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Old 04-18-2015, 08:47 PM   #21
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Unfortunately there are many who are swayed by money.

However, be careful not to hide so much of yourself that a good woman, when she finds out, feels like you hid a part of yourself from her. No one likes to be lied to.

It's a balancing act.

Don't tip your hat early. Try to find out your spouses values regarding spending, saving, etc. Express your interest in investing, not saying what you are doing, but what your dreams are, your goals. You want to find someone who is interested in living below their means in order to achieve a greater goal. You want to find someone who can delay gratification. You want to find a partner who shares the same goals in life. You want to find someone who values love and life experiences more than "things", and isn't worried about "keeping up with the Jones".

I'm not sure I agree about the pre-nup, especially at such a young age, with a relatively small amount of money to lose (in the grand scheme of things). If you have found someone whom you think has the same values as you, they may find it insulting that you would suggest a pre-nup. It signifies distrust.
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:07 PM   #22
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I vaguely recall helping out my girlfriend at the time back in college (who I ended up marrying and remain married 11 years later!). But my GF was very very frugal and I never had doubts I would get paid back. We also moved in together early in the relationship, so it was pretty serious and not just a casual fling.

Neither one of us had a lot. I maybe had <$10k in cash at the best of times right after a scholarship disbursement, less during the school year. So there wasn't a lot to conceal from her or other prospective ladeez.
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:07 PM   #23
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What you do is take the person out to a nice restaurant, and say "Order whatever you want." If she goes for the most expensive stuff on the menu and you mind that, then that should be a sign
You put a smiley on this, but I think it is great advice for dating! And I'm not talking about a one time very special event, but your typical date. Ordering patterns and demands say a lot. It is part of dating.

When things get more serious, and I mean close to engagement, then I think some personal details need to be shared. But I also believe in long dating periods.

As for friends, I never share details. Never.

Never loan to friend or family. NEVER. If you do, it is just a gift and consider it as such.

I also do not engage in personal business affairs with friends. I don't use friends as lawyers, doctors, real estate agents, CPAs, landscapers, roofers, plumbers or anything.
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Old 04-18-2015, 09:20 PM   #24
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Yes, I put a smiley face. But a good smiley face and not the joking one .

I remember reading an article (I forget where) when someone mentioned that when this woman was dating and went out for coffee or tea. She went to the restroom and when she came back, she notice her date had covered her cup up with the saucer plate to keep the drink warm while she was away. Right there, she knew that he was a "keeper"
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Old 04-18-2015, 10:14 PM   #25
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Since you're asking for advice:

1. Keep the "cute girl" to yourself. You should have learned there is no payoff in advertising it. Alternatively, date the ugly ones - they draw less attention from the outside and really appreciate the attention. Might be surprised by how much better your life is.
2. Share your philosophy about money, but not your personal numbers. You'll learn a lot from the reaction.
3. Learn what you can about how your intended was raised. If her parents treated her like a princess, she'll expect you to do the same - just like daddy. If she had to work for things like her car or education, you're more likely to have similar values.
4. At this stage in your life, anyone who asks or expects you to pay for anything more than dinner and a movie is a parasite. Squash them as quick as you can.
+1

After 34 years of teaching teenagers and young adults (and 40+ years of adulthood), I can say that principles #1-4 ring true, day in and day out. I've watched the "princesses" grow up to become the demanding mothers, who sometimes become well-funded divorcees........who then seek "only the best" they can find/manipulate for the next generation of princesses they are raising.

In contrast, many of us who worked our way through college saw principles 1-4 at work in our social lives. Personally, I had no time to party or live irresponsibly; peers who couldn't understand why simply drifted away. The ones who were going to school the way I was DID understand and-- because of our common values and challenges-- were the folks who eventually became my friends. None of us were impressed by material things because we had so few of them..........our friendships were based on other factors (character, integrity, common hobbies/aspirations/interests). One of those friends eventually became my husband. We already knew the role that money played in our lives: it was a tool for practical purposes.

Nonetheless, we retired very comfortably. In later years we enjoyed reminiscing, joking with each other: "I always knew that you didn't marry me for my money. I didn't have any!"

It was the truth! There was nothing for either him or I to have ulterior motives about.

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Old 04-18-2015, 11:15 PM   #26
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Since you're asking for advice:

...1. Alternatively, date the ugly ones - they draw less attention from the outside and really appreciate the attention. Might be surprised by how much better your life is....
Sounds like your philosophy worked well for you.


