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Old 10-09-2008, 07:00 PM   #81
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I'm sorry as well Dreamer. Seeing a loved one in a nursing home has to be depressing. As far as the market goes, I've already passed the panic/breaking point. I've just come to the conclusion there is not a damn thing I can do about it now. Going to just have to ride it out and hope that one day I break even again. Might take 10 years, maybe more, but again.....I can't do anything about it at this point. Fortunately I live a frugal lifestyle so I can make it.

Got to run, time for my medication a beer.
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:16 PM   #82
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Vanguard's Admiral / Voyager etc categories ...

I may now qualify for the new category: "Kayak" - they will provide 2 dead squirrels and a box of matches as a benefit ...

I shall go feed the cats, so all will be well.

ta,
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Can the cats be talked into bringing in food to share?
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:22 PM   #83
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Thanks 73SS454 and Dawg54. Actually, I have much to be thankful for and I need to keep that in mind. It was a beautiful day for a drive and the changing leaves were gorgeous. I think that I need to have a glass of wine and chill.
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:32 PM   #84
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Sorry Dreamer, sorta puts the DOW being down in perspective. At least the DOW being down isn't fatal.
I have to agree with this. This is far from pleasant for me. But I lost my fiancee to liver disease in my mid-twenties-the worst by far. My wife divorced me, also not at all fun. And my parents died withing 3 months of one another. All much worse than this market crap- even if I believed that these falls were permanent, which I most assuredly do not believe.

I think my car crash 3 years ago was worse too- as I will get my assets back, but I won't get my full health back. Also, I am not mad at the market, whereas I am quite angry at the mofo who ran a stop sign and caused my crash.

Ha
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:37 PM   #85
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After reading all of these posts, I am grateful for the black humor that is helping me get through this debacle. I have a good plan with a few years of cash to augment small pension but this is first time I have ever gone through this kind of drop in the market. (I had gotten out between 1/00 and 3/03) Makes me and the DW quite nervous about fulfilling our early retirement plans, which had included frequent trips cross country to visit and be part our little Sadie's life.
Some beer or that PGA sounds good right now.
Larry
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:47 PM   #86
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I left this morning and drove 100 miles round trip to visit my step-father in his nursing home. He is in such bad shape and it was very depressing. He can't get out of bed, can't talk, has a feeding tube. I had to go in his bathroom and cry, so that he would not see me. I drove home feeling gloomy.
Sorry about your step father real tragedy is so much worse than this dow crisis.
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:59 PM   #87
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Sooo - my greed and lust meter as of 10/8 has Psssst - Wellesley at 4.93% SEC yield and climbing with todays leg down.

The Norwegian widow needs new shoes - so where do I chase uncutable(as in well covered) and possibly growing dividends?

I say this as my alma mater Da Dawgs(aka Washington Huskies) are in the cellar as well as the Saint's so it could be a long winter.

Yield chasing is probably warmer and more comfy than winter fishing.

heh heh heh - Even with a new pork plant in town - bacon coupons are skimpy.
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Old 10-09-2008, 08:35 PM   #88
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Out of curiosity, is brewing at home, once you know what you're doing and can make a good batch, cheaper than comparable wares?
Slightly OT but I'll comment. Used to homebrew regularly, from about '92 to '96, until the j*b responsibilities robbed me of the time required. I would say, from that ancient very dated experience you can homebrew for slightly less than buying. I was trying to get close to Sierra Nevada Pale Ale and Porter -- and did a respectful job of it. The aroma of black patent malt ...
In my opinoin, bottling is the most labor intensive phase. You really have to use some kind of keg system. I settled on the little mini-kegs with CO2 cartridge powered dispensing. Again, I have not done this in a very long time. Things may have changed since then.
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Old 10-09-2008, 08:45 PM   #89
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In my opinoin, bottling is the most labor intensive phase. You really have to use some kind of keg system. I settled on the little mini-kegs with CO2 cartridge powered dispensing. Again, I have not done this in a very long time. Things may have changed since then.
Haven't bottled in about 10 years. Cornelius kegs are where it is at.

The labor intensive bit for me is brew day. Doing all grain takes time, even with propane burners that look like something off the space shuttle. But since it is a labor of love, I don't mind the time. My oldest daughter even "helps."
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:30 PM   #90
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Yes. I figure I can make the equal of craft beer or better imports for about $12 to $15 a case, and I am not particularly efficient in my processes.
That sounds pretty accurate to me too. Haven't done it in a decade or so, but it's a great and rewarding way to keep your mind off the market.

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Could be worse. Remember 1929 to 1932?

