Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Credit Card Fraud . . . again
Old 03-26-2010, 01:33 PM   #1
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
Credit Card Fraud . . . again

Little did I know, as I was posting in Credit, Debit or None of the Above? that my card information had made it's way overseas and was being "tested" with an Apple music download. The card company called today to verify two charges, which I denied. Well, don't remember if they were actual charges or just authorizations. What is an authorization? Authorization hold - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It was a 10 minute phone call in which the agent explained that the card company saw some unusual activity on my card and asked me if I had been out of the country recently. I said no. We discussed details on two transactions that I did not make. The card has been closed I should receive replacement cards with a new account number in about a week, or overnight if needed. Said a week is fine. They are also sending the affidavit form in case any of the unauthorized charges appear on the next statement.

This is the third time since October '08. I suspect a leak in some merchant's payment processor is being exploited by a trusted insider (a crook) or something like that, but that would be impossible for an outsider to nail down. The people that steal this information would never think of trying to use it themselves -- they sell it to overseas crooks who know that the card companies cannot come after them. Don't know the going rate for this information, but it can't be that much, so to make it pay (for the crooks) they need lots of accounts.
__________________

__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 03-26-2010, 01:50 PM   #2
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,827
Yikes!! Glad they are getting this taken care of (again). My sympathies.
__________________

__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 02:31 PM   #3
Moderator Emeritus
CuppaJoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: At The Cafe
Posts: 6,866
What a PITA, Rustward, three times.

I had about six or seven international calls charged to mine some time ago, it took about five billing cycles to clear it up, including a double credit the bank made while reversing the charges. They never did reverse the rewards points on about $500.00.
__________________
CuppaJoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 03:24 PM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DangerMouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 1,812
The good thing is most banks seem to be hyper-vigilant looking for fraud activity these days. Within the past year, 2 of my credit cards have been shut down by the banks because of expected fraud and to this day I have no idea how they got the numbers. In one instance the crooks tried to use my credit card to purchase tickets from Ticketek, something I had never done before and that made the bank suspicious and they declined the charge.

I guess on the other hand it tells us how much the banks actually know about us and our habits. However, I am happy for them to be aggressive in monitoring my shopping habits rather than having to deal with the fall out from fraud.
__________________

I be a girl, he's a boy. Think I maybe FIRED since July 08. Mid 40s, no kidlets. Actually am totally clueless as to what is going on with DH.
DangerMouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 03:42 PM   #5
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
audreyh1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 16,456
Happens to me about regularly. First two times about 18 months apart. Last one about 1 year apart. Oh no!!! That means I am about due again.

I have set things up so that I can switch to an alternate credit card while I wait for the newly issues cards. And I use a quarantined AMEX card for auto-pay of recurring bills. By quarantined I mean I only use it with a handful of highly trusted vendors.

Audrey
__________________
audreyh1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 03:47 PM   #6
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,612
Quote:
Originally Posted by DangerMouse View Post
The good thing is most banks seem to be hyper-vigilant looking for fraud activity these days.
Last year we had a bit of a windfall at one point and I was planning on replacing our aging computers anyway, so I made two online purchases of new computers from two different sources, about 10 minutes apart and on the same credit card.

Then I sat and waited for the phone to ring from the card issuer's fraud department, which it did a half hour later, asking me to confirm that I really made those purchases. I confirmed it and had the computers 2-3 days later.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 04:52 PM   #7
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
Quote:
Originally Posted by DangerMouse View Post
I guess on the other hand it tells us how much the banks actually know about us and our habits. However, I am happy for them to be aggressive in monitoring my shopping habits rather than having to deal with the fall out from fraud.
The banks have a lot of data on us but the credit reporting agencies have even more. They take data from multiple sources and merge it. They sell this data in different forms. Sometimes they even sell it back to the source they got it from!
__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 04:54 PM   #8
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rambler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,243
I have had issues with the hyper vigilent banks in the past as well, usually when one bank sells the credit card account to another bank (as in CapitalOne to MBNA to BofA). Same account, but whenever it changes hands, it seems they have to rebuild my purchase patterns. I travel alot, and I have had credit cards rejected while traveling on many occasions. Of course, they call my home and try to find out if I really making those purchases, but since I am not home, I have to wait until the next purchase to find out that the card does not work. I used to carry only one CC, but added a couple for this reason. I tell you, it is no fun calling the CC company from overseas from your cell or from the hotel phone, just to get the card unlocked. I appreciate the vigilence, but wish that my history and patterns transferred to the new issuers as easily as the balances do. These days, I usually call the card company a few days before a big purchase or an overseas trip to a country that is unusual for me, just to avoid the nuisance.

