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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 06:40 PM   #61
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan
10k DODFX (Dodge and Cox)

Beating Indexes is EZ
Yep, so easy.

But, then why didn't DODFX (the first on your list and the first I checked ) beat their index?

Dodge & Cox International Stock (DODFX)

Vanguard Emerging Mkts Stock Idx (VEIEX) - The investment seeks to track the performance of the Select Emerging Markets Free index. The fund employs a passively managed investment approach....



-ERD50
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 06:47 PM   #62
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Let me try to be the first to point out that DODFX is not an emerging market fund. It is an international value fund much like VTRIX or NIVAX.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 07:20 PM   #63
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

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Originally Posted by yakers
Damn, unclemick just released my secret retirement plan Just about everybody seems to miss the kayak part....
Mine too. I'm going snowboarding with my son on Friday. It is nice to be free.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 07:46 PM   #64
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by LOL!
Let me try to be the first to point out that DODFX is not an emerging market fund. It is an international value fund much like VTRIX or NIVAX.
OK, maybe it isn't the best match, but I guess that could be said about *any* managed fund. Else, it would be an index fund - right?

Quote:
Dodge & Cox International Stock - FUND SUMMARY
The investment seeks long-term growth of principal and income. The fund generally invest at least 80% of assets in a diversified portfolio of equity securities issued by non-U.S. companies from at least three different countries, including emerging markets.
I'm still waiting for AJ to show that past performance is a predictor of future performance. It's not very challenging to come up with a list of funds that performed well in the past. It's even easier with stocks.

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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 07:48 PM   #65
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

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Originally Posted by newyorklady
really, i am serious. wouldn't a good manager be able to beat an index fund? wouldn't a manager be able to spot problems with individual stocks, etc?
You have been neglecting your reading, grasshopper.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 07:50 PM   #66
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

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Originally Posted by Cut-Throat
I suggest you read "The four Pillars of Investing" by William Berstein. All of your answers will be in there.
I am anal-retentive and I found that book tedious. I like the details and numbers. NYL is a sophisticated and educated woman. It could kill her.

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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 07:56 PM   #67
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan
You guys should seriously have a throw down with the people at Motley Fool, Fund Alarm, and M-Star, they all swear by actively managed funds, but hey 1 out of 4 ain't bad
I own Dodge and Cox International fund -- my only non-index fund. I own it because of its performance. It has been one of the 20% for every time period I've looked at. Of course, the minute the indexes start beating it internationally, it's toast.

Domestic funds that beat their index are hard, if not impossible, to find.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 08:30 PM   #68
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2B
.... NYL is a sophisticated and educated woman. It could kill her.
She's a lawyer. She has read worse before just by virtue of her career. If such text could kill her, she would be dead already.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 08:36 PM   #69
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan
Sorry sarcasm is a bit hard to portray over the internets
the internets? plural?

Anyway its not hard at all - they have these emoticons that make it real simple ---------> :<-------------- that one is sarcasm.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 08:50 PM   #70
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan
10k DODFX (Dodge and Cox)
8k RYVPX (Royce Value Plus)
5k FAIRX (Fairholme)
5k JSVAX (Janus Contrarian)
5k FBRVX (FBR Small Cap)
5k ARTKX (Artisan Small Cap)
10k VPCCX (Primecap Core)
10k PREOX (Perrit Emerging Ops.)

Beating Indexes is EZ

Also, I really don't like to trade, I'm more of a buy and hold type. I don't believe that panicing got anyone anywhere, and timing the market is too hard. If I wanted to trade I'd play with equities, but the consensus of the board is I'm not that smart...
I'm willing to accept that you are just as smart as John Galt (one of this board's Mensa members), so I want to learn from you. Please let me know how to apply superior knowledge to choose funds that beat the index funds. I am in a very different situation than you are in, so I can't imagine that the same solution that is optimum for you is optimum for me, but I would think that if I understood the criteria you used to choose funds, I could apply it to my situation. I am older with considerably more money than you have. I am married with a small mortgage. I am retired and both my DW and I are entitled to small pension benefits starting several years from now. Can your method work for me?

What is your criteria for choosing this suite of funds? You mentioned past performance in a couple of previous posts, how much past performance did you consider? Are there other criteria?

Do you anticipate holding these same funds for the rest of your life? for several decades? for 5 years? Whatever your timeframe, if you go back that many years and apply the same criteria, would have chosen the exact same suite of funds? If not, what is going to be your trigger to trade these funds for others?



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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 09:53 PM   #71
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

It seems like DODFX is doing pretty great.... not a bad pick if you are going for managed funds...

But I don't know what index to compare it to.... so I don't know if it is beating its index or not..

so, for picking.. not bad IMO...

Seems to track the Total International Index the last two years.... but was better for the last 5...

