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Old 12-05-2009, 12:01 PM   #41
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FIREdreamer is a notable exception planning to double it in next 2
I have a good reason for that, i.e. a large number of stock options vesting rapidly over the next 3 years.
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Old 12-05-2009, 06:29 PM   #42
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If we use the rule of 56 (years x interest to double an investment) then doubling NW in 4 years would approximate to a 14% annual increase. This should be achievable during accumulation years with aggressive contributions to the portfolio and a single digit positive return on investment.
This is new to me. I know the rule of 72 (72/interest rate in % = years to double). This gives 5 and change years at 14%.

Can you point me to something describing the 56 rule? Google can't.

Thanks
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:43 PM   #43
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After 30 years in private law practice, I have to say that it sucks the life out of you. It is quite a siren song though. About midway through my years in practice I considered switching careers, actually went to school part time at night and became licensed in another more interesting, but low paid, field. I ended up not switching and decided to have more children (thereby wanting more income).

I contrast my work to that of DH. DH works for a megacorp in a job that on the surface pays much less than mine. But...he has wonderful benefits (it is his pension lump sum that will allow us to retire). And, he gets 7 weeks of time off every year. When he, say, gets sick, he takes the days off and when he goes back to work...well, he goes back to work. He doesn't have to make up the time. He might have a time sensitive project that he would have to put in extra time to get out but even that is rare.

On the other hand, in private practice, there is the constant pressure of billing enough hours. If I get sick, it is expected that I nonetheless bill the same amount as someone who wasn't sick. On paper I don't have a specific amount of vacation time that I can take during the year. I can take whatever I want. Some people here that and think that is wonderful. What they don't understand is that it really means that I don't get vacation...I just get to time shift. Whether I take 2 weeks of vacation or 0 weeks or 6 weeks -- I still have to bill the same amount.

DH and I figured out how many hours he is actually expected to work during the year. It works out to about 1500 hours. His employer is very happy with that level of work. If I billed 1500 hours that would be considered terrible.

I have considered asking to work less hours for less pay. However, we are so close to retirement that I probably won't. If I was going to continue working 3 or more years I probably would but I think we are closer to retirement than that.
Your DH's schedule is a lot like mine. I get 21 days of paid time off a year, plus a large number of holidays. In my company, people respect the fact that you're on PTO. As long as you have some sort of coverage for your projects, people won't bother you until you get back. My pay is probably half of what I could make in private practice, but as you point out, I would definitely "earn" the extra money. Fortunately, my wife earns as much (and sometimes more) than I do. Her schedule is transaction-based, not hours-based. As a result, we both generally have the time to do the things we want (e.g., go to the gym 4-5 days a week), and we both still get to spend time with our daughter in the evenings and on weekends (daycare while we both work). This is why I am reluctant to chase the money. Children are young only once.

I read the following on another message board a few years ago: "You can bill your time, but you can never buy it back."
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Old 12-06-2009, 12:46 PM   #44
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This is new to me. I know the rule of 72 (72/interest rate in % = years to double). This gives 5 and change years at 14%.

Can you point me to something describing the 56 rule? Google can't.

Thanks
My error, apologies! You are correct, the rule is of 72. So going back to the original problem, which was the rate of increase generating a doubling of NW within 4 years, that would be 18%. Still achievable early in a career with aggressive savings.
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Old 12-06-2009, 01:00 PM   #45
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Our NW doubling rate (includes our house):

$100 to $200 in about 3 yrs
$200 to $400 in about 2 yrs
$400 to $800 in about 4 yrs

Various factors I think make it difficult to truly predict how long it will take to reach a milestone - not the least of which is a major market downturn...
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(49, married; DH 53. I am fully retired as of 2015 (well ok, I still work part-time but only because I love the job and have complete freedom to call off if I want to travel with hubby for work), DH hopes to fully retire 2018 when he turns 55 to access 401K penalty-free...although he may decide to do part-time consulting)
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Old 12-06-2009, 01:02 PM   #46
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Our NW doubling rate (includes our house):

$100 to $200 in about 3 yrs
$200 to $400 in about 2 yrs
$400 to $800 in about 4 yrs

Various factors I think make it difficult to truly predict how long it will take to reach a milestone - not the least of which is a major market downturn...
Glad to see you're doing so well.....can you tell me where I can buy a house for less than $800?

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Old 12-06-2009, 01:09 PM   #47
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Glad to see you're doing so well.....can you tell me where I can buy a house for less than $800?




