Fired. And maybe FIREd?

[jayc]

Luckily I didn't move for this job. I started the job roughly 2.5 years ago.

I'm not sure if I will qualify for unemployment but I plan on applying if my former employer will ever tell me what my final vacation pay will be. They fired the HR person a long time ago so questions like these often go unanswered for long periods of time.

Sorry about your job loss. You have skill sets that are in demand and apparantly a smart guy with 2 degrees. I would not wait on HR. Call the 800 number or visit the web site for your state and file. Get the ball rolling and let the state unemployment agency decide if you qualify for benefits. Good luck, stay positive, and execute your plans.

 

[FUEGO]

Good luck on whatever path you choose. However, I must point out the above inconsistency. If $8k plus DW's salary matches living expenses, then continuing to save 40% of her salary will no longer be an option or living expenses have to drop significantly.

I'm not sure there is an inconsistency. DW's take home salary is after deductions for 401k and HSA. She won't change the withholding for either (they will still be maxed out). So her take home pay (which will remain the same) plus $8k/yr in divs will meet our cash flow needs for expenses.

The 8k/yr dividends is technically a withdrawal from our portfolio so that 40% may overstate what the net we are saving will be. In any event, we'll still be saving a lot of money each year.

 

[FUEGO]

Sorry about your job loss. You have skill sets that are in demand and apparantly a smart guy with 2 degrees. I would not wait on HR. Call the 800 number or visit the web site for your state and file. Get the ball rolling and let the state unemployment agency decide if you qualify for benefits. Good luck, stay positive, and execute your plans.

I think I'm going to do that. There is a box you fill in for vacation leave payouts, which I don't know yet. There is also a box where you can explain things. Someone else told me you just report the vacation payout whenever you get it and it excludes you from eligibility for that week. I'm new to all this, and don't want to get hit with any fraud allegations for misreporting.

 

[FUEGO]

I had a doctor's appointment today to use my health insurance while it is still available. After this month (or maybe next month - HR doesn't know) my health insurance goes away and I'm on DW's high deductible plan.

Blood pressure is down significantly and I may be off the meds completely soon. I imagine it is two factors causing this sudden change: less stress from dealing with work issues, and getting more exercise every day.

 

[Meadbh]

Wow, Fuego, that's a shock! Thank goodness you and DW have been LBYM. You will be able to make lemonade out of this lemon better than most. I'm sure this is a temporary hiatus for you, so be positive and enjoy it!

 

[pb4uski]

...The 8k/yr dividends is technically a withdrawal from our portfolio so that 40% may overstate what the net we are saving will be. In any event, we'll still be saving a lot of money each year.

Sorry to hear of your job loss but you are FI and well prepared that allows you to have options as to what to do. Nice place to be given the cards you have been dealt.

I would say the $8k a year is NOT a withdrawal. It is income that you previously reinvested but are now deciding to spend instead of reinvesting.

 

[ohyes]

Hey FUEGO,

Just read through this thread. Sorry the jerks did this to you, but happy for your future.

As somebody else said, having your helpmate home taking care of the house and kids while you work is HUGE. My last year of work, DH was retired and took care of all the cleaning, laundry and most of the cooking. I found that I wanted to cook some great meals on the weekends when i was not having to cook.

And also as somebody else said (no original thoughts here), it is great that you hit the ground running. You know you will soon look back and be so happy it worked out like this and you did not stay with that place a day longer. You may wish you had quit but, hey, it's the end result that counts.

 

[eytonxav]

Sorry to hear about this, its sucks. Stay positive, file for your unemployment, and start you job search/networking ASAP and I'm sure good things will happen.

 

[Texas Proud]

I think I'm going to do that. There is a box you fill in for vacation leave payouts, which I don't know yet. There is also a box where you can explain things. Someone else told me you just report the vacation payout whenever you get it and it excludes you from eligibility for that week. I'm new to all this, and don't want to get hit with any fraud allegations for misreporting.

When I got let go from mega a number of years back.... I got severance pay.... but for reporting purposes for unemployment it did not count (don't know why)....

