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Old 10-24-2014, 02:44 PM   #81
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I can't say that I would believe that.
I'm sure that the originally rich people would do better in general than the poor people. But to suggest that the rich people would make entirely all their money back, that sounds far-fetched. And certainly there must be a few poor people that, given the opportunity, would do something magnificent and build on their wealth.
I don't think the anecdote was intended to be taken literally or to be a blanket statement.

I think the point was that the self-made billionaires, like the self inflicted poor have certain outlooks, qualities and traits that made them so.

We've all seen far too many lottery winners who were poor ending up worse off than had they not won.
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Old 10-24-2014, 02:51 PM   #82
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I don't think the anecdote was intended to be taken literally or to be a blanket statement.



I think the point was that the self-made billionaires, like the self inflicted poor have certain outlooks, qualities and traits that made them so.



We've all seen far too many lottery winners who were poor ending up worse off than had they not won.

My opinion means nothing but in general, I would lay my money on that outcome more than everybody maintaining the new status quo. A certain group would spend it with no control, or buy things with ongoing costs that drain them dry eventually. What is it about 85% of all NBA players are broke within 5 years of retirement? Seems that would happen to the masses of people with newly found money given to them.


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Old 10-24-2014, 02:56 PM   #83
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Sure. That's why we cook it. Problem solved.
Trichinosis is not a problem with pork anymore. You can now eat pork without cooking the hell out of it.
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Old 10-24-2014, 02:58 PM   #84
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The idea that luck ( a presumably random event) plays a major role in success is not in accord with my experience of life in the US. Or else it must run in families: All my sibs, cousins and children somehow got lucky! I go with the definition of luck as the intersection of attitude, preparation and hard work....
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Old 10-24-2014, 03:02 PM   #85
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In my case, a lot of the motivation was simply an acknowledgement that as we age our stock of human capital depletes over time. If you do not efficiently convert some of your human capital into financial capital as that happens, you are potentially up the proverbial creek.
+1 Very good point, and one that few of us think about while we are young and think the good times will roll on forever.
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Old 10-24-2014, 03:02 PM   #86
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However, LBYM has nothing to do with "luck" and everything to do with discipline and willpower. And that is how the great majority of those on this board got to where they are.


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Yep, my successful restaurant buddy who retired at fifty just got rid of his old truck and got a used 95 model in great shape. Spent much less that for a new one. There are more than one way to save your hard earned money.
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Old 10-24-2014, 03:04 PM   #87
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The idea that luck ( a presumably random event) plays a major role in success is not in accord with my experience of life in the US. Or else it must run in families: All my sibs, cousins and children somehow got lucky! I go with the definition of luck as the intersection of attitude, preparation and hard work....
Amen Brother Bob.
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Old 10-24-2014, 03:16 PM   #88
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This seems to be a double thread. One about being lucky or not in life, and the other about squirrel hunting LOL!!


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Old 10-24-2014, 03:22 PM   #89
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Certainly life is not fair. But if you don't apply yourself the outcome is certain.
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Old 10-24-2014, 03:42 PM   #90
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This seems to be a double thread. One about being lucky or not in life, and the other about squirrel hunting LOL!!


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Well, you need to be lucky to hit that squirrel from 50 yards away with a rifle of your choice.
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Old 10-24-2014, 04:00 PM   #91
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+1
Fear has lot to do with it....we may be ashamed to admit it....
For me it was fear of being broke when I was old. This was inspired by seeing relatives who were broke when they were old. And now that I'm on the verge of being old, I'm not broke. (not rich either, but so what).

From what I have witnessed, health issues (physical and mental) are the number one reason people end up old and broke, as those affect many different choices one makes. In that, I am lucky.
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Old 10-24-2014, 04:06 PM   #92
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A thread like this is a main reason why I keep returning to this forum. You guys are crazy, and I love it!!! Most of my thoughts already made. If any of you looking to hunt weasel, there is this guy here... :')
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Old 10-24-2014, 05:08 PM   #93
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Squirrels aside...

