Merry Christmas from the power company

[clifp]

we are getting a 30% increase at our home in PA in january...that will bring us to .15 a kwh... at our new york place we pay .21

.21 is pretty expensive. Of course I pay between .24 and .25 KWH. hit $.30 a KWH when oil prices went over $100 a few years ago. Of course, at a lovely 82 degrees today I didn't need to run the furnace.

 

[eridanus]

I'm paying 5.25 cents/kWh for using <500 kWh. I was fortunate enough to lock in wind rates for 10 years, and my utility isn't participating in the "free market."

 

[ERD50]

I'm paying 5.25 cents/kWh for using <500 kWh. I was fortunate enough to lock in wind rates for 10 years, and my utility isn't participating in the "free market."

Interesting, can you tell us more? -ERD50

 

[eridanus]

Interesting, can you tell us more? -ERD50

In Texas, municipal and co-operative utilities didn't have to join the deregulated electricity market. They could remain a monopoly in their area of service. This has been, in general, a boon to those in the still closed markets.

As for the wind power locked rates, they offered and I accepted. That only affects the "recovery" charge. The rate excluding recovery is 3.55cents/kWh.

 

[Zathras]

Never realized how lucky we are to have our 7.5-8.5 cents per kWh rates. That's probably why it doesn't make financial sense for me to conserve or get energy efficient things done (ac, furnace, fridge, dryer, windows, etc) vs the general advice among the rest of the nation.

The reason rates go up is utilities need to produce (or buy) more electricity. If yours is the common conclusion in your area, you are more likely to see rate increases.
If everyone (or enough people) do the painfully simple things now, they will not have to pay later. No luck involved.

 

[JOHNNIE36]

I haven't been on the portal in quite some time but just returning, this thread peaked my interest. I can't get over some of the monthly bills y'all are talking about. Ref my own: For a 2025 sq ft house in west central Florida, and I'm on the "equal monthly payment plan", my levelized bill is $211/mo for the year. We used 1185 kwh last month. Our rates are $0.053 for the irst 1000kwh and $.063 for the additional 185 kwh. However, those charges are for what it cost Tampa Electric to produce that energy. The charges for the fuel used by Tampa Electric are in addition to that. The fuel charge for last month was $.048/kwh for the first 1000kwh and $.058 for the additional 185 kwh. Sound confusing? In a nut shell my average electric cost and taxes is $200.14 per month year round. This is a totally electric house with the biggest usage being A/C. I'd love some of those $45 monthly bills y'all are getting.

 

[W2R]

I haven't been on the portal in quite some time but just returning, this thread peaked my interest. I can't get over some of the monthly bills y'all are talking about. Ref my own: For a 2025 sq ft house in west central Florida, and I'm on the "equal monthly payment plan", my levelized bill is $211/mo for the year. We used 1185 kwh last month. Our rates are $0.053 for the irst 1000kwh and $.063 for the additional 185 kwh. However, those charges are for what it cost Tampa Electric to produce that energy. The charges for the fuel used by Tampa Electric are in addition to that. The fuel charge for last month was $.048/kwh for the first 1000kwh and $.058 for the additional 185 kwh. Sound confusing? In a nut shell my average electric cost and taxes is $200.14 per month year round. This is a totally electric house with the biggest usage being A/C. I'd love some of those $45 monthly bills y'all are getting.

I can't get over your monthly bills either! My house is 1558 square feet, my electric rates are much higher than yours, and my average bill this year has been $69. It was over $100 for only one month this year, July, when it was $127 due to A/C usage during all those stifling hot days over 100 degrees in late June.

I do have natural gas service and even though I do not have a gas stove, I have a gas water heater and the usual gas heat in the winter (that uses more gas than electricity), and a gas dryer. So, maybe that is the difference. My natural gas bill averages $29 so far this year, with the highest being $65 last January (due to the heating needs).

On the other hand I use all the electricity that I want or need, though I do have a nice big "Energy Star" refrigerator that I bought in 2005 after Katrina ruined my old one. I also have a 3-year-old Goodman HVAC system and I think the newer A/C systems are more energy efficient than older ones. Even though I live alone, I am a homebody who is home almost all the time and I wash enough clothes for three people (not sure why I change clothes so much! Just a nice luxury). My TV is on constantly when I am awake, with the sound off if I am not watching it. I have two computers that are always on, and I haven't shut my Wii off since I bought it a year and a half ago. So theoretically I should be using more electricity.