When filling out the info, they asked if you were getting money for WORKING... they even asked the last day you did actual work for the company... IOW, the day they escorted you out the door.... not the last day they paid you.

We have had the state call us up for some people who were let go where I work..... they asked questions like "did they get severance", "did they have to sign anything to get the severance".... so they will get with the company to find out any extra info they need....

 

[2B]

We have had the state call us up for some people who were let go where I work..... they asked questions like "did they get severance", "did they have to sign anything to get the severance".... so they will get with the company to find out any extra info they need....

Part of my last severance agreement was that I don't apply for unemployment. Since I got six months of pay, it was worth several years of unemployment insurance. I had gotten laid off before with severance and was reemployed immediately -- never missed a day of income and got to pocket the severance. Unfortunately, I was without meaningful income for almost 16 months. That was a long time ago when UE insurance was 26 weeks.

 

[2B]

I had a doctor's appointment today to use my health insurance while it is still available. After this month (or maybe next month - HR doesn't know) my health insurance goes away and I'm on DW's high deductible plan.

Blood pressure is down significantly and I may be off the meds completely soon. I imagine it is two factors causing this sudden change: less stress from dealing with work issues, and getting more exercise every day.

Legally, your health insurance and other benefits end at the end of the month your employment ends. I doubt you will get an extension; and if you appear to get one, you'll probably have the claim denied retroactively.

Your vacation payout should be on your last check unless they are complete idiots in your former payroll group. A layoff should be well orchestrated and everything should be clean. It might be different if you were fired suddenly. Your vacation pay should not effect your unemployment claim but it's worth asking the UE office about. Your state's laws may be different than Texas.

Representing people with traffic tickets? That's got to be damn close to the bottom of the legal profession. We paid $100 (I think) for one my DW got and that attorney had 3 or 4 people each traffic court session. We had to go to traffic court 4 times. He wasn't making much per hour from what I saw.

 

[Maenad]

Congratulations! No. not congratulations on getting laid off but congratulations for having the plan in place so that a layoff is not seeming to cause you too much trouble.

That's where I'm coming down on this - it's great that you can deal with this as a temporary setback rather than a crisis.

Enjoy your time off!

 

[FUEGO]

Legally, your health insurance and other benefits end at the end of the month your employment ends. I doubt you will get an extension; and if you appear to get one, you'll probably have the claim denied retroactively.

I don't plan on using the health insurance after Aug 31, since I assume they will cut it off then. My last day was either Aug 23 or 26, I'm not sure (verbally the 26th, the letter says 23rd ??). I can't believe this organization of 20000 employees with a whole floor dedicated to HR can't get a simple termination processed correctly and communicate in a timely manner what will happen (they had a week internally to figure it out). Oh wait I can believe it! Funny that the last place I worked (with only 18 employees and no full time HR staff) was on the ball with only 4 days notice from me, had everything put together in a nice package and it was clear what I was receiving and when I would receive it.

Your vacation payout should be on your last check unless they are complete idiots in your former payroll group. A layoff should be well orchestrated and everything should be clean. It might be different if you were fired suddenly. Your vacation pay should not effect your unemployment claim but it's worth asking the UE office about. Your state's laws may be different than Texas.

I'm going to finish my unemployment application today with the information I have available and see what happens. If I wait on the bozos at former employer to get their act together it could be 2 more weeks, or 4 or 6 or...

Representing people with traffic tickets? That's got to be damn close to the bottom of the legal profession. We paid $100 (I think) for one my DW got and that attorney had 3 or 4 people each traffic court session. We had to go to traffic court 4 times. He wasn't making much per hour from what I saw.

Re: traffic court - that's plan D or E at this point! Local guys net around $80-100/ticket for speeding tickets, more for aggravated speeding (school zone, work zone, etc). 2-3 speeding cases per week would go a long way toward paying our bare bones expenses. That's probably 5 hrs per week max plus whatever effort I spend on marketing and getting business. Not huge money but not horrible either based on what I was making previously (albeit a guaranteed 40 hrs with crappy benefits).

