Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04-04-2008, 08:21 AM   #81
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
kcowan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pacific latitude 20/49
Posts: 5,693
Send a message via Skype™ to kcowan
I would hang in until DH decides to retire. What? Are you crazy? If your job is not making you sick or putting you at risk of going to jail, why not work for a few more years for a few more million?
__________________

__________________
For the fun of it...Keith
kcowan is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 04-04-2008, 09:46 AM   #82
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoping View Post
Hi everyone. Update is that DH and I have had some heart-to-heart discussions. I am planning to stay put for a few more months while he decides how he likes new job and new location. In the meantime, I am exploring the options in new location and have lined up a few interviews. So, thanks again for all of the advice!
Sounds like a great plan. He can check out housing and stuff there so you can transition your move slowly, and if he finds he doesn't like it you haven't screwed up your situation. Good luck!
__________________

__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 11:27 AM   #83
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 216
Good luck and congrats on making the decision. I'm sure that is a weight lifted off your shoulders.

And when you leave don't forget to give the search committee ol' GatorBuzz's number.
__________________
"...I'm the kind of guy who if he can't have too much of a thing doesn't want any at all."
GatorBuzz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 05:34 PM   #84
Moderator Emeritus
Nords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoping View Post
Job is highly stressful, not very fulfilling; working conditions are fine; colleagues are fine. My health is fine; DH wants to keep working, at least for now; he is a doctor and will earn 200-300k per year. I could get a new job for 80-100K a year that may be a better fit for me. We have approx $4.5 million saved so far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoping View Post
That is more than enough, but given my age, I am thinking a 2% SWR makes more sense. 90k probably would be enough, but when taxes are factored in, probably not. But we probably won't be withdrawing any money for at least a few more years, giving the money more time to grow.
Here's my opinion: We're either FI or we're not. If we're FI then we have no reason to put up with employment-related crap-- either fix it or leave it. Further dithering is not helping to solve the problem, but it could be helpful to worry constructively by determining whether or not the FI estimate is accurate.

As for your question, once one is FI then the dissatisfiers of work are not worth any amount of money. That sort of needless stress is life-threatening, let alone a miserable existence. Shortly after I ER'd I received a job offer that'd pay roughly $100K/year for as long as I could put up with it and would eventually conclude with a second defined-benefits pension, but I felt that family/personal time was more important than salary. Spouse gave up over three-quarters of a million in pension benefits because the stress, the family separation, and the lack of fulfilling employment was not worth the money.

I think you guys need to track your current expenses (not just eyeball them), decide how much your ER expenses are going to be, and decide whether you want to go with a >90% probability of success or fret over the <10% probability of failure. If nothing else you could annuitize your bare-bones minimum expenses and trust your portfolio to take care of the rest.

http://www.early-retirement.org/foru...ome-20091.html

A 2% SWR makes sense compared to what-- 8%? 5%? 3%? Even the most conservative calculators tend to approach a 3% SWR asymptotically due to a lack of longer-term data. At a 2% SWR you could live off the dividends and make your heirs very happy. You're wearing a belt & suspenders while sitting in a liferaft wearing a lifejacket and a parachute.

http://www.early-retirement.org/foru...les-32828.html

A leave of absence (at least six weeks) is an excellent way to test-drive the ER lifestyle. That sort of experiential learning may render the agonizing over FI irrelevant.
__________________
*
*

The book written on E-R.org, "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement", on sale now! For more info see "About Me" in my profile.
I don't spend much time here anymore, so please send me a PM. Thanks.
Nords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 08:36 PM   #85
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nords View Post
Here's my opinion: We're either FI or we're not.
I don't agree, at least not in general. There's no black and white line. I don't think we can all that accurately predict expenses, inflation, etc for the next 40 years. So we probably need a buffer past the line of FI. How much? Who knows?

Then there's whatever FI means to each person. Is it enough to survive on? Enough to enjoy some extras? Enough to leave some legacy behind, either to heirs or to a foundation? Some people don't want to retire just FI, they want to retire rich.

