I don't understand the personal economics of California

[skipro33]

Quote:

Originally Posted by marko That's what Whitey Bulger did! Sounds like you were so focused on the cars that you missed the large and growing homeless population in SD.

Homless in SD isn't the same as homeless in, say, Michigan. Very easy to live without a roof over your head there. Much like Hawaii. I would bet that the homeless in SD are that way by choice. I know I'd rather be homeless in SD than working full time in San Francisco. I wouldn't live there for any job they have.

[Sunset]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronstar I've noticed a huge difference in car types between Scottsdale and the southwest suburbs of Chicago. There are a few Bentleys, Ferraris and other exotic cars roaming Chicagoland, but they run amuck in Scottsdale. Great weather for exotic cars, and seems like a social requirement for the upper class. More trucks and SUV's in Chicagoland, probably due to the weather.

The Chicago snow means the Ferrari keeps getting stuck due to the low clearance, so not a good choice.

[Ronstar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunset The Chicago snow means the Ferrari keeps getting stuck due to the low clearance, so not a good choice.

Very true. It doesn't make much sense to pay $300k for a car that you can only drive for 6 months out of the year.

[rodi]

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Originally Posted by Peter One thing to consider is that salaries in urban-area California are higher than most of the rest of the country, but car prices are the same. So any given car will cost less as a proportion of income.

I'm not sure that blanket statement is true for San Diego... I worked for a fortune 50 company based in Chicago. The salaries in San Diego were EXACTLY the same as Chicago and Pennsylvania. Nor Cal got a salary differential, but not SoCal.

[googily]

Come to DC, where the current status car is a shiny new Suburban, so people can think you are a politician being ferried around.

[nash031]

There's a military factor. Lots of officers out here, and lots of youngsters who go on long deployments and come back with a sh&%load of money in their pockets that they don't know what to do with...

That and we don't feel compelled to fly somewhere sunny on vacation every year because we already live where you come to vacation. :-)

[audreyh1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelB Thorstein Veblen: . .

Is he the one who coined the term? He must not have approved of the practice, otherwise he would have dressed a little better.

[brewer12345]

I don't get the sportscar thing at all. You cannot tow a trailer, haul a load of free firewood scrounged on craigslist or go down Forest Service "roads" with those things. And I would hate to think what a trip with the dogs or a successful deer hunting trip would do to the upholstery...

[Gumby]

Many, many years ago, when I was a young lawyer, I was second seat in a trial. The lead lawyer was the oldest partner in my firm. One day, as we walked to court, opposing counsel pulled up in a black Porsche 911, with the flare fenders and whale tail. I said something like "Wow, look at that car. [Lawyer X] must have a lot of money." The old partner replied "we can conclude only one of two things - either he spent a lot of money or he borrowed a lot of money. We cannot conclude that he has a lot of money." Point well taken.

[brewer12345]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gumby Many, many years ago, when I was a young lawyer, I was second seat in a trial. The lead lawyer was the oldest partner in my firm. One day, as we walked to court, opposing counsel pulled up in a black Porsche 911, with the flare fenders and whale tail. I said something like "Wow, look at that car. [Lawyer X] must have a lot of money." The old partner replied "we can conclude only one of two things - either he spent a lot of money or he borrowed a lot of money. We cannot conclude that he has a lot of money." Point well taken.

Hilarious! I went to high school at a place where a fair fraction of the teachers were Jesuits and about 50% of every graduating class becomes attorneys (*shudder*). Such a dry observation would have been very familiar during those 4 years.

[Bamaman]

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Originally Posted by Shanky If a household is spending 400k a year on consumption and taxes, but is earning 500k a year, they are is LBYM. Even better, when they cash out and retire young in a low cost geography, they can retire with the same lifestyle for 200k a year. The downside is, at least for Silicon Valley is you are working too many hours to enjoy the toys much.

In the past, we didn't see so many Californians moving to ultra low cost of living states. Now, an incredible number are moving to Texas for the improved quality of life and no state income taxes. There are so many entertainers, movie stars and musicians living in Nashville, Tennessee that they call it "The Third Coast."

But getting back to the personal economics of California. It's obvious that those luxury cars are leased. Another observation is husbands are often working second jobs and wives are also working to just maintain what would be a normal lifestyle in other states.

I've visited a number of relatives in the Los Angeles basin, and I honestly don't know how they afford to live there.

If I had three times my current income, I would love to move to California. However I would still be lowering my standard of living substantially.

[FireBug]

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Originally Posted by RockyMtn when times is hard you can sleep in your car but you can't drive your house!

LOL...ok, I'm stealing that line!

[dvalley]

I've been in NorCal and SoCal pretty much all my life and I've seen Orange County become what it is now compared to when I was in college. Same with SD and many parts of NorCal (from Gilroy and Morgan city to Tracy).