And, for your listening pleasure we can put the philosophy to music:


https://youtu.be/z4TOR7856d4
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Old 04-19-2015, 05:38 AM   #27
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I met the young wife 35 years ago, when we were both college students and neither one of us had money to worry about. My first Christmas gift to her after we started dating was a rubber chicken. I had asked for advice from her college roommate and that's what I was told she wanted. In the days before Amazon, it was very, very difficult to locate such a thing, but I searched all over and found it. Her joy when she got that chicken (instead of a piece of jewelry or something) told me a lot about what she valued - thoughtfulness and attention to her, rather than money. We have now been married for 31 years and she still has the chicken. (as an aside, she was also the smokin' hot one).

For the OP, another thing that can help you find out if she is more interested in you or your money is to suggest activities that cost nothing or very little. Is she just as happy to go on a picnic to the park as to a restaurant? Will she ride a bike with you or go for a hike simply to enjoy your company? If there must be money spent for her to have a good time, it is a warning for you to tread carefully.
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Old 04-19-2015, 06:21 AM   #28
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There is no need to share your finances until just before you marry. Do share goals and dreams when it gets serious. One thing DH did when we were courting was start a "game" of asking each other questions like, do you want kids, how many, what are your career goals, political philosophy (not party!) spiritual beliefs, etc. It was very helpful as our relationship/engagement were long distance and long (engaged 3+ years).

We were able to discover how alike we were in ways people don't talk about very much, and it let me know he was very serious about me.

Also, since you LBYM you probably won't look like you have any $$ anyway, if you don't talk about it.

BTW, I agree, you dodged a bullet. There are a lot of us women who don't care for bling or partying. You won't find such women by going to parties. Join a hiking club or a bicycling group, or other activity group to meet sensible women.


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Old 04-19-2015, 06:58 AM   #29
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There is no need to share your finances until just before you marry. Do share goals and dreams when it gets serious. One thing DH did when we were courting was start a "game" of asking each other questions like, do you want kids, how many, what are your career goals, political philosophy (not party!) spiritual beliefs, etc. It was very helpful as our relationship/engagement were long distance and long (engaged 3+ years).
Yes. When I said share details when it gets serious, this is what I meant. Not necessarily hard numbers. But goals. DW and I shared philosophies on debt, retirement saving, etc. You need to be of one kind.

From long dating, you'll know the other stuff. Is she/he stuck on money, vanity, toys, etc. What does he/she really value?

Oh, and consider the baby of the family. They usually have not been coddled to death by mom and dad and know the realities of life.
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Old 04-19-2015, 07:24 AM   #30
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For the OP, another thing that can help you find out if she is more interested in you or your money is to suggest activities that cost nothing or very little. Is she just as happy to go on a picnic to the park as to a restaurant? Will she ride a bike with you or go for a hike simply to enjoy your company? If there must be money spent for her to have a good time, it is a warning for you to tread carefully.
+1

I found this to be so true. It also let me know if she was interested in the same activities to enjoy life.

When starting to date again after a divorce I was on a limited budget so my first few dates with women were often meeting after work for happy hour, for lunch, or (my favorite and somewhat more novel approach) for Saturday breakfast. A little different atmosphere than usual and a shorter but enough time together to know if I was interested in pursuing things any further.

When dating in college I never had the means to go out to dinner. It was fraternity parties or out to a pub for a beer and pizza or some free peanuts. A 10 year marriage after grad school ended when our 2 incomes as teachers and me working a second job at night couldn't provide her with enough "stuff". Five years later and a little wiser I met my present wife of 28 years. We share the same views on most everything (we have never had an argument about money) and life has been great since we met.

For what it's worth we don't discuss our financial situation with any of the family much less friends.

I also have reservations about lending or gifting money to friends. I have never been asked but I have been tempted to help my closest friend when he ran into some tough times. It can create problems either way when it creates a sense of obligation. I don't want to lose the few close friends I have.

Cheers!
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Old 04-19-2015, 09:04 AM   #31
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As the others have said, you dodged a bullet. I married someone like that. Most of our resources went towards his "wants" and it got worse when he lost his job and was unemployed the last 5 years of the marriage. More time to spend money. When all his credit cards maxed out, he started using mine and hid the bills form me. (This was before on-line account access.)

So, when I divorced, I was really cautious. I remarried 7 years later, but we dated 6 years. You may not want to wait that long, but during that time it was clear to me that while current DH was a man of modest means with little savings, he didn't have credit card debt, he lived on less than he made, and his bills were paid. He had decent equity in a modest house. (In northern NJ that's a big deal.) I'm happy to say almost 12 years later that he was a good choice. We have very similar values so we generally agree when to open up the wallet and do something extravagant and it usually has something to do with travel.