R
__________________
Find Joy in the Journey...
Rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 04:57 PM   #9
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,526
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
Last year we had a bit of a windfall at one point and I was planning on replacing our aging computers anyway, so I made two online purchases of new computers from two different sources, about 10 minutes apart and on the same credit card.

Then I sat and waited for the phone to ring from the card issuer's fraud department, which it did a half hour later, asking me to confirm that I really made those purchases. I confirmed it and had the computers 2-3 days later.
I guess my CC company knows that I buy tons of stuff online for myself and others (including big ticket items like computers). I paypal the heck out of my credit card some days and they never blink. The weekend of black friday/cyber monday was a big purchasing time for me.
__________________
Retired in 2013 at age 33. Keeping busy reading, blogging, relaxing, gaming, and enjoying the outdoors with my wife and 3 kids (5, 11, and 12).
FUEGO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 05:03 PM   #10
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
Quote:
Originally Posted by CuppaJoe View Post
What a PITA, Rustward, three times.
It's not such a big deal. This is the card we use the most. Maybe that increases the likelyhood of this happening, I dunno. But this account number is not "on file" anywhere for automatic charges so I don't have notify any merchants of a new account number -- this time.

I know what the banks are capable of and as vigilant and proactive as they are, I believe they could do better. One example: the agent told me the unauthorized charges were made on March 15. Why did it take 10 days for me to hear about it? I don't travel internationally and never buy music from Apple. Just the fact that my card was used in a foreign country for a merchant I do no business with should have swung the needle on the fraud detector. I am told Apple is popular because the crooks can test a card with a small under-the-radar charge -- if it is a good card then thry go crazy. The scarry thing is that if they had the "personal" information that some merchants use to authenticate you -- like having to enter your zip code on a gas pump, or that little three digit on code on the back of the card -- they can do more damage.
__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 06:45 PM   #11
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 582
Quote:
Originally Posted by audreyh1 View Post
I have set things up so that I can switch to an alternate credit card while I wait for the newly issues cards. And I use a quarantined AMEX card for auto-pay of recurring bills. By quarantined I mean I only use it with a handful of highly trusted vendors.
I like this idea. We hope to do more traveling post-FIRE and this would be a good system to avoid hassles since we will likely be using our cards in many new places.

I also recently got a paypal account set up, because I see more and more online vendors are accepting it. This way, the vendor doesn't get the card info. I'm hoping that trend continues because it seems a safer way to go for online purchases.
__________________

WM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 07:16 PM   #12
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
audreyh1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 16,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
Then I sat and waited for the phone to ring from the card issuer's fraud department, which it did a half hour later, asking me to confirm that I really made those purchases. I confirmed it and had the computers 2-3 days later.
At the check-out counter at Best Buy, having bought a large HD TV, within about 10 seconds of the transaction going through I got the BAC call to verify it.

Audrey
__________________
audreyh1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 07:24 PM   #13
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,126
Credit card fraud costs our banks billions of dollars a year. I think they are justified in trying to reduce it. Otherwise in the end we all pay the costs.
__________________
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2010, 07:34 PM   #14
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
audreyh1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Rio Grande Valley
Posts: 16,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by WM View Post
I also recently got a paypal account set up, because I see more and more online vendors are accepting it. This way, the vendor doesn't get the card info. I'm hoping that trend continues because it seems a safer way to go for online purchases.
Yeah, I use paypal for the smaller on-line vendors.

