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Old 06-07-2013, 09:07 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by audreyh1 View Post
Not sure why not, but as one who has paid AMT some years because my cap gain income was much higher than my ordinary income, I know that you can start paying it when cap gains/qual divs crosses that $80.8K threshold. It doesn't actually "show up" until it exceeds the ordinary income tax. So unless your ordinary income tax is super low, you might not see it. It really depends on your income mix.
looks like I didn't go far enough.........with 8.5K in ordinary income and 240K in
LTCG, no AMT. At 270K LTCG, AMT just starting to appear. Using single, over 65.
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Old 06-07-2013, 09:32 AM   #62
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Thanks.......had not seen that one. Why do you think it is better?
I didn't see an input for muni interest on this one either and I didn't see a way to break out the AMT to see if it was zero or non.
Has less lime green and I like playing with the sliders on screen #2.
Seriously, though, can't you open last years turbotax or whatever and create a new filing for taxpayerX Will that break out AMT for you?
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:43 AM   #63
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You just can't help yourself from being judgmental, can you? But one thing I think we might agree on is that, as a society, Americans are very generous compared to the rest of the world.
And you can't help making personal attacks, can you?

At least we agree on something. Peace out!
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:13 AM   #64
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And you can't help making personal attacks, can you?

At least we agree on something. Peace out!
If you don't want judgmental responses, then it might help to leave out the judgmental comments, like what 'real Americans' should do, etc.

There are many ways that people can contribute to society. They can donate their time, their dollars, their skills. Some might create a business that employs thousands and makes useful products that enhance people's lives. In some cases, that business person might do more measurable good for society with no 'donations' of time/money in the usual sense, than others. Why judge them on a single metric? Why judge at all?

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Old 06-07-2013, 11:56 AM   #65
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Is 3,850 posts before one uses the "Ignore List" feature good, bad or indifferent?
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:07 PM   #66
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If you don't want judgmental responses, then it might help to leave out the judgmental comments, like what 'real Americans' should do, etc.

There are many ways that people can contribute to society. They can donate their time, their dollars, their skills. Some might create a business that employs thousands and makes useful products that enhance people's lives. In some cases, that business person might do more measurable good for society with no 'donations' of time/money in the usual sense, than others. Why judge them on a single metric? Why judge at all?

-ERD50
Exactly, in some countries, they vote to have high taxes so that many of the services provided here through charities are provided through their governments. Their choices.
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:27 PM   #67
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Exactly, in some countries, they vote to have high taxes so that many of the services provided here through charities are provided through their governments. Their choices.
Actually, in most high tax societies, these services mainly have been sent back to the same social groups that are paying them. This is changing with mass immigration of different groups who usually are very slow to adopt the social ethos of these formerly very homogeneously middle class societies, so welfare increasingly takes on the role it has historically held in America- mostly a transfer from some groups to others.

This is why there is so much struggle in Europe today that has largely been quiescent since the labor movements of 1st half of the 20th century. Das Kapital was written about the struggle between labor, and owners of capital. This seems quaint today. Today's labor movement is mostly elite worker government employee unions against the taxpayer; while the struggle over transfer payments, to the extent that there is a struggle, has little to do with labor, as most of the regular recipients are hardly interested in doing any labor.

Ha
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:31 PM   #68
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Is 3,850 posts before one uses the "Ignore List" feature good, bad or indifferent?
Don't worry, you'll get better at it!

btw, you can still choose to view an individual post of a person you've ignored if you can't help it. I find that the effort reminds me that I've ignored the person and not to respond even if it does still push my buttons.
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:53 PM   #69
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But one thing I think we might agree on is that, as a society, Americans are very generous compared to the rest of the world.
Sorry I don't agree. America and Americans certainly give to charity and the US aid budget is biggest. But should we look at total amount of charity, the amount given per citizen or just the percentage of citizens that give. I don't see Americans as inherently more charitable than any other country. Even the tendency to express exceptionalism isn't uniquely American.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:14 PM   #70
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Exactly, in some countries, they vote to have high taxes so that many of the services provided here through charities are provided through their governments. Their choices.
True.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:21 PM   #71
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looks like I didn't go far enough.........with 8.5K in ordinary income and 240K in
LTCG, no AMT. At 270K LTCG, AMT just starting to appear. Using single, over 65.
Interesting - and surprising!
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:25 PM   #72
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Is 3,850 posts before one uses the "Ignore List" feature good, bad or indifferent?
You attacked me personally -- twice (calling me "holier-than-thou” and judgmental). That, IMO is very different from expressing an opinion or judgment about an issue or a fictitious individual as I did.