 

[Delaney]

I'm so sorry you were let go. Even if finances are ok this will be a trying time. Each state is different for unemployment and there have been some changes in the last few years. If you have specific questions, I recommend you post them to this City Data Unemployment Forum. There are a few people that monitor that forum that are very helpful. You will probably need to wait to file until your last vacation payment, but after than sooner is better than later.

I think that once the dust has cleared, you may find this is a blessing in disguise, but it will be difficult for the next few weeks. Please take care and make sure you do thoroughly think out any choices you make. For example, you don't want to accept the wrong job offer.

 

[FUEGO]

I'm so sorry you were let go. Even if finances are ok this will be a trying time. Each state is different for unemployment and there have been some changes in the last few years. If you have specific questions, I recommend you post them to this City Data Unemployment Forum. There are a few people that monitor that forum that are very helpful. You will probably need to wait to file until your last vacation payment, but after than sooner is better than later.

I think that once the dust has cleared, you may find this is a blessing in disguise, but it will be difficult for the next few weeks. Please take care and make sure you do thoroughly think out any choices you make. For example, you don't want to accept the wrong job offer.

I'll check that link out, thanks.

I'm definitely on board with the "don't accept the wrong job offer". I have the resources to wait for a reasonable job with reasonable pay and reasonable benefits.

 

[ziggy29]

Real bummer, sorry to hear it. (Been there, done that a few months ago.)

Glad to hear you're in a position to weather it indefinitely. This is the nice reassurance that comes with a combination of LBYM and aggressively funding retirement -- knowing that even if it was a little sooner than you expected, you're not hit with something that becomes a financial emergency.

And as for the future, it's wide open. Never say never, and it sounds like your situation doesn't require you taking something that isn't *right* for you out of desperation. In that sense, our situations are quite similar. I'm working three hours a week (Saturday morning) at a nearby post office and while I'm not actively looking for anything more, I will keep my eyes and ears open. I do know I never plan to work full-time ever again, and I never want to be in the corporate world ever again.

My personal suggestion would be to take a couple months off -- completely off -- as a "pre-retirement sabbatical", see how the finances are holding up, and just go with the flow of where life and opportunities take you. You may find (as I am) that doing without a few "things" is a small price to pay to not have to drag your butt to w*rk every morning. If you ever find yourself feeling deprived of something because your lower income can't support it, ask yourself: Would you rather have it and go back to w*rk or do without?

 

[ls99]

Being out has some benefits. Time to think, play, practice retirement. Given your financials it is not a bad situation.

Lots of options, in a few months I'm sure you'll have it figured out. Can't rush these things.

FWIW I had several multi year breaks between j*bs. They were great for mental health purposes, and I was financailly in dismal positions each time, ex: one meal a day for months. Yet they were really good times.

 

[CCdaCE]

Sucks at the abruptness of it, but, perhaps the rug getting yanked out from under you is a blessing in disguise if you ever found yourself suffering from the one more year syndrome. As you eluded to, your finances seem to be in order, which would lend me to feeling fairly comfortable.

Selfish of me, but, I'd be interested in hearing how your next employer treats you with regards to salary in this economy. If your last job was well paying, do they cut your wage to see how you perform and then give you a bump after a year or what. Or do they pay what the market bears right away. Pay you very little because they have 100 applicants, or what? One paltry data point.

-CC

 

[Dreamer]

It must have been such a shock to be let go so abruptly. I went through a reduction in force when I worked for DOD, but we knew about it in plenty of time and DOD had another job that I went to the next day.

It is so nice to hear that you are so financially prepared for this and I am sure that it is a great help to have you at home for the time being. It sounds like you won't be unemployed for long. Enjoy it while it lasts!

 

[FUEGO]

Selfish of me, but, I'd be interested in hearing how your next employer treats you with regards to salary in this economy. If your last job was well paying, do they cut your wage to see how you perform and then give you a bump after a year or what. Or do they pay what the market bears right away. Pay you very little because they have 100 applicants, or what? One paltry data point.