I do shut off all the lights except one, in whatever room I am in. I don't use my outdoor floodlights and I don't have Christmas lights up.

 

[REWahoo]

I do shut off all the lights except one, in whatever room I am in. I don't use my outdoor floodlights and I don't have Christmas lights up.

Edweena Scrooge? Is that you?

 

[W2R]

Edweena Scrooge? Is that you?

ROFL!!! I have lived 61 years this way so I just can't imagine keeping all the lights in the house on, and providing an extravagant display of Christmas lights as well. And my neighbors keep their floodlights on, so my back yard isn't totally dark.

Edited much later to add: If I had young kids, or grandkids, you'd better believe that there would be Christmas lights! My ex and I did have one string of the big, colorful lights outside around the eaves even in our "churchmouse days" when our daughter was small and we didn't have much money. Our daughter thought those lights were the most wonderful, awe-inspiring display in the world when she was a tiny tot. But these days there are no kids at my house, and none of my immediate neighbors have them either.

There is some social pressure from the neighbors, who seem to compete to see who can have the more extravagant display each year. They probably think I adhere to some unusual faith that doesn't allow Christmas lights.

 

[FUEGO]

The reason rates go up is utilities need to produce (or buy) more electricity. If yours is the common conclusion in your area, you are more likely to see rate increases.
If everyone (or enough people) do the painfully simple things now, they will not have to pay later. No luck involved.

I wish it was painfully simple to make my house much more energy efficient. I guess I've done all the simple things: CFL's, change furnace filter regularly, turn off lights/appliances when not in use, keep doors closed when the heat/ac is on, etc.

The expensive fixes are new windows, new very high efficiency HVAC.

My individual decisions will continue to be made based on what is most economically efficient in my individual situation. I assume most other customers of my utility companies will act in a similarly rational manner, the current popularity of "green" everything notwithstanding.

 

[W2R]

The expensive fixes are new windows, new very high efficiency HVAC.

Someday your HVAC will crater, though, like they all do eventually. When that happens, you will be very pleased with the new one. I am not sure but I think that probably most new HVAC units are amazingly efficient compared with prior versions.

As for windows, I think I would want new windows when I move north, more to avoid having freezing cold drafts in the house rather than just for overall energy efficiency. In other words, even if the house is nice and toasty warm, who wants a cold draft blowing in on your neck?

 

[JOHNNIE36]

We must really be screwed up when it comes to being energy efficient. We keep the stat set at 79 degrees in the summer but don't let the house get below 72 in the winter. We have CFL's in every light fixture and tinted all the windows to reflect the sunlight. On the other hand, we have seven TV's and four cable boxes (which are on all the time) and a new six-phone system in our house in addition to one land line. Other energy gobblers may be the two fridges and one freezer and a waterfall with lights in the back yard. Also, we are bad for not turning out lights and the TV when leaving the room but we can downplay that because the lights are at least CFL's. So, I cannot complain about the electric bill when it shows up.

 

[W2R]

We must really be screwed up when it comes to being energy efficient. We keep the stat set at 79 degrees in the summer but don't let the house get below 72 in the winter. We have CFL's in every light fixture and tinted all the windows to reflect the sunlight. On the other hand, we have seven TV's and four cable boxes (which are on all the time) and a new six-phone system in our house in addition to one land line. Other energy gobblers may be the two fridges and one freezer and a waterfall with lights in the back yard. Also, we are bad for not turning out lights and the TV when leaving the room but we can downplay that because the lights are at least CFL's. So, I cannot complain about the electric bill when it shows up.

Sounds pretty good to me. I don't know what the problem could be, unless your refrigerators and freezers are really old and from your description of your lifestyle, I doubt they are. I am as mystified as you are and wish we could figure this out.

Right now is a typical night for me. I have one recessed canister light on over my chair, and (just for fun) I also have a nearby Tiffany style lamp turned on with a 40 W bulb. These are incandescents and I don't even own a CFL. My plasma TV is on, my Wii is on, my two computers are on, and my thermostat is set for 77 (higher than usual in the winter - - usually 75, but I'm cold). I have no window tinting and I have 12 feet wide of poorly insulated French doors with no curtains leading out into the back yard, that are about 15 feet from where I am sitting. It is 46 out there (brrr).