There are women out there who share your values. I hope you find one in good time!
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Old 04-19-2015, 09:19 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by FlaGator View Post
Since you're asking for advice:

1. Keep the "cute girl" to yourself. You should have learned there is no payoff in advertising it. Alternatively, date the ugly ones - they draw less attention from the outside and really appreciate the attention. Might be surprised by how much better your life is.
2. Share your philosophy about money, but not your personal numbers. You'll learn a lot from the reaction.
3. Learn what you can about how your intended was raised. If her parents treated her like a princess, she'll expect you to do the same - just like daddy. If she had to work for things like her car or education, you're more likely to have similar values.
4. At this stage in your life, anyone who asks or expects you to pay for anything more than dinner and a movie is a parasite. Squash them as quick as you can.


Reading some responses #4 stands out... do not get caught up in 'helping' pay for their rent, utilities, etc. etc. when you are dating.... even after awhile...

Also look out for 'dry begging'.... people who know how to manipulate your feelings can use this to their benefit...

For the people who do not know what this is...

DRY BEGGING - Definition #1: "To ask for in an indirect and roundabout way. Dropping vague hints that are not clear or straightforward in making a request."

Definition #2: "When someone doesn't actually ask you for something but they keep telling you about what they need hoping you would offer."
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Old 04-19-2015, 09:21 AM   #33
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As many others said, no reason to share any information about your finances with others. I could see mentioning, for example, the laser eye surgery in conversation about contacts or glasses, but not in a million years would I mention the amount it cost or who paid for it (say you don't know how much it cost, you think your parents used their health insurance or something). Especially to college friends, who usually have a narrower frame of reference re finance than they will once they are out in the working world full time.
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Old 04-19-2015, 09:23 AM   #34
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Oh.... another person you need to look out for is the Gold Digger.... (I have heard both of these terms on Judge Mathis... need to give credit)...


GOLD DIGGER - Definition #1: "Any woman whose primary interest in a relationship is material benefits. A woman who cares more about a man's bank account than she does about the man."

Definition #2: "A woman who manipulates men to benefit from their labor, skills, or money without compensation. Often highly narcissistic exhibiting little compassion and thankfulness."



As an example.... back when I was young, my sister introduced me to a girl... we did not click at all... a couple of months later she found out that I owned my own house and she became interested.... asked my sister to talk to me.... I said 'no thanks.... it was only the house that made her interested'..... usually it is not this obvious, so you have to be careful...
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Old 04-19-2015, 09:25 AM   #35
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Lots of good advice here for FelipeA.

But I wouldn't advise a 22-year-old to take every tip posted here literally in all situations.
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You want to find someone who can delay gratification.
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Old 04-19-2015, 10:31 AM   #36
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I like having strict rules about money in relationships, and not being ashamed to want to keep one's own hard-earned money. Some women seem to equate receiving your money with receiving your love. The ex-wife assumed I didn't love her since I resented paying for her to stay home and watch TV. I made the money rules very clear to new GF and we have had our problems, but not money problems, and are still together many years later.
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Old 04-19-2015, 11:39 AM   #37
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I like having strict rules about money in relationships, and not being ashamed to want to keep one's own hard-earned money. Some women seem to equate receiving your money with receiving your love. The ex-wife assumed I didn't love her since I resented paying for her to stay home and watch TV. I made the money rules very clear to new GF and we have had our problems, but not money problems, and are still together many years later.
Could it be at least in part because she is a GF rather than a wife? If you have been careful, a GF cannot levy the huge exit fee that a wife often can.

Ha
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Old 04-19-2015, 11:48 AM   #38
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Million Dollar Idea of the week:

How about a dating site specializing in catering to frugal people.
  • "Millionare Next Door" - required reading.
  • Posting on Mr. Money Mustache - check

Unfortunately the pool of qualified applicants may be small (and according to DW not gender balanced), but hey the Internet is suppose to be good at developing "Long Tail" activities.

Okay, who is going to leave ER and develop it?

-gauss

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Old 04-19-2015, 11:57 AM   #39
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Not to sound superficial but can we see a picture of her before we post ?
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Old 04-19-2015, 12:29 PM   #40
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I have a hunch she doesn't look like this because sometimes money just isn't all that important in deciding whom you'd like to spend the rest of your life with.
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