IMO, these articles are not helpful. They validate a sense of hopelessness... "America's middle class knows it's facing a grim retirement, but can't do anything about it." Anyone "struggling" to save for retirement, will read that and at least feel better that they're not the only one, and it's not their fault. It's the "evisceration of defined-benefit pensions" and the "huge decline in home and stock market values." Leading to the "inescapable solution" to expand social security.

Bull. It is their fault. But it's rarely too late to re-group and change course.

What WOULD be helpful are more articles about people who were struggling and then turned it around and retired early. Success stories. Positive, motivational, how-to LBYM stories. Stories that gave hope and a path instead of validating hopelessness.

I realize that negativity sells in the media business. But considering the author is a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, I would have expected a little less advocacy, and a little more balance and objectivity.
These type articles scare me into saving even more. I love them for the fear factor.

Also the whole point of these articles is to report the reality of a retirement crisis in America. It can't be ignored.

Its just like the student loan debt crisis. Somebody has to report the story.

I don't think the millions of Americans who will retire eating squirrels are going to find comfort in articles like these.
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Old 10-24-2014, 05:55 PM   #94
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My favorite definition of "luck" is "where preparation meets opportunity." Yes, sometimes there is *pure* luck, but I think most of what people call "luck" isn't pure luck but rather involved at least *some* prior planning and readiness to seize upon good fortune.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:02 PM   #95
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Also the whole point of these articles is to report the reality of a retirement crisis in America. It can't be ignored.

Its just like the student loan debt crisis. Somebody has to report the story.

I don't think the millions of Americans who will retire eating squirrels are going to find comfort in articles like these.
I'm not convinced that millions will be eating squirrels or that it amounts to a crisis. On top of SS alone there are other social welfare programs that many if not most will qualify for such as heating costs assistance and SNAP.

I do think that millions will find retirement much more difficult than they had envisioned, will have to downsize and not by choice, will have to do with one used car or no car, and will not be eating any filet mignon and more tuna. Whether that constitutes a "crisis" is debatable.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:05 PM   #96
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I do think that millions will find retirement much more difficult than they had envisioned, will have to downsize and not by choice, will have to do with one used car or no car...
The problem with "no car", of course, is that decent "walkable" neighborhoods that don't require a car tend to be quite expensive.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:17 PM   #97
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The problem with "no car", of course, is that decent "walkable" neighborhoods that don't require a car tend to be quite expensive.
Quite true in the major cities of course but doable in small towns. My paternal grandparents didn't have a car for as long as I knew them and were poor, or at least an extra two dollars was a big deal in 1970. But they had a paid for house, a lot of borrowed furniture, to my knowledge never went to a restaurant, and the like. They lived in Tyrone, PA and could walk to a small grocery store. In fact one could walk the width of the town in about a half hour or forty-five minutes.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:20 PM   #98
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I'm not convinced that millions will be eating squirrels or that it amounts to a crisis. On top of SS alone there are other social welfare programs that many if not most will qualify for such as heating costs assistance and SNAP.

I do think that millions will find retirement much more difficult than they had envisioned, will have to downsize and not by choice, will have to do with one used car or no car, and will not be eating any filet mignon and more tuna. Whether that constitutes a "crisis" is debatable.
I hope you are correct. Either way its definitely going to be expensive for taxpayers .
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:31 PM   #99
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I guess that one needs to differentiate hard physical work from long hours and stressful work.
Yep. I worked as a software dev in a company where offices were attached to the warehouse, got so many half-joking comments in the break room about how nice it must be to be sitting there in the air conditioning. They had no idea the additional shitty things that come along with that desk job.
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Old 10-24-2014, 06:41 PM   #100
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Then again, supermarket chicken is loaded with salmonella and campylobacter, pork carries trichinosis
I remember growing up always being warned about undercooking pork because of trich, but it is my understanding it is extremely rare now just a handful of cases each year almost all from eating wild game or home-reared pigs.

So go treat yourself to a nice medium rare pork chop from the grocery store.
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