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Old 05-05-2013, 03:57 PM   #41
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Mr. A. likes Room with a View. But he also likes Die Hard and that ilk, so I guess it balances out

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Nah, it's more like someone telling you to "turn in your man card" in response to you saying something like:

"I couldn't watch the football game because my wife dragged me out to go furniture shopping."
or
"I thought 'Room with a View' (or some other chick flick) was a really well-done movie."
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Old 05-05-2013, 06:08 PM   #42
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I suspect most of the complaints about the negative effect of marriage on wealth are from people who divorced and ended up without a pot to piss in. That is often guys complaining but the impact is generally worse on women. Absent divorce, two working spouses can save up a lot more towards retirement than either could singly. And their costs as a couple are far less than two single households. And, if one of them dies, their estate passes to the other free and clear. If DW and I got divorced now we could both do OK financially but no where near as well as we can are doing together.
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Old 05-05-2013, 06:53 PM   #43
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I suspect most of the complaints about the negative effect of marriage on wealth are from people who divorced and ended up without a pot to piss in. That is often guys complaining but the impact is generally worse on women. Absent divorce, two working spouses can save up a lot more towards retirement than either could singly. And their costs as a couple are far less than two single households. And, if one of them dies, their estate passes to the other free and clear. If DW and I got divorced now we could both do OK financially but no where near as well as we can are doing together.
Not all. I don't feel like getting into the story but we didn't have the same views on spending, and I didn't do a good job of making my case, so we battled debt pretty much the whole time. Once we divorced, I got out of debt and stayed out of debt, even with child support.
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Old 05-05-2013, 07:07 PM   #44
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Mr. A. likes Room with a View.
If he admits this, he needs to turn in his man card.
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:03 PM   #45
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I find this discussion interesting. I'm in my mid 40's and have never been married, mainly because I am VERY independent. I figure I have to endue so much compromise in my professional life (aka, a job) that at this time in my life, I refuse to accept any in my personal life.

In my job, I have to answer to a boss all day long, five days a week. But when I'm on my time, I do what I want, when I want, and spend money on whatever I want, and I never have to ask anybody's permission. I like that.

I've often wondered if/when I retire, if I would be willing to then accept compromise in my personal life, since I wouldn't have anymore in my professional life. I'm not sure I could. I've grown to enjoy my freedom.

One thing is for sure, however, and this relates to the financial aspects of this forum topic...if I ever did get married, two things would be a given:

1. No comingling of income or funds. There would be "ours", "yours", and "mine". The "ours" bucket would be funded from both incomes and used to pay common expenses. The other two would be each person's own money and used for whatever they wanted. I've personally seen family members' marriages implode because of mixed funds and financial arguments (not to mention divorce), and I would never go down that path.

2. Prenup would be required. Assuming I manage to accumulate enough over the next couple years to retire and quit the 9-to-5 world, I am not putting that at risk for any person. I have a sister who's been divorced three times, so I've seen ugly divorces play out in the family in person. Not putting myself at risk of that, no matter how much I feel I love the other person. Prenup protects us both, and if that's seen as un-romantic...tough. I am not going back into the working world due to losing everything I have in a messy divorce.

I guess it's a good thing getting married isn't a life goal of mine. I doubt these sentiments would be seen as desirable traits by the fairer sex If it ever happens, fine. If not, I'm okay with that, too.
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:14 PM   #46
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LoneAspen -- Not much of a romantic I see :P I can only hope the relationship I've been in for the last couple years works out. Everything is shared, our business is shared, and we came into the relationship with the same interests, so there's been no compromise yet, except for which countries we plan on traveling to first! He likes East Asia, I like South America :P

The longest lasting relationships I've seen seem to involve not much compromise at all, so hopefully you marry a clone if you ever decide to jump!
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:31 PM   #47
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Prenup: "I'll show you mine if you show me yours".
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Old 05-05-2013, 08:36 PM   #48
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(The paper didn't get into all of the details but I think a huge chunk of this is savings in the cost of housing, among other things.)
If I were single, I'd have no problem just renting a room or getting a very small micro apt/condo. I look fondly back at the days when I spent only a few hundred dollars/month on rent for just a room. Although we don't need a lot of space, I think with the wife we will need at least 750 sq ft or so.
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:09 PM   #49
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I never chafed over compromise until our children were up. At that point, it suddenly seemed a lot less attractive.

The financial hit of divorce after retirement is big, but as the saying goes, it's worth it.

I think I was willing to be a total team player, when there was the whole team. I guess to me a couple does not meet the requirement, though it can be fun.

Ha
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Old 05-05-2013, 10:17 PM   #50
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Getting married help my wife and I financially, until we had our daughter.