I must have some really great Karma! I do think it has something to do with lifestyle because my moderately low electrical usage has followed me from house to house, even when I was married and had a husband and kid at home.

 

[FUEGO]

Someday your HVAC will crater, though, like they all do eventually. When that happens, you will be very pleased with the new one. I am not sure but I think that probably most new HVAC units are amazingly efficient compared with prior versions.

As for windows, I think I would want new windows when I move north, more to avoid having freezing cold drafts in the house rather than just for overall energy efficiency. In other words, even if the house is nice and toasty warm, who wants a cold draft blowing in on your neck?

When we replaced the old unit 6 years ago upon buying the house, there was a noticeable decrease in energy consumption because the old unit was rusted, previously flooded and only rated at 80% efficient I think.

Our HVAC is fairly efficient - 10 or 12 SEER on ac and 92% on the furnace. And I keep a close eye on electricity and gas consumption year to year, and neither are dropping off in efficiency yet. The higher efficiency units just don't pencil out right now. Maybe when these 6 year old units finally die, tax credits, rebates etc plus energy savings may make 14-15 SEER ac's worth it. We spend $1200 a year on heating and cooling, however that will likely drop below $1000 this year with the decreasing energy rates (mostly nat gas).

We don't really have breezes blowing through the house, so I guess our 37 year old windows are ok. New windows would probably cost thousands, and result in a modest energy savings that would not justify the expense of upgrading the windows.

 

[Urchina]

I'd love some of those $45 monthly bills y'all are getting.

Live in a 980 sq. ft. all-electric house, with 4 people and lots of energy-efficiency upgrades (and no AC) and you can!

 

[Zathras]

Johnnie, check that waterfall, it may be a big part of the culprit. We had one that pumped water up about 3 feet, although I am not sure of the gallons per minute, it wasn't a lot.
That thing drew 300Kwh per month! It was a quarter of our summer power use.
Shut that thing off real quick and things got much better.
The setting for the thermostat at 72 in the winter is probably another energy guzzler, especially if you have an older HVAC unit.
I have heard that you will save 3% for every degree you turn down your thermostat in the winter. So a setting of 68 will save you about 12%.
Ok, scratch that part about the thermostat, I see you are in Florida, 72 should not put your HVAC through too much work

 

[ERD50]

I haven't been on the portal in quite some time but just returning, this thread peaked my interest. I can't get over some of the monthly bills y'all are talking about. Ref my own: For a 2025 sq ft house in west central Florida, and I'm on the "equal monthly payment plan", my levelized bill is $211/mo for the year.

I can't get over your monthly bills either!

..... I do have a nice big "Energy Star" refrigerator that I bought in 2005 after Katrina ruined my old one.
.

I assume JOHNNIE is on electric heat though? And electric Dryer? That right there would make comparing to W2R with gas heat and gas dryer apples-oranges. Gas heat is much cheaper than electric (not too bad with a good heat pump model though). If you add in W2Rs gas bill, and adjust for the expected differences in fuel costs, I bet the delta would not look so great after factoring in some lifestyle differences.

If JOHNNIE is serious about reducing the bill, I'd suggest two things - get off the fixed monthly bills so you actually see the differences month-to-month and invest ~$24 in a Kill-a-watt meter. Between that meter and reading name plates on things that are tough to plug/unplug or are on 220, you should be able to find where the energy goes.

I doubt that fridge/freezers are a big hitter. My Freezer is ~ 22 YO and it uses ~ $6/month. Refridge is 17 YO, only uses about $10/month. And our utility will pay you to upgrade to a new fridge/freezer - doesn't make sense to me. I don't plan to upgrade until we redo the kitchen. From reading the energy star labels, the new ones are supposed to use almost half the energy - $50/year would be a long payback, doesn't seem worth it to replace a functional unit.

One thing I learned with my Kill-a-watt meter - I keep my printer ON all the time. The standby mode draws barely 1/2 watt. For 6 cents a month to keep it on, it isn't worth the wear and tear to turn it on/off. Plus, I was worried that maybe my fridge or freezer had degraded over the years with wear, but these numbers seem to confirm they are probably as efficient today as they were when new.

-ERD50

 

[Culture]

I guess deflation-Inflation varies. My power rate went from .19 to .14 this year in in Houston.