Maybe you know your future expenses well, and wouldn't change how you live even if you have 10x your net worth, so you've got a solid black line. Mine's a lot fuzzier and grayer.

Maybe the OP is far enough past the FI line. But at 100K a month, I might very well take a shot at rich. At ~10K a month, rich is not so easily in reach for me.

This is coming from someone who is FI but hasn't pulled the trigger yet, to someone who is enjoying ER, so maybe my view isn't the best, especially on this board.
__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 08:42 PM   #86
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,013
Well said, RunningBum.
__________________
Meadbh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 09:03 PM   #87
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Spanky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,046
FI means that you have sufficient money to meet all your future projected needs. If you feel that you need to add buffer or margin, that means that you have not achieved your financial goals and therefore you should not declare FI. If you are so worried about uncertainties and no glue as to how much you will need to feel comfortable, you should just keep working until you feel you have enough or you no longer have the mental or physical capacity to earn more $$$$. As Nord says, you are either FI or not. If you were, why not take time to smell the roses?
__________________
May we live in peace and harmony and be free from all human sufferings.
Spanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 09:12 PM   #88
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Spanky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,046
Quote:
Some people don't want to retire just FI, they want to retire rich.
Okay - what is "rich"? One may never feel rich no matter how much he/she has. As Gandhi says, "There is enough in this world for everyone's need but there is not enough in this world for any body's greed."
__________________
May we live in peace and harmony and be free from all human sufferings.
Spanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 09:55 PM   #89
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,160
In response to Spanky's last two posts, I'll use cars as an example of the degrees of being beyond FI.

I need one car. I have that. For some people that's enough.

I also like having a second car, something that's fun. I have an 11 year old Miata. Was 3-4 years old when I bought it. I'm FI without it, but I wanted it. I decided that I'm willing to keep working awhile longer to always have a fun car like that, relatively inexpensive but totally unnecessary. It never was a real goal, but since it wasn't that hard to get to this point, I figured why not?

I'd kind of like to upgrade to a much nicer fun car, something like a new BMW roadster. But at my income level and other expenses, I'd have to keep working longer than I'd like to be able to maintain the upgrade of a newer BMW over an older Miata. Now, if I could work one more month and pay cash for one, I'd do it, provided I wasn't on the verge of a major health or mental problem by continuing to work.

That's really about the limit for me. I don't really want a Ferrari or Lamborghini. But I could see how some people would hold out and work a few months longer to get one.

Replace cars with whatever you like, and wouldn't mind upgrading to some degree.

Personally, I'm sure I could get to the point of feeling rich without having everything. I'm sure there are some who would say I'm already there, but that doesn't mean I'd never feel rich at any point. I know there are others who, as you say, can't have enough to feel rich. Too bad for them.
__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 10:03 PM   #90
Moderator Emeritus
Nords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunningBum View Post
In response to Spanky's last two posts, I'll use cars as an example of the degrees of being beyond FI.
I need one car. I have that. For some people that's enough.
I also like having a second car, something that's fun.
Replace cars with whatever you like, and wouldn't mind upgrading to some degree.
Upgrading may be a worthy goal, but you have to decide how much pain you're willing to endure to support your habit. My pain tolerance gets lower with each surfing season year and as our teen bears closer watching grows older.

Maybe someday I'll find a job I enjoy so much that I'll donate the paychecks to charity. But until that happens I'm going to work very hard to maintain my FI-ness.

"I used to have a drug problem, but now I make enough money to afford it..."
-- David Lee Roth
__________________
*
*

The book written on E-R.org, "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement", on sale now! For more info see "About Me" in my profile.
I don't spend much time here anymore, so please send me a PM. Thanks.
Nords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2008, 10:14 PM   #91
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Spanky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,046
Quote:
Personally, I'm sure I could get to the point of feeling rich without having everything.
It's all relative. One can feel abundance with any material possession or financial wealth.
__________________
May we live in peace and harmony and be free from all human sufferings.
Spanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2008, 12:11 AM   #92
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 13,248
Running.....

