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Interesting Interview on Moyers...Bank Crisis...Opinions?
Old 04-04-2009, 11:30 AM   #1
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Interesting Interview on Moyers...Bank Crisis...Opinions?

I watch Bill Moyers when I get the chance. This interview was on Friday night (Apr 3rd). If you have about 20 minutes...it's worth watching. Very insightful about the bank crisis. Interviews a professor from KC Missouri. The last half especially is riveting.
Did any of you see it?

Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS
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Old 04-04-2009, 11:57 AM   #2
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I'd rather read a transcript than watch a video. The transcript is here: Bill Moyers Journal . Transcripts | PBS

Black says that there was plenty of "fraud", with the meaning that if the Justice Dept started looking around they could send people to jail.

Quote:
The FBI publicly warned, in September 2004 that there was an epidemic of mortgage fraud, that if it was allowed to continue it would produce a crisis at least as large as the Savings and Loan debacle. And that they were going to make sure that they didn't let that happen. So what goes wrong? After 9/11, the attacks, the Justice Department transfers 500 white-collar specialists in the FBI to national terrorism. Well, we can all understand that. But then, the Bush administration refused to replace the missing 500 agents. So even today, again, as you say, this crisis is 1000 times worse, perhaps, certainly 100 times worse, than the Savings and Loan crisis. There are one-fifth as many FBI agents as worked the Savings and Loan crisis.
I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I'd like to know.
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Old 04-04-2009, 12:33 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Independent View Post
Black says that there was plenty of "fraud", with the meaning that if the Justice Dept started looking around they could send people to jail.
I would agree, and I think that would restore at least some consumer and investor confidence... as long as it wasn't conducted like a witch hunt. My fear is that it, like the AIG bonus fiasco, would be fueled by populist anger and become something of a witch hunt and a scapegoating fest.
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Old 04-04-2009, 01:34 PM   #4
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IMO, this was journalism at its worst and a dis-service to PBS and it's viewers.

It's clear that Black has his own agenda, and Moyers was providing a platform for it. In his discussion of "liar's loans" and the associated fraud, he failed to blame the borrowers who lied on their mortgage applications, even though they were committing fraud when they did so, regardless of what a mortgage broker might have hinted. Unfortunately, Bill Moyers was so far out of his league on this subject, that he was unable to ask any probing or penetrating questions. In fact, Moyers' line of questioning was softer than a typical Larry King interview.
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Old 04-04-2009, 04:08 PM   #5
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Yes, I saw it... All the While I was Wondering ? Where were the STATE Auditiors during all this mess? I used to be an Auditor back in the 70's and things were alot different in those days.. If we didn't get the right answers? We called in the AG and the bank was filled with Suits for weeks...Some Bank Pres. and Officers were hauled out in Handcuffs..to send a Message to other Bankers..

Auditors Were Really Feared in those days... Now, it's a Joke.. I think at least 25% of Banks have no business, being in business...and are run by clowns and crooks..
It used to be a badge of honor Getting FDIC with their strict Requirements to get it, Now? It's a Joke..and a Open Door to commit Fraud and stick the Taxpayer with the bills..

And did you also see the 60 min story a few weeks ago on how the FDIC takes over a Bank overnite..? I was looking for the Bank Officers being Hauled out in Handcuffs by Marshals and/or the FBI... But they were already Vactioning in Bermuda or on a Cruise I guess...

Sure would Warm my Soul seeing some Bank Officers being hauled out in handcuffs and several of those AIG people , not to mention Those That ran Fannie Mae into the ground..

As you can guess, I keep very little In My Bank anymore..
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Old 04-04-2009, 04:21 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by FIRE'd@51 View Post
IMO, this was journalism at its worst and a dis-service to PBS and it's viewers.

