Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
investing strategy
Old 08-26-2008, 10:12 AM   #1
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Joaquin, Texas
Posts: 164
investing strategy

I believe liquefied natural gas and/or compressed natural gas powered automobiles will become much more popular in the future..How can one best capitalize on that if I'm right?
__________________

__________________
Life is good. Then you die.
lawman is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 08-26-2008, 10:55 AM   #2
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 589
What if you are completely off? That would be quite a bet since that type of technology is no where near close to being developed.
__________________

__________________
plex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 01:38 PM   #3
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,906
Quote:
Originally Posted by plex View Post
What if you are completely off? That would be quite a bet since that type of technology is no where near close to being developed.
When I worked for MegaMotors we sold a few cars and light trucks powered by compressed natural gas. The technology is there, the gas pumps are not. Most sales were to fleets, mostly gas companies.
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 01:51 PM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Leonidas's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Where the stars at night are big and bright
Posts: 2,847
My current thinking is that I don't want to own a car company, but Honda does seem to be going strongly toward making some/more NatGas powered cars.

Other than that, the only NatGas fueling stations I can find around here are all owned by Clean Energy. Formerly Pickens Fuel Company, as in T.Boone "I want to make zillions on wind energy and get you'all to switch to compressed NatGas fer yer cars and make me a few more zillions off a that" Pickens. Nothing wrong with that at all. It's traded on the Nasdaq - symbol CLNE. Now may not be a good time to buy, I see that Cramer just featured it recently and it took a little rip upward. Damn, wish I had bought some last week when I first found it. Guess I'll watch and research that one for a while until the yahoos get clubbed to death.

Other than that, I have thought about trying to find who makes the compressors that would have to be sold to station owners or do-it-yourselfers for home use.
__________________
There is no pleasure in having nothing to do; the fun is having lots to do and not doing it. - Andrew Jackson
Leonidas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 04:21 PM   #5
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Joaquin, Texas
Posts: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonidas View Post
Other than that, I have thought about trying to find who makes the compressors that would have to be sold to station owners or do-it-yourselfers for home use.
Keep me posted..I'm thinking there must be some parts manufactured for the automobile engines that are different than gasoline or as you say the compressor angle..I think Ford is working on one or two small cars that will use CNG.
Thanks
__________________
Life is good. Then you die.
lawman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 05:23 PM   #6
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
brewer12345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 16,391
Ummm, how about just buying a domestic natural gas producer?
__________________
"There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest have to pee on the electric fence for themselves."



- Will Rogers
brewer12345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 07:25 PM   #7
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Joaquin, Texas
Posts: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by brewer12345 View Post
Ummm, how about just buying a domestic natural gas producer?
I've done that (CHK) and plan to buy more..I'd just like to place a small bet on something with bigger odds..

Natural gas just seems to be the next logical step in the use of dwindling non renewable energy resources..Investing in natural gas seems low risk to me for long term investing..
__________________
Life is good. Then you die.
lawman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2008, 09:27 PM   #8
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawman View Post
I believe liquefied natural gas and/or compressed natural gas powered automobiles will become much more popular in the future..How can one best capitalize on that if I'm right?
I would think this is a very long term investment given the level of investment required in infrastructure. Iceland has invested heavily in Hydrogen powered vehicles and built an infrastructure to power buses running on fuel cells but it is a very small country (half the population of Vermont) and the "scale up" to a major country would require some serious investment. Personally I see fuel cells as a better bet for the long term future as natural gas still has carbon to dispose off during oxidation.

I think cars using existing existing infrastrucure will increase in popularity for a quite a while to come. - Biofuels and hybrids for example. (The next generation of hybrids for example promise 150mpg and need nothing else other than gas stations and a regular electrical receptacle to plug into).
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2008, 04:11 AM   #9
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
IMHO - If the use of natural gas to fuel transportation grows it will not be for individuals. It will be for fleets of vehicles like local UPS trucks, phone company vehicles, local mail trucks, etc. I doubt it will be made available at the normal filling station.

Ditto Brew's advice. However, I would limit my exposure to any perceived solution at this time.

I think plug-in electric hybrids are the most likely solution to prevail for the general public over the next 20 years. It does not matter if the fuel is natural gas, hydrogen (the variations). There will be a fuel that is converted to electricity in the vehicle.


On energy in general, there is some speculation that alternative energy will drive the next speculative bubble. If I were to speculate, I would try to do it with an ETF or mutual fund (for diversification). The problem may be that by the time all of those ETFs show up in mass... it is a sure sign the bubble is ready to pop.
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Propane/gasoline
Old 08-27-2008, 11:00 AM   #10
Dryer sheet wannabe
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 17
Propane/gasoline

Back in the early 70's we ran a dual fuel propane/gasoline car. The conversion consisted of a small a valve/ air mix system mounted on the front fender in the engine compartment and an adapter placed on top of the carb. A simple toggle switch in the car would allow either propane or gasoline to be used. It did not use any engine modification.

Jeff
__________________
Bultacoman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2008, 07:06 AM   #11
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Finance Dave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,046
Quote:
Originally Posted by plex View Post
What if you are completely off? That would be quite a bet since that type of technology is no where near close to being developed.
Really? I work for an engine making company and we've been selling LNG engines for 12 years.

To the OP, not sure....perhaps invest in the stocks of companies who will sell the engines/vehicles...or another option is to invest in small startup companies developing the "hang on" technologies, such as compressed gas fuel delivery systems, high-pressure gas storage devices, etc.