Daycare is a brutal expense, but not one that I ever feel like skimping on.
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Old 05-05-2013, 11:53 PM   #51
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I believe I can safely say I'm much better off financially married, my wife is the frugal one. As long as we don't add in kids and grand kids, those are the areas where she is NOT frugal.
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Old 05-06-2013, 12:17 AM   #52
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LoneAspen -- Not much of a romantic I see :P I can only hope the relationship I've been in for the last couple years works out. Everything is shared, our business is shared, and we came into the relationship with the same interests, so there's been no compromise yet, except for which countries we plan on traveling to first! He likes East Asia, I like South America :P

The longest lasting relationships I've seen seem to involve not much compromise at all, so hopefully you marry a clone if you ever decide to jump!
LOL - In rereading my post, it kind of startled even me how "negative" it sounded. I guess if I met someone just as independent as me, it would work out peachy. Somebody who also earned their own money, and after putting enough in to satisfy mutual expenses (housing, etc) spent it on enjoying whatever, without the need to ask my permission. That would be cool.

I cringe when I hear friends of mine talk about having to ask each others' permission to spend their own money on things they want. And it doesn't just extend to finances, sometimes it's non-financial things, such as going out with friends one night.

In my view, two grown adults in a relationship should be secure enough financially, and emotionally, not to have to ask each others' permission to spend their own money on what they want (again, AFTER mutual expenses are taken care of), or do things they want.

If I found somebody just as independent as I am, it would probably be match made in Heaven.
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Old 05-06-2013, 12:44 AM   #53
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If you are single, you don't need to ask permission to do things... like change the channel on the remote.
DW does not need to ask permission to do that ... nor has she ever done so
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Old 05-06-2013, 08:37 AM   #54
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As the saying goes, "opposites attract".
I thought the saying was "Birds of a feather flock together"?
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Old 05-06-2013, 12:52 PM   #55
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Divorce is awful...my DH's was especially awful...we are in the process of rebuilding net worth for him. The only saving grace for our retirement is that I started the process in my 20's...I am 10 years younger than him. In five years, the child support and the college expenses will be over! We are looking into moving to the lesser cost of living area (currently in NJ). If everything plays out correctly, he will be retired at 60, 62 at the latest. I will still do what I do since I am semi-retired and love what I do. DH will probably do what he loves to do (carpentry, home renovations, and building things) for our home as well as a side gig...though he will not NEED to do it.
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Old 05-06-2013, 02:03 PM   #56
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Oh, dear. Are there consequences, are they serious? He seems just the same as usual. Deep voice, etc.

Amethyst

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If he admits this, he needs to turn in his man card.
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Old 05-06-2013, 02:31 PM   #57
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Kind of appropriate

Money may not be the only thing to consider:

AOL On - It Takes Women Six Months to Change Their Partner

6 months..and you aren't the guy you used to be
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Old 05-06-2013, 02:38 PM   #58
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Kind of appropriate

Money may not be the only thing to consider:

AOL On - It Takes Women Six Months to Change Their Partner

6 months..and you aren't the guy you used to be
Male leggings??!!! That's a NO for sure!!
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Old 05-06-2013, 03:22 PM   #59
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Oh, dear. Are there consequences, are they serious? He seems just the same as usual. Deep voice, etc.

Amethyst
He just seems that way. He probably can't even look at himself in the mirror.
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Old 05-06-2013, 04:18 PM   #60
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LOL - In rereading my post, it kind of startled even me how "negative" it sounded. I guess if I met someone just as independent as me, it would work out peachy. Somebody who also earned their own money, and after putting enough in to satisfy mutual expenses (housing, etc) spent it on enjoying whatever, without the need to ask my permission. That would be cool.

I cringe when I hear friends of mine talk about having to ask each others' permission to spend their own money on things they want. And it doesn't just extend to finances, sometimes it's non-financial things, such as going out with friends one night.

In my view, two grown adults in a relationship should be secure enough financially, and emotionally, not to have to ask each others' permission to spend their own money on what they want (again, AFTER mutual expenses are taken care of), or do things they want.

If I found somebody just as independent as I am, it would probably be match made in Heaven.
LoneAspen - both my husband and I had similar view points when we started dating and got married. We were both older (I was 38, he was 47) We both had careers, both owned houses, etc. So when we first got married we kept finances separate. Since he moved into my house - he paid me rent equal to half the mortgage.

When we relocated to my home town and bought our house - we started comingling. And by the time the second kid was born - everything but retirement accounts was comingled. It just made sense.

As far as needing permission to go buy something... our way of dealing with it is less about permission, as discussion. We both have the freedom to spend about $200 on something that's none typical (groceries, etc are recurring and don't need discussion - but a new car or a new computer should be discussed.) The discussion isn't typically about yes/no... it's about which account to use to pay for it - and make sure the other person doesn't also have a big ticket purchase planned. We pay off our credit cards each month - so cash flow needs to be managed.

My husband recently spent about $8k on things for himself - I didn't say no... just moved money around to accommodate it. When I wanted to go on a weekend away with my best friend - he said go for it (and we moved money around to accommodate it.)

As far as going out - we have kids - so, yeah, a communication about who's picking up the kids from after-school programs, or who's arranging a sitter, is in order... That's just courtesy.
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