It's clear that Black has his own agenda, and Moyers was providing a platform for it. In his discussion of "liar's loans" and the associated fraud, he failed to blame the borrowers who lied on their mortgage applications, even though they were committing fraud when they did so, regardless of what a mortgage broker might have hinted. Unfortunately, Bill Moyers was so far out of his league on this subject, that he was unable to ask any probing or penetrating questions. In fact, Moyers' line of questioning was softer than a typical Larry King interview.
I tend to agree with you on Moyers, however I generally enjoy watching his show on Fridays (did not watch it last night however) and seeing Bill nod his head and ruffle his brow so serious-like at almost every comment his guests make. It's darn good evening entertainment for me.
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Old 04-06-2009, 09:46 AM   #7
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Like I said, I'd like to know more about this. Dennis seems to say that he has seen this from a regulator's perspective, and today's standards are way too weak. FIRE'd@51 says that Black gave the borrowers a free pass, but to me that doesn't mean the bankers are clean, or the gov't is really pursuing this.
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Old 04-06-2009, 12:37 PM   #8
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I feel like you do Independant. There is more to Black than what meets the eye, of course. I realize that it IS tv, but watching something like this that is so blunt is refreshing, for a change. At the beginning of the interview it mentioned that Black was also involved in bringing the Keeting 5 scandal to light. I think the blame begins from the top, then down...
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Old 04-06-2009, 02:57 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Dennis View Post
Yes, I saw it... All the While I was Wondering ? Where were the STATE Auditiors during all this mess? I used to be an Auditor back in the 70's and things were alot different in those days.. If we didn't get the right answers? We called in the AG and the bank was filled with Suits for weeks...Some Bank Pres. and Officers were hauled out in Handcuffs..to send a Message to other Bankers..

Auditors Were Really Feared in those days... Now, it's a Joke.. I think at least 25% of Banks have no business, being in business...and are run by clowns and crooks..
It used to be a badge of honor Getting FDIC with their strict Requirements to get it, Now? It's a Joke..and a Open Door to commit Fraud and stick the Taxpayer with the bills..

And did you also see the 60 min story a few weeks ago on how the FDIC takes over a Bank overnite..? I was looking for the Bank Officers being Hauled out in Handcuffs by Marshals and/or the FBI... But they were already Vactioning in Bermuda or on a Cruise I guess...

Sure would Warm my Soul seeing some Bank Officers being hauled out in handcuffs and several of those AIG people , not to mention Those That ran Fannie Mae into the ground..

As you can guess, I keep very little In My Bank anymore..

First... there was a lot of fraud going on...

But your statement of hauling off bank presidents shows how bad some regulators are (or where)... I worked for a bank that failed (twice)... one guy went to jail because he was taking kickbacks, but the bank did not fail because of this.. it was because almost all banks in Texas failed... real estate loans, energy loans, etc. etc... being 'stupid' is not a crime.. making a stupid loan (or what was a good loan until the economy tanked) is just that, making a bad loan... it is not criminal...

Just wanted to edit and add... the 60 minute example... the CEO was IN the bank.. they showed him on TV in the bank... he was not in Burmuda... check on your stuff before you make statements that make it look like everyone is a crook...
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Old 04-06-2009, 05:16 PM   #10
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First... there was a lot of fraud going on...

But your statement of hauling off bank presidents shows how bad some regulators are (or where)... I worked for a bank that failed (twice)... one guy went to jail because he was taking kickbacks, but the bank did not fail because of this.. it was because almost all banks in Texas failed... real estate loans, energy loans, etc. etc... being 'stupid' is not a crime.. making a stupid loan (or what was a good loan until the economy tanked) is just that, making a bad loan... it is not criminal...

Just wanted to edit and add... the 60 minute example... the CEO was IN the bank.. they showed him on TV in the bank... he was not in Burmuda... check on your stuff before you make statements that make it look like everyone is a crook...
I'm with you Texas. No doubt there was a lot of stupidity and criminality involved by the banks in making liar loans. I am all for prosecuting the bank officer, mortgage loan brokers, and assorted other parasites who did criminal actions as opposed to stupid things.