Audrey
__________________
audreyh1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2010, 04:13 AM   #15
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
I have considered getting a credit card account that I use exclusively for online transactions.... keep those charges separate from my normal credit card that I use day to day at stores for local merchandise and services.


I do not trust small online merchants to have secure IT Systems or to have rigorous employee screening.

IMO - It is best to stick with large well-known online vendors for online sales.
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2010, 06:48 AM   #16
Moderator
Walt34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 16,501
Quote:
Originally Posted by DangerMouse View Post
I guess on the other hand it tells us how much the banks actually know about us and our habits.
Actually, it's partially an offshoot of the cold war. They use software derived from missile-interception technology (predictive analysis) to look for breaks from past patterns of buying behavior. So no one is actually "looking over your shoulder" when you buy stuff.

So the software "knows" that the bank better call the account holder when unusual purchases are made, as when Ziggy29 bought two computers on the same day.

When I was doing fraud investigations I had the chance to talk with a guy who worked for one of those companies developing the software. When the market for their product dried up they adapted it to business use.
__________________
I heard the call to do nothing. So I answered it.
Walt34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2010, 07:26 AM   #17
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 484
Wow 3 times. In Venice we were warned by the woman who owned the palazzetto we stayed in, that people clone the cards when they are out of your site - like restaurants.
__________________
tinlizzy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2010, 09:29 PM   #18
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Treasure Coast
Posts: 338
Luckily, the people who commit fraud can never do it in really large amounts, because the banks keep the credit limits behind Ft. Knox walls. A few thousand here and there certainly adds up, but they don't routinely get away with five figures with just cloning, etc.
__________________
45th Birthday is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2010, 12:39 PM   #19
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 230
I had the same instance of a wierd charge on iTunes to my card - some Chinese game or app? I had no idea what it was, and as soon I got the email receipt from iTunes I contacted Apple to get the charge removed. Funny thing is, the Apple rep kept insisting that I had "mistakenly" ordered this game and refused to accept my explanation that someone else had ordered it on my account. Anyway, they refunded the money and I haven't seen any other odd transactions on my card - and I check that pretty frequently online.
__________________
caninelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2010, 10:37 PM   #20
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
The replacement cards with new account number arrived today. Haven't activated them yet but will probably do so by the weekend.

The "Declaration of unauthorized use" form also arrived today by separate mailing. Looking at my account online I see no unauthorized charges as of today, so this form may not be necessary. Will retain this form for a couple of statement cycles. The other two times this happened no unauthorized charges appeared on my statement, so the credit card companies are doing at least a "good" job.

Yawn.

Edit to add: this has happened three times since October 2008, and all on the same card. We have five other cards that have never been stricken with unauthorized charges. However, this card is the one we use the most, at the largest number of merchants -- don't know if this has anything to do with fraud, though.

Oh, edit to add again... since the first incident in October 2008, this card has not been used online, I.E. Internet purchases -- only brick and mortar merchants -- so the origin of the fraud must be from brick and mortar merchants or those who process authorizations and payments for those brick and mortar merchants.

I hope that the credit card companies are trying to pin this down. It can't be that difficult, especially if all the card companies share data about fraudlent charges. When I spoke to the agent last week, she did not know of the card companies share data about fraudulent charges. I understand that, as part of a security system is not disclosing how the system works to people who do not "need to know".
__________________

__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pre Paid Credit Card/ Gas Card or Credit Card nphx Other topics 4 04-29-2008 02:04 PM
Credit Card fraud alert Khan Other topics 3 10-19-2007 11:27 PM
Best Bonus for Credit Card Expenitures -Frequent Flyer cards or Cash-back card? ScaredtoQuit FIRE and Money 19 04-21-2007 04:29 PM
Credit Card Fraud Indexter Other topics 13 06-19-2006 05:59 PM
Credit Card Fraud question MJ Other topics 4 06-18-2006 09:05 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:50 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.