Just had my CC details stolen

[TromboneAl]

We had this happen when we were on a trip (click here for blog entry), and it was a big bother:

I've found that without a credit card, one feels a bit like a second-class citizen. You can't reserve a hotel room or campsite, gasoline purchases aren't as quick and easy, and you have to track your purchases manually. Also, the mishap is putting a crimp in the free-wheeling nature of our trip.

So, I wanted to get the new cards ASAP. The problem was discovered on the Friday before Memorial day weekend, adding to the complication. But with some time spent on the cell phone at a rest area, I set up a motel stay at an Econolodge, and arranged for overnight Fedexing (with Saturday delivery) of the new cards. That's why, as I write this, I'm sitting in the lobby of the Econolodge.

​

Here's what I've learned:

1. Use a virtual credit card, as grasshopper recommended. With "ShopSafe" it's a bit of a bother, because the virtual cards only last a year, and you can't increase the expiration date during the last month. However, even if you have to cancel your card, these numbers will still work (they will rollover to your new number). I use virtual numbers for all online transactions, and I create a bunch ahead of time for convenience. I figure that you are much more likely to have your number stolen with an online transaction than at a cafe, where the thief may be more vulnerable.

2. Redoing all the numbers for recurring transactions isn't quite as bad as you might think. For many vendors, it only take a minute online. Others, for example, Blue Cross employ idiots, and you need to write or fax something in to change the number.

3. For several recurring payments, I now use automatic checking account bill payments or have a check sent automatically each month for the average value of a bill. If you think this is more dangerous, because you are making your checking account number available, realize that that is true even if you send a paper check.

4. As mentioned, the virtual CC number doesn't work with Amazon, because some transactions go through a different merchant. I've talked about this with an Amazon person, and they are aware of the problem. However, the solution I use is to buy myself a gift card (with a virtual number), making for trouble-free purchases.

But in summary, finding out, while on a trip, that your card number has been stolen is such a bother, that it's worth some preventative measures.

 

[Lsbcal]

We only have a few recurring transactions on CC. Most have been on checking for years without any issue.

Almost all web purchases are on Amazon. Now generally I use the Amazon Visa card and never had an issue with using any CC with Amazon.

 

[TromboneAl]

Now generally I use the Amazon Visa card and never had an issue with using any CC with Amazon.

The issue only occurs if you use a virtual CC number.

 

[Lsbcal]

The issue only occurs if you use a virtual CC number.

The Amazon CC card gives you 3% back, have not had any problems with it. What's not to like?

 

[BigNick]

Why do you need to get the money reimbursed? Why did you pay the bill in the first place?

Sorry, I should have said it's a debit card, with once-a-month billing. 25th of the month rolls around, I get a statement and the amount gets debited. (I can check online, but I didn't for a few days in this case). Claims are made after the fact.

For the second month, my bank branch advised me to wait until I had the formal printed bill from them, rather than print out a copy from their online banking. I had to make a formal declaration of a crime at the police station before the bank would reimburse me (maybe they had a lot of people making fake claims that they didn't buy that laptop on eBay), and they reckoned that it would be "easier" for the police to accept the card statement on letterhead.

 

[tryan]

A friend gave his son his CC to buy games for his X-box ... the x-box then ends up at his friends house (CC info still on the account/box). Kid racked up 3k in upgrades.

CC company refused to retract the charges ... said my friend should have known/knew the CC was tied to the X-box account.

OUCH!

 

[Mulligan]

A friend gave his son his CC to buy games for his X-box ... the x-box then ends up at his friends house (CC info still on the account/box). Kid racked up 3k in upgrades.

CC company refused to retract the charges ... said my friend should have known/knew the CC was tied to the X-box account.

OUCH!

Well that would have ended up as a $3015 loss to me if he was my son after I wore that $15 belt out on his hide!

 

[TromboneAl]

The Amazon CC card gives you 3% back, have not had any problems with it. What's not to like?

I'm sorry for not being clear.

A problem with any credit card is that the number might be stolen. For example if someone hacks your system, or an employee gets the number, then you will have to cancel your card. That is something not to like.