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=VGTS...=m&q=l&c=dodfx
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 10:07 PM   #72
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgeeeee
I'm willing to accept that you are just as smart as John Galt (one of this board's Mensa members), so I want to learn from you. Please let me know how to apply superior knowledge to choose funds that beat the index funds. I am in a very different situation than you are in, so I can't imagine that the same solution that is optimum for you is optimum for me, but I would think that if I understood the criteria you used to choose funds, I could apply it to my situation. I am older with considerably more money than you have. I am married with a small mortgage. I am retired and both my DW and I are entitled to small pension benefits starting several years from now. Can your method work for me?

What is your criteria for choosing this suite of funds? You mentioned past performance in a couple of previous posts, how much past performance did you consider? Are there other criteria?

Do you anticipate holding these same funds for the rest of your life? for several decades? for 5 years? Whatever your timeframe, if you go back that many years and apply the same criteria, would have chosen the exact same suite of funds? If not, what is going to be your trigger to trade these funds for others?



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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 10:18 PM   #73
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas Proud
It seems like DODFX is doing pretty great.... not a bad pick if you are going for managed funds...

But I don't know what index to compare it to.... so I don't know if it is beating its index or not..
According to the Dodge & Cox website, DODFX is compared to the MSCI EAFE Index. The fund started in 2001 and beat the index at the 1,3 and 5 year points.

http://www.dodgeandcox.com/performance/index.shtml

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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 10:20 PM   #74
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex
the internets? plural?


Yeah, everyone knows it's properly 'teh intarwebs'. Sheesh.


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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 10:25 PM   #75
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan

..the consensus of the board is I'm not that smart...
I'd hazard we could extend that unanimity to well beyond just the board...



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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-06-2007, 11:02 PM   #76
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirJordan
Sorry sarcasm is a bit hard to portray over the internets
Yawn - you're still posting here? Do you understand why this board has such a loyal following that shuns M* and those other boards of tripe? Everybody is asking you tough questions, and you just ignore the ones you can't answer. Since you lied about your alum, everything you say is suspect. If you are really invested in the funds you say you are in, 10 years from now you will underperform the market. But the thing is, guys like you convince yourself you didn't. You fudge the numbers and selectively include data. You compare funds to the wrong benchmarks. What I feel bad about is you probably won't suffer from your delusion, since you are (allegedly) putting away enough per year that you will have a comfortable retirement. I feel bad for those who earn less (allegedly) per year who need to be more prudent with their investements who might get tempted with your BS.

Motley Fool has come out with all sorts of "rules" for beating the market - what, market makers and market "breakers" and the like. All of their little games busted in the long run, and I got tired of reading their excuses. If you are so much smarter than the multitude of early retired people on this board, what do you need this board for? All of your "you guys are hopeless" comments make it very clear you are here to troll. You are on a short leash. Contribute something and regain some credibility, or you'll find yourself bounced from the site.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-07-2007, 12:16 AM   #77
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by REWahoo!
According to the Dodge & Cox website, DODFX is compared to the MSCI EAFE Index. The fund started in 2001 and beat the index at the 1,3 and 5 year points.

http://www.dodgeandcox.com/performance/index.shtml

Thanks... but that is a comparison to an index that is not that close to the holdings.... and again.. how much risk are they taking??

And if you look... they have about 15% in emerging markets where the index has zero.. so not completly the same... again, it has a great return... let's look at it in 5 years and see where it is...
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-07-2007, 07:50 AM   #78
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgeeeee
What is your criteria for choosing this suite of funds? You mentioned past performance in a couple of previous posts, how much past performance did you consider? Are there other criteria?

Do you anticipate holding these same funds for the rest of your life? for several decades? for 5 years? Whatever your timeframe, if you go back that many years and apply the same criteria, would have chosen the exact same suite of funds? If not, what is going to be your trigger to trade these funds for others?



First Q, my criteria is a tenured manager, a good fund family, investment principles that I believe in, tax efficiency, and of course outperformance of the benchmark.

As for the funds I plan to hold forever, I'd say VPCCX, DODFX, FAIRX, FBRVX, and RYVPX. Going back in that time frame, yes I would choose the same funds. And what triggers a sell off, 1.5 years of underperformance, that's how long I give a fund to get its act back together. I don't just blindly follow, like people who blindly stuck by Ron Muhlenhkamp, as he drove them into the pavement.
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-07-2007, 10:03 AM   #79
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Quote:
Originally Posted by brewer12345
So, you don't want to trade, but you like to buy mutual funds that do a lot of trading?
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Re: I just bought VFINX today
Old 03-07-2007, 10:14 AM   #80
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Re: I just bought VFINX today

Just one more hilarious point among many others for you AJ. You are touting DFA funds, no? Well, DFA is made of hard core Phds who rely strictly on indexing. The fund's metrics (based on their academic research) are only slightly different from good old Vanguards - for example, the value funds are a little more tilted on the value side - and they offer more options.

So that means you do like the idea of indexing. We knew you would warm up to it skippy.

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