However, when you really think about it owning fancy cars these days is extremely easy, $1500 down and $300 a month lease will get you into a decent brand new car. If you can afford $500 a month a BMW...so it's become a monthly payment game and leasing has really took on. And why not? lease a car every three years and never worry about maintenance or car bills. The shiny new car trend (down to the gardeners) really started in 2009-2010 and after the cash-for-clunkers program. Until recently my gardener (Escalade- his family car vs. the Toyota Tundra which is his work truck) and a couple of college kids living with parents had better cars (BMW M1, and a Subaru STi) than me...some still do. Then again I owned a couple of exotic cars in the dot com boom era...even though I was renting a town home...you gotta know your priorities especially when single in the mid 20s lol

[Lakewood90712]

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Originally Posted by dvalley I've been in NorCal and SoCal pretty much all my life and I've seen Orange County become what it is now compared to when I was in college. Same with SD and many parts of NorCal ........... when single in the mid 20s lol

Oh don't get me started about Orange County, where an upscale area high school parking lot is loaded with late model Audi's and BMW's, THE STUDENT LOT, NOT FACULTY !!!!

[NW-Bound]

Places like Paradise Valley, AZ or Palm Springs or Beverly Hills where the rich people live of course will have the more fancy cars like Maserati and Ferrari. Those people can afford them.

About lesser luxury cars like the BMW, Audi, Lexus or Infinity, persons with reasonable means can own them. It is a matter of priority, whether the car is more important than something else.

When I was in school, I thought to myself that when I got out, I would get a 7-series BMW. And then, I got married and loved to have a home instead. So, I kept my 280Z, and bought a used pickup as the 2nd vehicle to haul construction material for DIY landscaping. The desire to own a luxury sedan vanished. Somewhere in the age of 30s, my interest in fast cars was also gone.

Now, if I had a lot more money, I would get a luxury sedan because it would give a better ride and more comfort than my run-of-the-mill clunkers. But I would have to be sufficiently rich that a dent or a scratch on that car would not bother me. I would have to be able to call the dealer and request that a new car be delivered to my door, and that scratched car be taken away out of my sight.

[Danmar]

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Originally Posted by NW-Bound Places like Paradise Valley, AZ or Palm Springs or Beverly Hills where the rich people live of course will have the more fancy cars like Maserati and Ferrari. Those people can afford them. About lesser luxury cars like the BMW, Audi, Lexus or Infinity, persons with reasonable means can own them. It is a matter of priority, whether the car is more important than something else. When I was in school, I thought to myself that when I got out, I would get a 7-series BMW. And then, I got married and loved to have a home instead. So, I kept my 280Z, and bought a used pickup as the 2nd vehicle to haul construction material for DIY landscaping. The desire to own a luxury sedan vanished. Somewhere in the age of 30s, my interest in fast cars was also gone. Now, if I had a lot more money, I would get a luxury sedan because it would give a better ride and more comfort than my run-of-the-mill clunkers. But I would have to be sufficiently rich that a dent or a scratch on that car would not bother me. I would have to be able to call the dealer and request that a new car be delivered to my door, and that scratched car be taken away out of my sight.

Agree. It really depends on what's important to you. When I was younger in my 20-30's I drove old beaters because my priorities were elsewhere and money was scarce. Once I got to the point where I could afford nice cars, I went a little overboard. I really do like driving a sporty sedan and my M5 is a lot of car for the price.
By the way, in many wealthy areas like Paradise Valley, the cars of choice seem to be Bentleys. BMW's/Mercedes/Audis are very common. Sporty exotics like Ferraris are rare, maybe because the demographic skews pretty old, and us old guys have trouble getting in and out of them.

[Spanky]

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Originally Posted by Lakewood90712 Oh don't get me started about Orange County, where an upscale area high school parking lot is loaded with late model Audi's and BMW's, THE STUDENT LOT, NOT FACULTY !!!!

Not just in CA - this is also true in our city also. DW always comments on how cheap my car (2000 Toyota Corolla) is in comparison to the cars parked in the student's lot of our local high school.

[explanade]

Shoot I go to Chipotle, which I reserve for once a week at most, and there are high school kids eating there every day, with Lexus and BMW key fobs.

Then they go to Jamba Juice.

In high school I was putting up with shitty school cafeteria food.

Or running home for lunch to grab leftovers.

[travelover]

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Originally Posted by explanade .............In high school I was putting up with shitty school cafeteria food.........................

Cafeteria food?! Such luxury! I had stale bread sandwiches with generic brand peanut butter and no jelly. Washed down with warm water - no money for ice.

[hnzw_rui]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brewer12345 I don't get the sportscar thing at all. You cannot tow a trailer, haul a load of free firewood scrounged on craigslist or go down Forest Service "roads" with those things. And I would hate to think what a trip with the dogs or a successful deer hunting trip would do to the upholstery...

If in SoCal, what would you need firewood for? Most fireplaces in SoCal are just there for display. Besides, not everyone is interested in camping, hunting or having kids or pets. Mind, I don't own a sportscar nor would I care to buy one but different strokes for different folks.

I've got a co-worker who's stingy as hell in most things but drives a couple of nice muscle cars. Uses a dumbphone on prepaid and never goes on vacation but frequently does upgrades and tinkers with his cars.