Prohibition.
To slide even more off topic, I was talking to some friends yesterday whether this financial crisis might be the catalyst that would cause the political leaders to do something about that great cache of untaxed agricultural product - marihoochie. Legalization would throw tons of money into the system to offset the cost of the bailout. Plus the added advantages of soothing the angry voters, and improving the stock prices of the various junk food and munchies companies.
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:30 PM   #91
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Just looked at the DOW futures and more good news. Down 300
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:42 PM   #92
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Along with the futures down, Nikkei down 11%. I think tomorrow will be an absolute bloodbath and will continue until DOW under 5000
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:44 PM   #93
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The NIKKEI is down more than 10% tonight to 8200. The last time it was at that level was 1983!!! The NIKKEI peaked at 39000 in 1989. It has been all bad news ever since... I don't know, if I was Japanese I would have given up on stocks a long time ago. And I might give up on the market anyways since, as of tonight, I have not made one cent of profit since I started investing in stocks in 2000. Why take so much risk if I don't get rewarded for it?
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:49 PM   #94
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Dreamer - I have been investing since 16 (although small $) and three days ago officially underwater on investing (now 33) since I recently paid my mortgage off so I have been investing alot more in the last two years. At least this has been a lesson for me that I need better asset allocation as I am 100% equities due to my 20 year horizon to retirement. When/if we get a rally I will be rectifying that for sure. That's the only real bright side I see to all this for me at least.
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:19 PM   #95
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Just looked at the DOW futures and more good news. Down 300
Maybe that's a good thing. Start down and finish up for a change.

However, I think the DOW will trade down 1000 points intraday tomorrow.
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:33 PM   #96
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Just looked at the DOW futures and more good news. Down 300
I think we're at the point where we just need to get this panic crash over and done with. So super strong negative futures first thing might just give us the washout we really need.

I wonder how much all this has to do with the Lehman CDSs that come due for settlement tomorrow (10/10/08 ) and anticipation of jumbo losses (for financial institutions?). This stuff is over my head.

Audrey
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:33 PM   #97
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The NIKKEI is down more than 10% tonight to 8200. The last time it was at that level was 1983!!!
I don't think that is true. I bought EWJ early in this decade when the Nikkei had broken 8000 on the downside.

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Old 10-09-2008, 10:35 PM   #98
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Dreamer - I have been investing since 16 (although small $) and three days ago officially underwater on investing (now 33) since I recently paid my mortgage off so I have been investing alot more in the last two years. At least this has been a lesson for me that I need better asset allocation as I am 100% equities due to my 20 year horizon to retirement. When/if we get a rally I will be rectifying that for sure. That's the only real bright side I see to all this for me at least.
I already had what I thought was a pretty conservative AA for my age (34), 65% stocks / 35% cash and bonds. I am tired to keep pumping more of our hard earn money into a bottomless pit while wall street CEOs enjoy a great life with the money they stole from us their golden parachute.

I am losing trust in the stock market. I start to think that the deck is stacked against individual investors by wall street corruption and unregulated hedge funds who can make or break the market. Once I lose faith in the stock market, there will be no turning back. My parents and grand-parents retired without ever investing one cent in the stock market. Maybe they had it right all along.

I am just dejected right now. And a couple of beers didn't do a thing to calm me down.
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:41 PM   #99
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Drink a couple more and get back to us.

I'm saving up for tomorrow night(drinking).
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:42 PM   #100
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I am losing trust in the stock market. I start to think that the deck is stacked against individual investors by wall street corruption and unregulated hedge funds who can make or break the market. Once I lose faith in the stock market, there will be no turning back. My parents and grand-parents retired without ever investing one cent in the stock market. Maybe they had it right all along.
They did. And if you can find a career that will let you work 45 years in the same company, retire with a nice little pension, qualify for Medicare (if it is still solvent), then die in 5 or 10 years, go for it.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. This sucks, but it too will pass. I remember how depressing it was going through some of the other sucky times in my lifetime. And I freely admit this one is worse seemeing so far. But I am betting (everything I've got) that things will turn around, and eventually you'll regain all your losses, and even surpass your previous levels. Depending of course on your time frame.

I'm not giving you a hard time by any stretch of the imagination. And truly, if you can find something better than the markets to invest in, I'm willing to listen. But unless you are planning to retire in the next year or two, I'd advise quitting listening/watching the news so much. Find a (cheap) hobby and get lost in it. Volunteer your time to help others less fortunate than you. Do something besides dwelling on the news if it makes you feel so bad. Good luck to you.
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