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Old 01-08-2008, 11:01 PM   #21
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Let's get practical here. I have a charm bracelet with a high gold content. Know an honest assayer who buys those things?
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Old 01-09-2008, 02:49 AM   #22
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Coins (gold and silver) and a smaller percentage of mining stocks have crept up to about 5% of my holdings. Only reason I picked some up in 2004 was because of my mildly gold bug dad who wouldn't let me sleep until I did. Thanks dad. Normally I'd reallocate but I'm holding for now since helicopter Ben and Washington seem intent on keeping the money presses going to avoid recession at all costs. When they seriously talk about bringing in a "Paul Volcker" type to shore up the dollar I'll dump. I fully appreciate that it's mostly a lousy emotional investment that only does well in those few unsettled times, and takes a bit more stomach (and luck) than your basic index fund.
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Old 01-09-2008, 03:10 AM   #23
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About three decades ago, I accumulated a few hundred ounces of silver in 10 oz bars. Put them in the basement with some guns and war surplus rations. What was I thinking?

I paid between $9 and $11 dollars an oz. Today it's worth about $15 an oz. Gee, I wonder if I would have been better off putting that several thousand bux into an MF?

Oh well..... Despite my propensity to do dumb stuff like that, I still found some way to get to FIRE!
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Old 01-09-2008, 03:33 AM   #24
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Bought Exchange traded bullion at USD 736 an ounce about 6 months ago. Now at USD 885.80. Not gloating, but not complaining either.
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Old 01-09-2008, 09:24 AM   #25
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Check w/ your local scrap metals dealer. I worked w/ one recently that would buy anything from old junk cars by the hundredweight up to pure gold bullion by the ounce. And they would give pretty close to market price minus a small fee. Silver, copper and everything else, too. I never asked about silver and gold, but copper was getting spot market price minus about 10 cents per pound. That reflects about a 3% commission when copper was at ~$3/lb. My guess is the commission would be even less on higher value metals (they are easier to move and don't require 18-wheelers to haul off a few dozen tons). The scrap metal guy I worked with would resell them to precious metals specialists that I suppose would melt them down and resell them.
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Old 01-09-2008, 12:03 PM   #26
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Quote:
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Let's get practical here. I have a charm bracelet with a high gold content. Know an honest assayer who buys those things?
If you no longer care for it, wouldn't it be worth more as jewelry than scrap? Or are the charms too particular to your interests?

Ha
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Forget gold
Old 01-09-2008, 04:08 PM   #27
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Forget gold

Buy rare metals. When I checked, several years ago, I discovered that chemically-pure Rhodium sold for $30,000 a kilo. If you looked at the product, it would appear to be a dull gray metallic powder, strored in a screw-cap plastic jar. Or look at Iridium. Buy ingots of Lithium.

Easily sold on the industrial open market.

Everyone wants gold, but it's bulky, easily recognized and far too easily stolen. Who wants that pastic jar of powder under your workshop, on the floor?
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Old 01-09-2008, 04:34 PM   #28
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Buy rare metals. When I checked, several years ago, I discovered that chemically-pure Rhodium sold for $30,000 a kilo. If you looked at the product, it would appear to be a dull gray metallic powder, strored in a screw-cap plastic jar. Or look at Iridium. Buy ingots of Lithium.

Easily sold on the industrial open market.

Everyone wants gold, but it's bulky, easily recognized and far too easily stolen. Who wants that pastic jar of powder under your workshop, on the floor?
had to check:
So at $875/ounce a kilo of gold is worth $30,861

Other than my pants falling off i recon i could put a 1/2 kilo of gold in each front pocket (happy to see me, or...)

Granted, gold looks a whole lot like gold, thus theftworthy, but is the industrial metals market that easy to access?
1 kilogram = 35.2739619 ounces

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Old 01-10-2008, 01:12 AM   #29
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If you no longer care for it, wouldn't it be worth more as jewelry than scrap? Or are the charms too particular to your interests?