One way to solve this is to have a virtual credit card number generated that can only be used with a single merchant. You can also set a credit limit of $30, for example. In that case, even if someone steals the credit card number, he/she can't use it.

A problem can occur when you set up a virtual number for two individual transactions on Amazon. You expect both to go through. However, the first is a direct Amazon purchase, and the second is an Amazon Marketplace transaction. As a result, they are seen as two separate merchants, and the second transaction fails.

 

[Lsbcal]

Hi Al, I'm learning a bit about virtual CC numbers. Thanks.

I tend to be attracted to complexity like a moth to the flame. Maybe I'll try it but right now I'm getting too much electronic transaction stimulation via several Amazon purchases, dealing with a new CC account, learning how to handle laptop security while on vacation, dealing with 2 Kindle ebooks, etc., etc. I'm too much of a perfectionist and need to step back from the complexity.

I'm going to just sit and watch a DVD tonight with DW and have a Skinny Cow ice cream.

 

[Nords]

I'm going to just sit and watch a DVD tonight with DW and have a Skinny Cow ice cream.

I thought your avatar was Blue Bunny...

 

[Lsbcal]

I thought your avatar was Blue Bunny...

They have to eat too ...
Now for breakfast as it is the AM here.

 

[veremchuka]

Well that would have ended up as a $3015 loss to me if he was my son after I wore that $15 belt out on his hide!

 

[Htown Harry]

I don't have any advice, Alan, but I'll try to cheer you up with a very funny story from a storyteller's event. ("law into his own hands" refers to detective work, not revenge)

Tristan Jimerson has his credit card number stolen, and he takes the law into his own hands to bring the thief to justice...

PRX Piece: The Moth Radio Hour 602
Segment 2, Story starts at 2:00.

 

[Alan]

Thanks Harry, that was hilarious.

I've passed the link onto my wife and daughter (who arrived to spend the weekend with us the same day I discovered it had happened).

 

[TromboneAl]

IIRC, the credit card companies don't find it worth their while to pursue the thieves.

 

[Alan]

IIRC, the credit card companies don't find it worth their while to pursue the thieves.

Correct - that's because it doesn't cost them much. The e-mail I received from Amazon said that the vendors won't get paid, so even Amazon don't lose the money, even though I think it is within Amazon's ability to send me an e-mail every time MY credit card is registered to a new account so Amazon are in a position to prevent this.

The Amazon fraud guy told me the first name of the person who had created the account and registered my credit card for payments (and asked if I knew anyone of that name). It is apparently fairly common for credit cards to be registered against an account of a different name, particularly with parents and children, however, how hard can it be for the system to send an e-mail to the owner of the credit card to confirm when this takes place, even with husbands and wives?

 

[Dawg52]

Sorry Alan. But your story is a good kick in the butt for me to review my acct more often. I have only been doing it maybe twice a month.

 

[JohnDoe]

Sorry, I should have said it's a debit card, with once-a-month billing. 25th of the month rolls around, I get a statement and the amount gets debited. (I can check online, but I didn't for a few days in this case). Claims are made after the fact.

For the second month, my bank branch advised me to wait until I had the formal printed bill from them, rather than print out a copy from their online banking. I had to make a formal declaration of a crime at the police station before the bank would reimburse me (maybe they had a lot of people making fake claims that they didn't buy that laptop on eBay), and they reckoned that it would be "easier" for the police to accept the card statement on letterhead.

You should be able to call as soon as you see the charge, tell them it's fraud and they MUST credit you account within 24 or 48 hours and block and reissue a card.

Then you have have to return an affidavit of fraud with in 30-45 days or they will put the charges back on.

Once they get documentation, they can start their charge back process.

 

[Lsbcal]

I was a bit worried that our son was putting a few thousand into his account and using his debit card. So I asked the banker at his bank what would happen if there is fraud. He told me the funds have to be made available within a few days and that our son would not have to prove fraud.

Now I don't have to nag DS to change his habits and will stop worrying about this one.