We sure did downsize didn't we?
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Old 12-06-2009, 01:12 PM   #48
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We sure did downsize didn't we?
Hey, I knew the housing market in the US was down, but sheesh!
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Old 12-06-2009, 02:19 PM   #49
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Glad to see you're doing so well.....can you tell me where I can buy a house for less than $800?


Detroit?
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Old 12-06-2009, 05:39 PM   #50
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I second what Katsmeow says about private practice law. It can be a very stressful career - very long hours, no control over your schedule (including weekends and evenings/nights), etc etc etc. There are people who thrive in this sort of environment and I used to be one of them - once we had children I found I did not have the flexibility to do everything I wanted without sacrificing something that was important to me. Sure the money is good - very good in fact - and it will enable me and my wife to retire in my mid-40s - but sometimes I really wonder if it is worth it. Ask me again as I walk out the door for the last time on 31/12/2013 and I will probably say yes. Right now I'm not so sure.
I guess I am lucky that I have gotten myself into a position that we can achieve FIRE by age 40 in my current non-law field, or 37 if I switch to a significantly higher paying legal position. Either way it is very early and I really question if it is worth sacrificing so much for the next 7 years just to exit the workforce a little earlier. Maybe I will end up trying the high paying firm position for a while to cut my teeth and then work my way into something less stressful (in house/govt).

Or maybe I can just retire on what I have now and persuade the young DW to relocate our family to Mexico/Thailand!
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Old 12-06-2009, 07:32 PM   #51
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My wife did private practice law (not her firm) for a couple years and quickly decided that's not the life she wanted. Switched to working for the city, 40 hours per week, 18 days paid vacation per year, no worky from home/weekends/evenings, pension that's a pretty good deal even if she doesn't work to full retirement age, etc. was an easy trade off.
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Old 12-07-2009, 10:01 PM   #52
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Thanks all for the responses. Seeing how quickly people jump from one milestone to the next is definitely motivating and exciting for young dreamers like myself. It can a little while starting out but I think I'm getting closer to the snowball effect
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Old 12-08-2009, 04:13 PM   #53
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Thanks all for the responses. Seeing how quickly people jump from one milestone to the next is definitely motivating and exciting for young dreamers like myself. It can a little while starting out but I think I'm getting closer to the snowball effect
Good thread, and if it has helped motivate you, then even better - best of luck to you going forward.
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Old 12-08-2009, 06:43 PM   #54
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My EW's divorce attorney was the first to point out that our net worth was over 1M.... My net worth was just under 500K a few months later...
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Old 12-09-2009, 08:19 PM   #55
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Interesting question.

I was given a nice push through an IPO when I was 32. That put me north of 1MM for the first time. (2001)

I hit 2MM briefly in 2002 due to the performance of that same stock, but it was short lived. I'm guessing I re-crossed the 2MM in 2003 or 2004, and crossed 4MM in 2007 or early 08. I dipped below 4 during the recent downturn but have since recovered.

I say I'm guessing because I'm away from my home computer and spreadsheets.
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:13 AM   #56
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Exactly the analysis I conducted when I turned down the higher paying job. From 2000-2005, I slaved away at a big law firm for the big bucks (or what I thought were big bucks; the firm paid on the low end of the BIGLAW scale). Four years later, I now make the same money serving as in-house counsel for a Fortune 500, with a great deal less stress. No suits, no need for a luxury car, reasonable hours (no weekends), etc.... With a new daughter (6 weeks old), staying put is probably my best bet.
Years ago had young kids and a big job offer to consider with a lot of stress/travel. While driving to a meeting to give my answer on the offer, the song "Cats In The Cradle" played on the radio.

That made my mind up. Turned the job down. Spent last decade seeing kids nearly every day after school. Best move I never made....

Harry Chapin - Cats In The Cradle Lyrics
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:32 AM   #57
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Years ago had young kids and a big job offer to consider with a lot of stress/travel. While driving to a meeting to give my answer on the offer, the song "Cats In The Cradle" played on the radio.

That made my mind up. Turned the job down. Spent last decade seeing kids nearly every day after school. Best move I never made....

Harry Chapin - Cats In The Cradle Lyrics
Great song and I've always tried to keep a good balance with travel but it can be hard at times. In the Winter of '88 I'd decided that the 2 year assignment I'd taken to the USA was wearing me out and that I wouldn't renew my option in a few months and stay on for another year. I said this to the kids at breakfast one morning (they were aged 8 & 6) and they were shocked - " but we love it here, we want to stay". DW said "but your Daddie is away from home half the time". "That's okay", they said, "we'll manage".

As it happens, 6 months later I found another assignment in the USA with MUCH less travel so we all ended up happy.
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