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International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 08:43 AM   #1
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International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

I would like some exposure to the area & was hoping I could get some ideas from all of you. *Do you all think the Vanguard Emerging Mkt Index is good exposure to the sector or something else? *
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 01:02 PM   #2
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Vanguard International Explorer.
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 02:08 PM   #3
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

I would love to but the friggin thing is closed to new money
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 02:40 PM   #4
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Sell you some of mine...real cheap!
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 02:41 PM   #5
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Financing available? Buy here pay here sort of stuff?
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 03:32 PM   #6
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Quote:
Vanguard International Explorer.

Int'l Explorer is int'l small-cap growth (really mid-cap). Small cap growth is the worst returning asset class in the US and abroad. Best to avoid it. It was also a Scudder fund, same team, they just changed the name of it!

Vanguard do not have an appropriate small cap fund, nor a small cap value fund in the international arena. It is a gap at present.

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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 03:39 PM   #7
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Quote:
I would like some exposure to the area & was hoping I could get some ideas from all of you. *Do you all think the Vanguard Emerging Mkt Index is good exposure to the sector or something else? *

Wildcat,

VG EM fund is large cap, not small cap. Very little small cap in there. Mostly the biggest names like Samsung.

Int'l developed and Emerging are two different areas. There is a little overlap in the Asia region which has Asia developed and Asia emerging. So you're muddling the two together.

There isn't an index product for int'l developed small cap/small cap value. Several great funds are now closed. The ones that are open include RISIX which is small cap specific, and Third Avenue International Value which is an all-cap fund, includes good bit of small cap and owns a very unusual set of stocks. Oakmark have a small cap int'l fund that is excellent but it is closed. If it reopens - Oakmark periodically reopen for a short while so worth keeping an eye out - this is a great offering.

Best thing I can see right now is RISIX.

In terms of emerging markets, there are no small cap offerings that I know of other than DFA Emerging Market Small which is only available via financial advisor which comes with minimums and extra fees.

P.S. Int'l Small Cap Value has produced the highest int'l returns almost identical to US ScV. Volatile but has around 0.15 correlation to US equities, so well worth it for long-run returns and diversification. One has to be patient on those returns though, very bumpy year-on-year but good as one part of a portfolio.

Hope it helps.

Petey
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 03:56 PM   #8
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

I've got Fidelity International Small Cap (FISMX). Downsides are that it's pricey at 1.28% ER, and that it's had a huge runup the last few years, so it may be due for a correction.
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 05:15 PM   #9
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Hmmm...average cap size of intl explorer is a little over $1B. Sounds small capish to me.

1 and 3 year returns of 22.89 and 20.88, annual returns since inception of 13.18%...

I'll take on a couple more of these 'avoiders' if I can...
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 05:36 PM   #10
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

I do have some Intl' Large Cap exposure so I wonder if it is even worth the expenses to get into an actively managed Intl small fund or at least at this point. Def worth a look.

Thanks for the suggestions Petey (I couldn't find anything)
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 06:54 PM   #11
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

I did look at Intl Small Cap a while ago and found the following 2 - they are not value but both growth+value.

Lazard International Small Cap Open ---- LZSMX
Morgan Stanley International Small Cap Class A ---- MSISX

Lazard is really good as far as returns go. I am not really convinced about the MS one - but have them in my 401k.

hope this helps
-h
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 07:33 PM   #12
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Quote:
I couldn't find anything.
Well, in that case I'll propose Tweedy, Browne Global Value (TBGVX). Not exactly what you're looking for but close in many respects.
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 07:52 PM   #13
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

10% of my portfolio is in this asset class, split among three funds. Aside from a small position in International Explorer from Vanguard, I have bigger positions in International Small Cap: DFISX (29% 1yr return, 13.5% 5yr return) and International Small Cap Value: DISVX (32.7% 1 yr and 19.5% 5yr return) from DFA.

These (DFISX and DISVX) kick tail on the Vanguard International Explorer (23% 1yr and 2% 5yr) though they charge about 0.2% more each year in fees.-- There are inexpensive ways to get a DFA consultant and get access to the funds -- I paid $1,000 once a few years ago and that has been the end of it -- there are no other fees except he gets a few bucks from my brokerage fee when I rebalance.

Int'l small cap has beena great asset class the last few years -- who knows what the future will hold. The efficient frontier studies say it is good spice to have in my soup - the portfolio-- so I hold it. (low correlation to US equities, good return, and intuitive sense for me that small cap international is where growth will happen, and that a heavy dose of the value stocks in that asset class will keep me from overpaying for that growth.). In truth, it was this asset class that got me to DFA, and once there I found lots of other funds to like. Now about 1/3 of our assets are at DFA.




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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?
Old 04-03-2005, 08:12 PM   #14
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Re: International Small Cap Fund Ideas?

Yeah I agree on the DFA and I like them as well. I may at some point down the line get in touch with them for a regular fund account.
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