I could have "ignored" you for doing that but I hoped you'd get the message when I called it out the first time. Maybe moderators can do a better job at it. I rarely "ignore" members here.

Be well.
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Old 06-07-2013, 02:51 PM   #73
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......... I rarely "ignore" members here............
Try it, you will like it.
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Old 06-07-2013, 05:24 PM   #74
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Is 3,850 posts before one uses the "Ignore List" feature good, bad or indifferent?
Well, that's a judgement call.
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Old 06-07-2013, 06:14 PM   #75
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Maybe moderators can do a better job at it. I rarely "ignore" members here.
Learning to ignore what some people say is a skill I acquired at work and often apply at family get-togethers.

Come on, folks. Lets take a step back, a deep breath, and remember we're friends who can disagree but stay friends.
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Old 06-07-2013, 06:44 PM   #76
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Some data from the tax calculator: MFJ (both >65), std deduction

for a given level of ordinary income, about how much CG to start getting AMT?

ord. inc. CG for AMT
10K 365K
100K 145K
150K 85K
285K 0K

The higher the ordinary income, the less CG it takes to be affected by AMT.
Kind of makes sense qualitatively since the higher total incomes get affected more esp. since the AMT exemption gets reduced and then phased out completely at higher incomes............ some of us peasants rarely see AMT so for those of you who volunteered info about AMT.........your secret is out Now we know where to go for handouts.........
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Old 06-07-2013, 07:13 PM   #77
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Speaking of tax calculators

Tax Foundation's Tax Policy Calculator

is very good. It actually takes into account of different scenarios and estimates what the tax brackets would be in 2014 as they are adjusted for inflation.
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:32 PM   #78
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You attacked me personally -- twice (calling me "holier-than-thou” and judgmental). That, IMO is very different from expressing an opinion or judgment about an issue or a fictitious individual as I did.

I could have "ignored" you for doing that but I hoped you'd get the message when I called it out the first time. Maybe moderators can do a better job at it. I rarely "ignore" members here.

Be well.
For the record, I did not call you holier-than-thou, I called your attitude holier-than-thou. Go back and read the post.

By opining that "real" Americans are about donating more than 10% of their earnings to charity you inferred that those who do not donate 10% or more of their earnings to charity (the vast majority of citizens) are un-American. Three posters (me and two others) call you out on that one and I'm the one making "personal" attacks?

Whatever.
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:49 PM   #79
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Sorry I don't agree. America and Americans certainly give to charity and the US aid budget is biggest. But should we look at total amount of charity, the amount given per citizen or just the percentage of citizens that give. I don't see Americans as inherently more charitable than any other country. Even the tendency to express exceptionalism isn't uniquely American.
Actually, the US led the world in the 2011 World Giving Index and dropped to 5th in 2012 (the most recent year available) and was also 5th in 2010. So the US was near the top in each of the last 3 years.
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Old 06-08-2013, 02:08 AM   #80
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opining that "real" Americans are about donating more than 10% of their earnings to charity you inferred that those who do not donate 10% or more of their earnings to charity (the vast majority of citizens) are un-American.
I should let this go because it is off-topic but I've never allowed my words to be twisted - unchecked- and don't intend to start now.

Read my post again - I said donating time AND money is American. Picking and choosing parts of my post to support an erroneous interpretation is your choice but I will call you on it as it did your earlier statement about donating 10% being "in fact, virtually unheard of" and then said "Of course I have heard of tithing." If a=b, and b=c, then a=c.

Inferring that I said that those who do not give are UNAmerican does not follow rules of logic. It is as illogical as this:

Me: Dogs have tails
You: You are saying that my Schipperke is not a dog!!
Me: I didn't say ALL dogs have tails.

Infer away because you have that freedom but that does not mean your inference accurately reflects my words.
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