Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-03-2015, 08:20 AM   #21
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
brewer12345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 16,391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarah in SC View Post

Oh and PS, Brewer, my young Russian co-worker just passed level 3. Over the moon!!! I knew she was smarter than me, now I can prove it!
Congrats to her! That is a huge accomplishment and no doubt a relief.
__________________

__________________
brewer12345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 10-03-2015, 09:25 AM   #22
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 903
Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem View Post
Much depends on the inflation "protection" that is included.
The tool at this web page allows you to see what LTCI through the Federal LTC program costs for a policy similar to the ones you're looking at. You might expect to pay more or less, but it should give you a point of reference. coverage.
Those plans, I'd actually consider getting. Does anyone else offer an "unlimited" plan?
__________________

__________________
hnzw_rui is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 09:32 AM   #23
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
3 years coverage still leaves you with a two year gap if you intend to shift assets . but they already increased the look back from 3 to 5 years
But they've got a "shared coverage" policy, so they have enough time to get the first person through the lookback zone. That's a big deal for many couples. This technique is still not without risk (increase of the lookback period, both people needing LTC at once, etc), but it covers a big portion of the present "hole".
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 09:32 AM   #24
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
brewer12345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 16,391
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnzw_rui View Post
Those plans, I'd actually consider getting. Does anyone else offer an "unlimited" plan?
When I last discussed this with industry players a couple years ago, there was really nobody left commercially offering unlimited LTC. Too many got their heads handed to them with this product and now they concentrate on 3 and 5 year plans.
__________________
"There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest have to pee on the electric fence for themselves."



- Will Rogers
brewer12345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 09:37 AM   #25
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnzw_rui View Post
Those plans, I'd actually consider getting. Does anyone else offer an "unlimited" plan?
Not that I know of, and I wouldn't be surprised if that is no longer an option for new policies the next time they revise this program. The "unlimited" time period is a great offering, and does what many people expect insurance to do--cover them for an unanticipated catastrophic event. States ought to be pushing to at least have these "unlimited time period" plans offered, as a means to keep people off Medicaid. The ACA removed caps on health insurance, but they remain prevalent in LTCI.
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 09:46 AM   #26
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnzw_rui View Post
Those plans, I'd actually consider getting. Does anyone else offer an "unlimited" plan?
usually you do not need unlimited . with a good partnership plan medicaid picks up the bills while you keep the assets .

many states are actually encouraging medicaid use after the insurance runs out by making it part of the plan. ny even created a special form called MEC medicaid extend coverage to go with the plans .
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 11:34 AM   #27
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
many states are actually encouraging medicaid use after the insurance runs out by making it part of the plan. ny even created a special form called MEC medicaid extend coverage to go with the plans .
Another way to view this is that states are encouraging people to buy LTCI by integrating it with Medicaid (through the Partnership Programs). That serves the interests of the states (and also the purchasers of LTCI). But I wouldn't say the states are interested in increasing their Medicaid costs--quite the opposite.
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 02:16 PM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
the states do not want to see their residents impoverished , especially the say at home spouse .

already CT , NY AND FLORIDA are following the lead of the high court in CT and ordering medicaid to negotiate a settlement when a spouse says no and the settlement cannot diminish the stay at home spouses lifestyle .

our estate attorney who is one of the most popular in nyc said he has zero law suites brought by medicaid now , only negotiations for an acceptable amount
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 03:30 PM   #29
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 202
Mathjak, can you explain what you mean about ordering Medicaid to negotiate a settlement when a spouse says no? Recently retired and considering long-term care and trying to understand this. Does the amount of your retirement savings come into play when determining whether to choose a state partnership plan?

Sent from my KFTHWA using Tapatalk
__________________
Debinnov a is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2015, 03:55 PM   #30
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
A spouse has the right to say no under the medicaid act and not pay for the spouse in the home and he can't be thrown out.

But medicaid has the right to recovery . Either suing the spouse or waiting until the stay at home spouse dies and reclaiming from the estate.

Well medicaid sued a woman in ct. And the case went to the highest court.

The judge ruled he was not going to impoverish the people of his state because this country has a bad system.

So he left it open ended by ordering mrs jones and medicaid to find an acceptable amount that she could pay without taking a big step downward in life style.

Ny ,ct and florida courts have been following suit and at this point negotions have been taking place between medicaid and the estate attorneys who do this kind of work.
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 07:27 AM   #31
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 91
When we made our LTC plunge here in NY we decided to go with a lifetime duration LTC product from Mass Mutual with a starting daily of $300 (a few years ago) plus inflation protection. We liked that MM had survived the 2008 crash without a downgrade.

We decided against the NY Partnership program. I calculated that with a nursing home stay over 3 years (we could self insure for 3 years: not pleasant but doable) we would each have too much RMD or SS income which could then be grabbed by Medicaid. That income could not be even partially shielded without a lot of trouble and work, and could not be fully shielded in any event. I remember this was a pretty complex look ahead calculation, and I was not sure I had it right.