I have been talking to multiple firms that are looking to expand and the numbers being thrown around would be a 15-25+% raise from where I was. That was when I was fully employed. I'll be curious to see if they negotiate harder since I don't currently have a job. The places I'm looking are all saying "we are slammed right now and need people bad". Things seem to be pretty hot in this little sector right now.

Where I was at before was grossly underpaid government work where, among other things, I oversaw a ton of consultants that all made more or way more than me. The government employer had provided a 1% raise in total over the last 5 years all the while increasing health insurance premiums 7-8% per year for family coverage (= net decrease in nominal wages after insurance premiums each year). I had grumbled 1-2x to my new manager that "I can't stay here forever at these wages, and you have the authority to adjust my compensation". Maybe he didn't like that I wasn't a team player!

 

[jclarksnakes]

I have been thinking about this for a couple days. Uhoh, the old snake guy is thinking again! I know you were already planning for really early retirement. Maybe this layoff is actually the best thing that could have happened to you. Now you have the chance to see what it would be like to stay at home for your kids. I know lots of people including a younger me would have trouble with the seemingly reversed work/parental roles and your wife might resent going to work while you stay home. You could discuss it with her and let her know that at any time she could cast the one vote that counts and send you back to the work world. She may find that you being at home could make her life and work easier and also would of course be good for the kids. You have LOTS of options. Spend some time picking the best one.

 

[Walt34]

DW even asked me once if I would mind being a "kept man", to which I responded "HELL NO. Let's get a pool, and I'll be a damn pool boy!" Of course, I have no experience in that world, so we'll see how it actually works out (at least I hope to!).

That's about where I am with it too. When DW was finishing up her BA a few years ago I told her that if she got a job I'd have no problem staying home and when she got home from work greeting her at the door with a kiss, a glass of wine, a "How was your day, dear?" and dinner on the table. So far it hasn't worked out that way.

In all seriousness you sound like you're in good shape and have the luxury of time to be picky about where, when, or even if you get another job.

If something falls in my lap I'd consider it but admittedly I'm not out pounding the bricks every day.

I've talked with a few guys from where I used to work and I sure was right to leave. Things are the pits there, chaos reigns, and everyone is working 50+ hour weeks. It is understatement to say that people there are not happy campers.

Ah, the benefits of LBYM!

 

[CCdaCE]

I have been talking to multiple firms that are looking to expand and the numbers being thrown around would be a 15-25+% raise from where I was. That was when I was fully employed. I'll be curious to see if they negotiate harder since I don't currently have a job. The places I'm looking are all saying "we are slammed right now and need people bad". Things seem to be pretty hot in this little sector right now.

Where I was at before was grossly underpaid government work where, among other things, I oversaw a ton of consultants that all made more or way more than me. The government employer had provided a 1% raise in total over the last 5 years all the while increasing health insurance premiums 7-8% per year for family coverage (= net decrease in nominal wages after insurance premiums each year). I had grumbled 1-2x to my new manager that "I can't stay here forever at these wages, and you have the authority to adjust my compensation". Maybe he didn't like that I wasn't a team player!

Ahh. Interesting on the wages.

Maybe you couldn't get a raise since he didn't want you making more than him. "Wage compression" was a problem for awhile at my org. Couldn't give the little guy much of a raise because the big whigs weren't making much more. Or at least that's the excuse they gave us. Luckily they went through and readjusted from the top, not bottom up.

-CC

 

[FUEGO]

Ahh. Interesting on the wages.

Maybe you couldn't get a raise since he didn't want you making more than him. "Wage compression" was a problem for awhile at my org. Couldn't give the little guy much of a raise because the big whigs weren't making much more. Or at least that's the excuse they gave us. Luckily they went through and readjusted from the top, not bottom up.

-CC

Fortunately for my former boss, he was making double what I was making. All my peers were making $12-17k more than me for similar positions. All I was asking for was to be brought up the $12-17k.

At my old consulting firm (similar to where you were at I believe) we had the same wage compression that limited the lower level staff from getting raises.

 

[robbridg]

One word of warning. Not working can become habit forming.

Just what I was going to post.

The longer you're out the harder it might be to want to get back to the grind. That's how I feel anyway being out 7 months now.