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Old 01-12-2018, 01:28 PM   #81
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And I still contend that depreciation has some play in this even if you're going to drive the car into the ground. If you've got a car worth $1500 and you decide to put $500 in tires on it, for $100/yr over 5 years, and at the end of those 5 years you leave it on the side of a road, you have another $300/yr gone because you could've sold it for $1500 5 years earlier. It pales in comparison to the newer car depreciation but you can't factor in depreciation on one and ignore it on the other, no matter how long you hold the car.
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Old 01-12-2018, 01:56 PM   #82
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Again, the only time depreciation comes into play is if I want to get rid of the car. Say I have a $1500 pickup truck I use to run to home depot. One morning the engine throws a rod. A replacement engine costs $1500. The question now becomes put $1500 into it or get another truck. I then have to take into account what other things it might need in the future (tires, battery, catalytic converter, shocks etc). If I don't plan to sell it I ignore the depreciation, which is very little in this case anyway. I've never left even my worst beaters on the side of the road, I did donate one time and got a small tax break but since then I've always sold or parted out cars and usually been pretty happy with the results. Again, I enjoy working on cars so it's a bit different in my case.

BTW, I had that gen Miata, fantastic cars, still have a repair manual for it! They're pretty bullet proof but like anything mechanical and electrical you never know when a car might breakdown. Not long ago was offroading and came across a brand new 2017 Toyota Tacoma with the hood up on the side of a trail..the dash was lit up like the xmas tree and no power to go uphill. The owner was upset he paid $38k for a 4wd toyota truck (doesn't get any more reliable than that right?) only to find himself and his kid stuck in the middle of nowhere. I cleared all the codes, which got him running again, then escorted him to the main trail in case he got stuck again. Case in point, breakdowns can happen even to new cars and new cars can be much harder to fix on the side of the road.
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Old 01-12-2018, 08:28 PM   #83
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It's also inarguable that the newer car is almost sure to be more reliable.


I've broken down in a blizzard, 2 miles out of a small town. I was 22 so I survived, but I remember telling the friend with me that I understood how people die in situations like that. We were lucky that we were on our way to ski, and dressed to be outside in that weather. I could still survive it since I do endurance events, but there are a lot of people who couldn't, and some day I will be one of them.
I agree, and I agree that a newer car is more likely to offer higher reliability (given similar makes, etc). But I wouldn't choose to put myself in a situation where my survival depends on the continued functioning of my car/heater/heater fan, etc. Neither a new car nor an old one is immune to quitting, and having an operational cell phone, a blanket or two, and somebody who knows where you are going and how/when you'll get there is probably smart in cold weather regardless of the car's perceived reliability.
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Old 01-12-2018, 08:48 PM   #84
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I've broken down in a blizzard, 2 miles out of a small town. I was 22 so I survived, but I remember telling the friend with me that I understood how people die in situations like that. We were lucky that we were on our way to ski, and dressed to be outside in that weather. I could still survive it since I do endurance events, but there are a lot of people who couldn't, and some day I will be one of them.
It gets stupid cold here and little problems can quickly become big problems when it's -35. Most people keep extra boots, mitts, blanket, jumper cables, etc. in their cars and will let someone know if they're heading out.

Cell phones certainly help if you've slid off the road...unless you're in a dead spot. I also carry a tow rope (AWD Subaru) and have used it to pull out someone that was in the ditch.
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Old 01-12-2018, 09:08 PM   #85
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I talked to a fleet manager on the commercial truck side. Penske or hertz or some such. Not the rental U Haul type but the leasing to companies that run their own fleet. He said they sell a truck when the repair costs = 50% of purchase cost. I guess that would keep your fleet pretty new.