Ha
The charms are mementos from my early 20s (Brandenburg Gate, Eiffel Tower, Statue of Liberty). I am in my late 60s and haven't warn it in years. Too chunky.

I suppose I could have some one weigh it and determine it's volume, then put it on E-Bay.
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Old 01-10-2008, 03:11 PM   #30
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... all the "Yeah, but how about return since 1980" is ridiculous.
this comment has been nagging me ... with g*ld often touted as an "investment" which provides a "store of value" and as a "hedge against inflation", how is it that consideration of it's 28 year performance history be not only irrelevant, but "ridiculous"?
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Old 01-10-2008, 03:25 PM   #31
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this comment has been nagging me ... with g*ld often touted as an "investment" which provides a "store of value" and as a "hedge against inflation", how is it that consideration of it's 28 year performance history be not only irrelevant, but "ridiculous"?
Because the 1980 starting date is chosen deliberately to make gold look bad. I am no apologist for gold; I own very little. But as it says in my post above, from the time gold was freed from price controls until now it has returned a compound 9% pa.

Additionally, it is very easy to trade long term swings. It is completely safe from bankruptcy, so when it is cheap no need to stress about "Will it survive?"

You just buy it when most everyone tells you how stupid it is to be a buyer, and sell it when these same people want to go heavy long. IMO we arenít there yet, though we may possibly be close to done for a while.

The only reason I don't own much is that all the recent financial turmoil has I believe created more certain and more dynamic opportunities over the intermediate term.
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Old 01-10-2008, 04:37 PM   #32
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I suppose I could have some one weigh it and determine it's volume, then put it on E-Bay.

You may get more from selling it to a jeweler than on ebay .I've sold some gold to those places that advertise in the newspaper . They weigh it and give you the price not sure it was the best price but it was easy and I was satisfied .Ebay can be fickel before I'd list on ebay I'd see what gold charm bracelets are going for .
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Old 01-10-2008, 08:24 PM   #33
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Because the 1980 starting date is chosen deliberately to make gold look bad.
exactly; and it does.
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Old 01-10-2008, 09:09 PM   #34
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Buy ingots of Lithium.
I don't think you want to store Li in your workshop!
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Old 01-10-2008, 09:14 PM   #35
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Actually, if you throw out the 1980 stuff, there isnt a whole lot of goodness in the gold story. After its "untethering" and associated rise as people who wanted to own it became owners and it found its own "level", it pretty much went sideways to down, losing ground to inflation much like cash would have.

Whatever it used to be, and whatever emotional attachment people have to it for whatever reason, its neither an inflation fighter nor a "store of value".

But I guess you can own some and rebalance out of it during the crazy years when it doubles up. Not sure you'd make enough out of that to offset the 20 years standing around waiting for it to do something. Since we just had a couple of those crazy years, now wouldnt be my idea of a good time to jump in.

As a part of a larger commodities bundle where its a chunk of a chunk of your AA, probably wont hurt you much.
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Old 01-10-2008, 09:32 PM   #36
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Al I get from this wisdom is that I had better scrape up some money and get more gold.

Ha
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Old 01-11-2008, 11:00 AM   #37
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go for it! no one's stoppin' ya.
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Old 01-11-2008, 05:24 PM   #38
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problem for gold was it fell off the radar as a serious asset class for decades. in fact except for speculators i dont think until recently it ever was a asset class for the masses so to speak. hense the poor performance. i think now thats its back as a viable asset class one should reconsider having some, the same way we have reits or high yield bonds. until the last 2 years i had no desire to even consider commodities but now i feel they do have a place .

i think going forward they will be just as a viable class as anything else in the major catagories
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Old 01-11-2008, 05:34 PM   #39
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Uh, anyone have a picture of that stuffed beaver from the late 90's etrade commercial telling the guy in the cabin to buy some tech stocks?
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Old 01-11-2008, 05:37 PM   #40
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probley no more silly than us buying stocks now, looking in retrospeck if the markets fall 40% this year.
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