 

[grasshopper]

I was a bit worried that our son was putting a few thousand into his account and using his debit card. So I asked the banker at his bank what would happen if there is fraud. He told me the funds have to be made available within a few days and that our son would not have to prove fraud.

Now I don't have to nag DS to change his habits and will stop worrying about this one.

My banker told me to select charge instead of debt, and to sign instead of using your PIN. Than my banker said it is treated with CC regulations which are different from debt.

 

[Rustward]

My banker told me to select charge instead of debt, and to sign instead of using your PIN. Than my banker said it is treated with CC regulations which are different from debt.

+1

With credit card fraud, the money never leaves your account (in some cases the money never even exists).

With a debit card, your money is taken from your account before you know it. I believe most banks would be very hesitant to just put the money back into the account without investigating. There are just too many dishonest people out there.

I was a bit worried that our son was putting a few thousand into his account and using his debit card. So I asked the banker at his bank what would happen if there is fraud. He told me the funds have to be made available within a few days and that our son would not have to prove fraud.

Now I don't have to nag DS to change his habits and will stop worrying about this one.

Lsbcal, I am not doubting that you were told this, but I suggest that you double check on this.

Edit to add: When you think about it, there is very little incentive for the bank to even care about debit card fraud -- the bank is not out of anything -- they even make a few cents on the transaction.

 

[W2R]

I was a bit worried that our son was putting a few thousand into his account and using his debit card. So I asked the banker at his bank what would happen if there is fraud. He told me the funds have to be made available within a few days and that our son would not have to prove fraud.

Now I don't have to nag DS to change his habits and will stop worrying about this one.

Yes, this has been my experience and that of many others with the debit Mastercards that are available at banks in my area. It has been this way here for many years here. Mastercard covers the fraud aspects AFAIK. However, financial advice columns from Yahoo and similar sources keep printing scare articles equating these cards with old fashioned ATM cards, and apparently fraud with those cards is a much more difficult matter for the consumer.

You should be able to call as soon as you see the charge, tell them it's fraud and they MUST credit you account within 24 or 48 hours and block and reissue a card.

Then you have have to return an affidavit of fraud with in 30-45 days or they will put the charges back on.

Once they get documentation, they can start their charge back process.

This was my experience with debit card fraud as well. The money was put back in my account the day I went to my bank to report the fraud. Then a couple of months later I received a letter saying they wouldn't be removing it again because they determined it was indeed fraud.

 

[Rustward]

Yes, this has been my experience and that of many others with the debit Mastercards that are available at banks in my area. It has been this way here for many years here. Mastercard covers the fraud aspects AFAIK. However, financial advice columns from Yahoo and similar sources keep printing scare articles equating these cards with old fashioned ATM cards, and apparently fraud with those cards is a much more difficult matter for the consumer.



This was my experience with debit card fraud as well. The money was put back in my account the day I went to my bank to report the fraud. Then a couple of months later I received a letter saying they wouldn't be removing it again because they determined it was indeed fraud.

This must be a relatively recent change. I still do not like risking having my ACH items bounce because they appeared in the window when the account was emptied, and having to deal with all the inconvenience around that. Pay your money, take your pick.

 

[Lsbcal]

Regarding the debit card security, for myself I rarely use a debit card and then only at places where I never let the card out of my sight. For DS I just have to be satisfied that he is reasonably secure so as to avoid another unsolicited piece of advice giving -- the burdens of a parent .

I talk to him regularly about security regarding cards, passwords, etc. Yesterday I read about the LinkedIn password thefts. He has a linked in account but wasn't interested in signing in and changing his password. I mentioned some password procedures but who knows how much of this stuff sticks.

 

[W2R]

This must be a relatively recent change. I still do not like risking having my ACH items bounce because they appeared in the window when the account was emptied, and having to deal with all the inconvenience around that. Pay your money, take your pick.

The bank took care of all that for me, too (although I don't know if that was required or simply because they were being nice). Paid everything that should have been paid, and no bounce charges.

Regarding the debit card security, for myself I rarely use a debit card and then only at places where I never let the card out of my sight.

Same here. Probably a debit card wouldn't work all that well for me if I used it a lot. I always pay in cash at restaurants and so on.