The cost of our MM policy is just over $11,000 for the two of us and has not changed (yet). We were 61 for me and 59 for DW when purchased. The Partnership Policy was around $6500 for the two of us for 3 years. With the NY State tax credit and the Federal deduction against my self employment income we figured the lifetime policy was worth it.

I think of it as a term policy and each year we decide whether to stay with it. So far we have but so far MM has not raised the premium.
__________________
ZMAN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 07:46 AM   #32
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
the ny partnership plan has no limitations on income for the stay at home spouse if medicaid is required .

that was one of the perks that made us go for the plan . no income limit and no shifting of assets was the deal maker . unlike the below 3k a month limitation on regular medicaid the MEC version of medicaid you go on has no limitiations and only a request that you contribute 25% for the spouse being cared for but it is only request . even at 25% it would be a bargain .
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 02:59 PM   #33
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
mathjak107......


With your partnership plan, if you live long enough to exhaust the LTC insurance coverage and switch to Medicaid, do you get switched to Medicaid accommodations in the NH or do you get to stay in the nicer private pay section?
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 03:06 PM   #34
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
you have to check when you choose a home whether on your own money or insurance whether they will take medicaid .

most of them if not all will .

they may not except medicaid patients day 1 but once you are in they assume at some point unless you are wealthy you will get medicaid at some point .
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 03:27 PM   #35
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
you have to check when you choose a home whether on your own money or insurance whether they will take medicaid .

.
I'm sure it varies from state to state. Here, due to difficulties NH's have getting the state to pay Medicaid money owed, NH's are becoming less willing to have Medicaid accommodations that are similar to their private pay accommodations. Some don't take Medicaid at all anymore and some of those that still do only offer multi-bed ward type situations. Ugh!

We worked hard to get MIL into a private pay situation where when she ran out of funds (as she has), her ongoing care would be similar to that she received as private pay and, so far, we seem to have succeeded. But here it's a challenging situation. In MIL's NH, the vast majority of clients are private pay and that seems to help.

I'd encourage folks trying to put together plans for their own or loved ones LTC to consider carefully the Medicaid situation in your state before going with a plan where the "perk" is being on Medicaid when the insurance runs out. It might be OK....... Or it might not. Ask questions and inspect up front. Understand exactly what Medicaid accommodations and services will be vs private pay.
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 05:55 PM   #36
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 1,666
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
mathjak107......


With your partnership plan, if you live long enough to exhaust the LTC insurance coverage and switch to Medicaid, do you get switched to Medicaid accommodations in the NH or do you get to stay in the nicer private pay section?
I think mathjak107 is referring to a ny partnership plan with unlimited asset protection. Only 2 states offer such plans, NH is not one of them. I believe he could not use NH facilities and get the unlimited asset protection. Thus the community spouse would have limits in NH and most other states. I don't know if he'd have to change facilities under the modified medicaid agreement in the partnership plan. Likely dependent on the LTCF. Many use to grandfather patients in if they had be there for a while footing the whole bill. Have not checked recently since my mom went into a facility.
__________________
bingybear is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2015, 06:18 PM   #37
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,414
yes the total asset plan is what we have . most states offer only what is called dollar for dollar . but what about income protection , do they offer that ?
__________________
mathjak107 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2015, 01:38 AM   #38
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Granbury
Posts: 91
Thanks All.
__________________
World Traveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2015, 08:29 AM   #39
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 3,820
Quote:
Originally Posted by brewer12345 View Post
Most do not sell LTC any more, but for the record: NWM, MassMutual, NY Life, Guardian, TIAA-CREF, Thrivent, USAA. There are a few smaller guys out there with solid credit profiles, but those are the big boys in most markets.
Sorry for the slow response, but thanks for your advice.
I'm kind of surprised Thrivent is still in the market, I thought they dropped LTCi as part of the merger.
I'll look at these.
__________________
Independent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2015, 09:24 AM   #40
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
brewer12345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 16,391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Independent View Post
Sorry for the slow response, but thanks for your advice.
I'm kind of surprised Thrivent is still in the market, I thought they dropped LTCi as part of the merger.
I'll look at these.
To be clear, those are the companies I think have extremely strong financial profiles, not necessarily ones that sell LTCI. To my knowledge, Thrivent has not sold that product in many years.
__________________

__________________
"There are three kinds of men. The one that learns by reading. The few who learn by observation. The rest have to pee on the electric fence for themselves."



- Will Rogers
brewer12345 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Advice, Advice and More Advice flyfishnevada Life after FIRE 18 06-26-2010 06:44 PM
(FAQ archive): Long-term care (LTC) and LTC insurance Nords Early Retirement FAQs 0 10-24-2007 12:02 PM
LTC Insurance question xprinter FIRE and Money 8 03-27-2005 01:05 PM
LTC insurance Smoochie Other topics 18 10-26-2004 10:56 AM
ltc & disability insurance frugal Other topics 7 12-08-2003 08:14 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:12 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.