I am one that says like Nords et al.... you are either FI or you are not FI...

What are your other options

Now, there is not a point where you are 'not' and then get another dollar and now 'are'.... but we are not talking that closely....

All your examples are great, but mean nothing in the IS or NOT... if you are one that likes and extra car (like I am also)... you have to calculate this in your level needed to be FI... and YOUR FI is different than MY FI... and of course Nords and CFBs....

I can tell you that the OP says she can make over $1 mill per year has $4.5.... that is WAY more than I need... but maybe not enough for her... so if I had it I would be FI, she might not be... and all talk about cars or other things that can be used to calculate out how much you need to be FI still does not change the answer.... you either are or not FI...
__________________
Texas Proud is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2008, 01:49 AM   #93
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 325
Are you kidding me? For $100K per month work as long as you can at it and then never work another day in your life.

Un believable that we are even having this discussion. Get back to work!
__________________
CybrMike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2008, 04:34 AM   #94
Recycles dryer sheets
Shabber2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 55
I struggle with this question a lot as well. Sure, it is on a lesser extent, but here is what I did. I figured out that each year I continue to work I am able to withdraw an extra $1,000 per year in ER. So, on bad days I remind myself that each month I work i can withdraw another $83. This keeps me going.

Another thing I did was create 2 different retirement budgets: comfortable and Living Large. These are realistic, not Lear jets and stuff. So I hope I am strong enough to stop working when I hit my Living Large requirement of savings. But stopping short will be ok too. It is important to understand what that money is going to do for you and not be mesmerized by the amount.
__________________
"Been dreaming of ER since I was 16"
Shabber2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2008, 05:37 AM   #95
Moderator
Ronstar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: A little ways southwest of Chicago
Posts: 9,335
Nords and Runningbum both have good points. Nords mentions the "dissatisfiers" of work. If one is at FI, the dissatisfiers play a major role in whether or not to RE. If one is dissatisfied with their job, then RE. If a person feels that their satisfaction from work (pay, benefits, etc) exceeds their level of dissatisfaction, then keep working for awhile.

If the job was bearable, I would probably work for awhile and spend my entire pay on toys and trips.
__________________
Ronstar is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 05:16 PM   #96
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 50
This is a fascinating debate. Further update is that I have had one interview, which went well. Loved the new location on West Coast and think I will be happier there. So, if I get the job I am taking it, despite much less $. If I don't, then . . . ?
__________________
hoping is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 09:45 PM   #97
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Spanky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 4,046
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoping View Post
Loved the new location on West Coast and think I will be happier there. So, if I get the job I am taking it, despite much less $. If I don't, then . . . ?
then have fun and enjoy the sunrise and sunset of the pacific ocean.
__________________
May we live in peace and harmony and be free from all human sufferings.
Spanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 09:46 PM   #98
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
RunningBum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoping View Post
This is a fascinating debate. Further update is that I have had one interview, which went well. Loved the new location on West Coast and think I will be happier there. So, if I get the job I am taking it, despite much less $. If I don't, then . . . ?
Sounds like your options are continuing to get better!
__________________
RunningBum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 10:03 PM   #99
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
thefed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,203
hoping -what industry are you in? just curious what job pays that well
__________________
thefed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 10:30 PM   #100
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 50
law.
__________________

__________________
hoping is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
$100k Milestone! BigMoneyJim Young Dreamers 128 04-28-2008 03:39 PM
What's life like with 100K/year or more? Sam FIRE and Money 173 10-16-2006 12:16 PM
Where to put 100K cube_rat FIRE and Money 72 10-11-2006 12:41 PM
fire on 100k lazygood4nothinbum Hi, I am... 5 02-28-2006 12:57 PM
100k investment in funds for 2006? bearkeley FIRE and Money 17 01-12-2006 01:42 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:24 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.