
There's always been that independent band of Texits wanting to leave.

I'm not sure where they'd go...
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:46 PM   #33
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There's always been that independent band of Texits wanting to leave.
I find the made-up words amusing. Since Brexit, we have also learned about the potential for Frexit, Nexit, Dexit, Auxit, and Grexit (again).

It seems quite cutesy, in a European sort of a way
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:55 PM   #34
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What if it takes a few months before a new PM is installed, and Parliament gets around to voting to trigger Article 50? If the new PM is not as ardently pro-leave (in other words, not Boris), the market has seriously tanked, and the general economy is showing signs of being affected, the general population might be secretly relieved if a new PM were to don Superman underpants and "pull them back from the precipice". It might even be considered politically expedient for a new PM to do so.

I am not very knowledgeable in this area, so it may be naive of me to even be thinking this. However, if we pull out and start negotiations, the UK could very likely end up with many of the same rights, fees, and concessions as before, except without a say in how EU regulations are written (think Norway). I suppose that with this option, the politicians can then say to their followers, "Look - we got you out of the EU!" while effectively still being in the EU.

I am so worried that I am attracting Porky with this kind of talk.
Very unlikely scenario. This needs a whole parliament going radical to vote against the referendum (which is not legally binding).
I guess Cameron should have not resigned so quickly, and waited a bit longer to see the aftereffects like the petition of more than 2,000,000 people who are antiBrexit.
It's over to my opinion.
I was proBrexit theoretically as EU Is undemocratic institution where the unelected rich rule over elected ministers of EU countries. Yet I woke up today feeling smaller missing the sense of unity and brotherhood I had with fellow EU citizens (I am an expat living in Spain). Also I will lose the right to move, live and work in other EU countries without immigration and hassle of paperwork. I am now like an American or Russian when it comes to immigration to other Eu countries.
When I move to Spain 6 years ago, I flashed my passport and my permanent residency permit was printed out in 1 minute. That is history now!
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Old 06-25-2016, 04:59 PM   #35
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Why should a petition of 2 million people override the 17 million that voted to leave? Are we to believe that all of those 2 million on the petition are people that originally voted no and have since had regrets, or are they just a bunch of unhappy no voters muddying the waters?
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Old 06-25-2016, 05:36 PM   #36
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Why should a petition of 2 million people override the 17 million that voted to leave? Are we to believe that all of those 2 million on the petition are people that originally voted no and have since had regrets, or are they just a bunch of unhappy no voters muddying the waters?

As I understand it, "official" petitions that gather 100,000+ signatures trigger a parliamentary debate. That may or may not result in another vote.

I'm sure they'll figure it out without my help...
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Old 06-25-2016, 06:42 PM   #37
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Why should a petition of 2 million people override the 17 million that voted to leave? Are we to believe that all of those 2 million on the petition are people that originally voted no and have since had regrets, or are they just a bunch of unhappy no voters muddying the waters?
Or if they are British, and indeed whether they even exist as living entities.
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Old 06-25-2016, 06:44 PM   #38
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I find the made-up words amusing. Since Brexit, we have also learned about the potential for Frexit, Nexit, Dexit, Auxit, and Grexit (again).
I thought Czech-out and Departugal were clever...
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Old 06-25-2016, 06:48 PM   #39
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It was a 48 to 52 vote. No matter what way you go, you irritate ~50% of the people. It's a no-win no matter what.

The easy street is to stay and keep Britain (or whatever country it is morphing into) in the EU.

If you throw out Northern Ireland and Scotland the vote was much higher on the exit side... and there is already talk of another vote for Scotland to leave and the Irish are talking about a vote to reunify....

I think England will be out no matter what... almost the whole country voted that way except for London....
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Old 06-25-2016, 06:50 PM   #40
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I think England will be out no matter what... almost the whole country voted that way except for London....
There have been calls for London to secede from Britain to remain the the EU......Lexit? Or Lentrance?
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