 

[Martha]

Electric for four unit apartment building of about 5000 square feet, where we pay electric for three of the apartments, is 6.88 cents per kwh, totalling 60 to 80 a month. No air conditioners as we are air conditioned by lake superior. Mostly energy star appliances. But, we heat with natural gas and our budget is about $400 a month.

 

[GoodSense]

Costs of Electricity

I am with W2R. Why pay to light rooms you're not even in? I live alone in a townhome, and my electricity bill was $30 last month, for 177 kWh. Substract the $1.14 wind energy surcharge (which I pay voluntarily), the cost is roughly $0.16/kWh.

Knowing how the power supply system works, I really wish they would install smart/timed meters for everyone so we are more aware of how much extra it costs the system (and therefore rate-payers) to use electricity during peak hours. For example, off-peak, wholesale power is often $0.01 - 0.02/kwh, while during peak it is not unusual to see $0.2/kwh in real time. It is because the energy source used during peak is often natural gas or sometimes even fuel gas, and off-peak it is generally nuclear, coal, and wind.

For those that like data, you can monitor the wholesale energy prices at midwestern hubs and nodes in real time (updated every 5 minutes) at:
http://www.midwestiso.org/page/Market Info

Then click on "Contour Map & Data" on the left.

I am sure other grids have data, too, but I'm only familiar with the midwest.

These prices are per MWh for GENERATION ONLY. Just divide it by 1,000 and you get the KWh price.

And don't forget to then add the distribution costs charged by your utility and taxes, which in my case are about $.10/KWh.

 

[farmerEd]

I'd also love to lower my electric bill, which runs around $250 a month. I can conserve all I want, but with 6 people in the family, I'd spend all day running around shutting lights out (instead of the half day I already do). Two computers on most of the day, just one TV / satellite combo, but that is just in the evening. I have replaced almost all the lights to CFL's, but the 2 refrigerators plus freezer and the electric hot water tank are killing me. I could probably get by with one fridge, but the freezer is pretty much a required appliance given the distance to the store.

On the positive side, I have reduced my oil consumption by 2000 gallons per year (to zero), with the install of a wood boiler...and soon the hot water will also come off of that boiler -it'll be interesting to see how much that cuts the electric use.

 

[FUEGO]

Just got a notice in the monthly elec bill. Rates are dropping roughly 0.1 cents due to reductions in fuel costs and lower than expected costs to implement an energy efficiency rebate program. However the almost 100% increase in a mandatory Renewable Energy surcharge offsets most of the rate decrease. So I'm paying for renewable energy whether I care to or not. I guess that is how they pay $0.20 per kWh to "green" producers when the market rates are $0.08 and net meterers receive only $0.04. Little dribs and drabs on every customer's bill to pay for green energy. Can ya feel the green love?

 

[ERD50]

I'd also love to lower my electric bill, which runs around $250 a month. I can conserve all I want, but with 6 people in the family, .... and the electric hot water tank are killing me. ...


On the positive side, I have reduced my oil consumption by 2000 gallons per year (to zero), with the install of a wood boiler...and soon the hot water will also come off of that boiler -it'll be interesting to see how much that cuts the electric use.

I'm sure the electric water heater for 6 is a big part of it. Putting that on the wood heat should make a big difference.

One of those Kill-a-watt meters will tell you if your cooling units are running at good efficiency. Down to < $21 at amazon right now...

Amazon.com: P3 International P4400 Kill A Watt Electricity Usage Monitor: Electronics

-ERD50

 

[JOHNNIE36]

ERD50, thanks for the input and yes my water heater is electric. Everything down here in the Tampa area is electric. There is little to no natural gas. If you want gas you have to go to propane. I'm sure my waterfall eats up some power as usage was down this summer when the water shortage in the area required me to shut off the water fall due to evaporation. No water "features" in the county were allowed unless you had fish involved (like fountains in lakes). I'm going to reduce my consumption this winter by toughing it out on the cold mornings and keep that A/C unit off. Wish we had a heat pump instead of my unit utilizing heat srtips. I'm getting rid of our freezer as DW wants to install a laundry tub and we don't have room for it without eliminating the freezer. Two old retired f@#%s don't need a freezer.

 

[Rustic23]

North of Houston with a Co-op for poser. Total power is 0.0938.