However, what Moyers, and Black conveniently forget is there is only party in a liar loan who positively committed a felony, that is the loan applicant.
When I took at Pen Fed HEL last year, at the bottom of the loan application, in big red letters.

I hereby certified under penalty of perjury that all information on this loan application is accurate and truthful.

Then at finally at closing time I had sign a document that no change in my financial situation had occurred.

Now obviously, most of the people involved in loaning money, knew that the borrowers were committing a felony. But I haven't seen much outrage among the media about millions of folks who lied on their applications.

Somehow, I doubt I'll see the folks who took out the liars loans attacked on Moyer's show.
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Old 04-07-2009, 10:19 AM   #11
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Texas Proud > "Just wanted to edit and add... the 60 minute example... the CEO was IN the bank.. they showed him on TV in the bank... he was not in Burmuda... check on your stuff before you make statements that make it look like everyone is a crook...

CLIFP > "When I took at Pen Fed HEL last year, at the bottom of the loan application, in big red letters.

I hereby certified under penalty of perjury that all information on this loan application is accurate and truthful.

Then at finally at closing time I had sign a document that no change in my financial situation had occurred.

Now obviously, most of the people involved in loaning money, knew that the borrowers were committing a felony. But I haven't seen much outrage among the media about millions of folks who lied on their applications.

Somehow, I doubt I'll see the folks who took out the liars loans attacked on Moyer's show."


RE: Well,
1. My CEO /President comment Being In Bermuda was a Joke..
2. Fox Incharge of the Hen House..The Banks I've ever made loans with ( and For both my own and For my Business)? All had Credit Checks done and Confirmed All my Liabilities vs the Assets and My Income and they wanted my past 2 yrs Tax Returns..

Seems to me, if just doing these Traditional Methods? Most of those Loans would have not Been Made.. Or , let's say, Shouldn't have been..and only the Loan Officer is on the hook for approving it... Right?

And Whomever is the Boss of Him/her's job to oversee them..or called Checks and Balances.. Apparently Alot of the SubPrime Loans were Not made thru traditional Banks, but thru Mortgage Co.'s, that Set up Shop overnite with No Qualifications..and thus I think it goes all the way back to the Individual States-Regulations Depts. and the AG problems for giving them a License to Do Business...

And Even the Most Honest Of Borrowers Lie on their Apps.. From Evalluating what their Furniture is worth to their Cars to a Host of other Assets they list..And Even Our Houses are evaluated alot higher than they really are, if had to be sold off..That's why Banks only take a Mx of 75% of their stated Values for Loans..

I'd like to see the Whole Chain of them Being Indicted..including the States Depts and Their people.. And clean the whole mess of them out and put them , at least, out on the street, if not In Jail for either Breaking their own States Laws to their Regulations..

I'd expect, quite a Few States AG's would be serving time by Now..as well as alot of Political Appointees in those States running various Depts incharge of that stuff and of course, we can't have that..now can we? Of course Not, It would Be a Black Eye on the The Govenors those states...and quite possibly, the whole Polictical Party running that State..

peace..
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Old 04-07-2009, 11:07 AM   #12
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I gave up watching Moyers years ago. IMHO his stories have a whiny, fawning thread woven throughout.
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Old 04-07-2009, 12:09 PM   #13
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Okay, trillions of dollars in losses at banks throughout the world that bought toxic loan packages. Who ended up as the recipient of all the "lost" money? How much of it is in big bankers' pockets, how much in loan originators' pockets, how much in borrowers' pockets, how much in home sellers' pockets, how much in real estate agents' pockets, and how much in the pockets of the people who developed and built the real estate? If you forget the implications of the crisis and just look at it as a (potentially fraudulent) redistribution of wealth, who were (and will be) the big winners and losers?
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Old 04-07-2009, 03:28 PM   #14
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Gee...Barney Frank assured the public that the existing regulations would suffice and that Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac were just fine - don't need to tighten any regulations. Interesting how the media is ONLY focused on the banking executives and not the politicians who were aware of what was going on, but chose to do nothing about it. Everyone shares some blame in this one!
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