Yeahbut Penske and Hertz are the most expensive leasing companies around. They pass that cost onto their customers so not great examples to choose. They buy thousands of trucks annually and get great pricing from the oem's. They also typically include maintenance cost in the lease payment and those vehicles need more to keep them on the road than a passenger car.
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Old 01-12-2018, 10:22 PM   #86
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Yeahbut Penske and Hertz are the most expensive leasing companies around. They pass that cost onto their customers so not great examples to choose. They buy thousands of trucks annually and get great pricing from the oem's. They also typically include maintenance cost in the lease payment and those vehicles need more to keep them on the road than a passenger car.
Just an example of the thinking from a professional. Not some guy in a garage running cars through a LOF and check the tires

I did get a look at some repair invoices. Wow. Less than $100 for a cast wheel drum. I pay $300-500 ea. That was pretty impressive
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:24 AM   #87
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I just spent $6K replacing worn components in my 220k mile 1996 dodge/cummins truck. This truck will run a million miles if kept up. I think it was money well spent, compared to buying a new $65k truck. Book value doesn't even factor into my equation. + the current truck does everything I need with crazy power for towing and looks like new. It's still my baby. Even stitched new high grade leather onto the worn steering wheel. Drives and feels new.
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Old 01-15-2018, 04:24 AM   #88
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My rule of thumb is when the maintenance on the old car gets close to the car payments, increased taxes and higher insurance of the newer car, then it is time to trade. What does that mean for me? If I was looking at a $1500-2000 total I'd do some serious consideration. That's a lot - either engine or transmission issues or just a lot of deferred stuff like all new everything.
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Old 01-15-2018, 04:47 AM   #89
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I budget $1500 a year, per car, for maintenance. Each year there always seems to be a big expense for each car ... new set of tires, new exhaust system, brakes, water pump, timing belt, body work ... you name it. This on top of normal stuff ... inspections, fluid changes, etc.
I don't mind. That's a lot cheaper than a new car or a car loan!
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:56 PM   #90
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Still cheaper to repair than replace, at least for us.

We own 10+ year old vehicles, so a (rebuilt) transmission would probably be ~$3000.

But newer vehicles with 8 or 9 speed auto trannys, double that (DSG tranny can be triple that)
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Old 01-17-2018, 05:42 AM   #91
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I believe that a new car is generally safer than one 10+ years
I don't know, is this still the case? I drive a 2007 Toyota. It has ABS, ESP, and all the airbags you could ask for. I think the only new developments after that are 'driver assistance' BS (lane assistant, automatic emergency breaking, ...) that I do not want. I AM the driver, it is MY responsibility to make sure the car doesn't bump into anything.
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Old 01-17-2018, 06:48 AM   #92
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I don't know, is this still the case? I drive a 2007 Toyota. It has ABS, ESP, and all the airbags you could ask for. I think the only new developments after that are 'driver assistance' BS (lane assistant, automatic emergency breaking, ...) that I do not want. I AM the driver, it is MY responsibility to make sure the car doesn't bump into anything.
so you aren't lining up for autonomous driving car then?

personally I like the extra doo dads

and my heated steering wheel
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Old 01-17-2018, 06:52 AM   #93
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I love the heated steering wheel (and seats) on my new car...those are great features for a winter climate.

I don't need blind spot monitoring though because the mirrors can be adjusted to eliminate it.
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Old 01-17-2018, 06:59 AM   #94
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I just like a new car every 3 years......... Then just order what I want and not what I do not.
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Old 01-18-2018, 06:53 AM   #95
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so you aren't lining up for autonomous driving car then?
I think that does get interesting at the point were cars can self-drive 100%. If I could read a book or take a nap during my commute, I would definitely look into a new car.
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Old 01-18-2018, 07:49 AM   #96
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I think that's a long way off for legal reasons. Folks keep saying it's coming within the next few years but I have my doubts.

When it does come I think a lot of folks will just rent cars by the mile or whatever, it will change the whole way we look at transportation (no need for big parking lots etc.).
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Old 01-18-2018, 08:54 AM   #97
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At every eight years I think I'd max out at three more cars. Number three would be at 80 so it better be a self driver. I don't want to be that guy that is a hazard to everyone else.
I think self drivers will be like an Uber. My neighbor goes to work, his car is now available to drive me somewhere.
Looking at it this way next car should be something awesome. The once in a lifetime car, because it might be! Is a 64 year old in a Porsche too gauche? I can still grow the soul patch and ponytail.
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