Dave
__________________
Finance Dave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 01:55 AM   #12
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Hua Hin
Posts: 5
I’m at a loss to see how anyone thinks the technology is no where close to being developed. Semi third world Thailand has both LPG and CNG cars and trucks on the road today. Lots of them. Some are dual fuel as Bultacoman mentioned. It’s not just fleet types, although I think all of BKK taxis are CNG or LPG as are most buses. The gasoline stations added the filling systems very quickly (took a couple of years) and now they’re all over the country. The guys who do the conversions have people standing in line.

Thailand also has E10 in 91 and 95 octane available everywhere with E80 on the way. Diesel is also popular here especially in light trucks. Mine gets over 30 mpg which is on a par with electric hyrids.

Many most countries have done a lot more than America has to reduce oil dependency

Abby
__________________
AbbyNormal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 04:24 AM   #13
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 589
I love how you guys are pointing to tiny countries which have a fraction of the infrastructure costs to put in a whole different fueling system.
__________________
plex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 10:02 AM   #14
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbbyNormal View Post
Many most countries have done a lot more than America has to reduce oil dependency
And there you have it. Most countries use government intervention to reduce the need for oil whereas the US relies on the the market to drive such changes. (for Government intervention you also need higher taxes). This is why INMO the US is going to be well behind the curve in building the infrastructure for LPG or LNG or H2 powered vehicles.

When I was in Mumbai last year I read that the city had just removed the restrictions on taxi fees now that 80% of taxis were powered by propane. They had been restricting the minimum fare that a cab could charge (such that propane cabs can charge higher fares).
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 11:10 AM   #15
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,268
Im a Dallas police detective. We recently got quite a few CNG vehicles. Everyone hates them.

There is only 5 CNG refueling stations in the entire city of Dallas.

You can smell a faint odor of gas in the car but they have all been inspected more than once and there are no leaks. One officer was overcome by fumes and taken to the hospital. No leak can be found in that vehicle either.

Its like driving a 1 cylinder car....read: no power at all.

The fuel tanks are tiny. The civics have a range of just over 100 miles....then you better be nearby one of the 5 stations.

In other words, they suck and I dont see them catching on anytime soon.
__________________
utrecht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 11:14 AM   #16
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
cute fuzzy bunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Losing my whump
Posts: 22,697
Hey utrecht...dont mince words! Tell us how you really feel!
__________________
Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
cute fuzzy bunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 11:24 AM   #17
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Leonidas's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Where the stars at night are big and bright
Posts: 2,847
Quote:
Originally Posted by utrecht View Post
Its like driving a 1 cylinder car....read: no power at all.

The fuel tanks are tiny. The civics have a range of just over 100 miles....then you better be nearby one of the 5 stations.

In other words, they suck and I dont see them catching on anytime soon.
So, if you're riding with a partner it doesn't take much to convince him/her not to smoke in the car?

When I started working in Houston in 1980 I remember there were CNG patrol cars at one station. It was in the slowest and least crime ridden division, so I assume that poor power was not a big issue for them. But the round trip to the central jail had to be 30-40 miles, and I guess they had to fill up before heading downtown because the only CNG station was at the substation.

Other than the smell of NG in the car, do you think the car would be attractive for other uses/users in urban areas?

Oh, and thanks for the post. It brightens my day whenever I'm reminded of one of the reasons I retired from the big blue machine. There were days I was convinced that if we ran a dog on the executive floors in the big building that we would find crack, or at least weed. I just knew that they had to be smoking some mind altering substance up there, because even the stupidest person alive, if sober, couldn't dream up some of the stuff those people did.
__________________
There is no pleasure in having nothing to do; the fun is having lots to do and not doing it. - Andrew Jackson
Leonidas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 11:44 AM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
cute fuzzy bunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Losing my whump
Posts: 22,697
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonidas View Post
Other than the smell of NG in the car
Other than that Mrs Lincoln, did you enjoy the play?
__________________
Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
cute fuzzy bunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 11:57 AM   #19
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,409
1974 - big Chevy Impala, Propane salesman, Huntsville Alabama - the tank filled most of the trunk - that thing would really haul ass - I suspect he was an ex?? moonshiner.

NASA had a lot of forklifts and vehicles running on NG from at least the 70's on.

heh heh heh - Evolution not revolution.
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2008, 12:18 PM   #20
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,387
Does anyone understand the economics of gas to liquid conversion? The technology is quite old and well established-maybe 100 years old! If this is not too wasteful, it would seem to have much to recommend it. Our trucks and over-the-road busses and trains already run on diesel. Europe is full of small efficient and fairly well performing direct injection turbo-charged diesels. Audi has gone quite far with this technology.

Although I suppose that the economic doctrine of comparative advantage would suggest that we continue to use foreign oil as long as it lasts, I wonder if that is really practical given that eventually countries that are mostly our enemies will end up owning all our productive assets?

Ha
__________________

__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Investing Advice/Strategy For Younger Couple frayne FIRE and Money 11 03-13-2008 04:22 PM
FIRECALC strategy Rich_by_the_Bay FIRECalc support 4 07-26-2006 03:32 PM
Investing Strategy ktupper FIRE and Money 4 11-07-2005 06:18 PM
Pre-Retirment Investing Strategy DFW_M5 FIRE and Money 22 10-05-2003 10:18 AM
New strategy! (OT) dory36 FIRE and Money 0 10-08-2002 04:11 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:23 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.