Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 06-25-2014, 07:31 AM   #41
Recycles dryer sheets
Backpacker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: On a dirt road
Posts: 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by audreyh1 View Post
+1

In addition to getting emails on every bank transaction above $50, I usually reconcile the transactions with Quicken weekly so anything unusual would stand out.

We also have email notification if any pay to account is added, any user changes, etc.

This is terrible for your friend, but incredible that he didn't notice the activity for so long.

Not having online access probably worked against him in this case. Someone else would have not as easily been able to set up online access if it were already set up. Plus he could have been getting notifications.

All the above++

I get e-mails if a bill is scheduled to pay and if a "vendor" is added. One other side note - the 60 days should be the most recent 60 days not the first 60 days. If it started small and last 60 was much higher amounts, this may be a small blessing. Seems like the police should be able to subpeona the receiving financial institutions records and see who is benefitting from this and go after them. Not that they probably have assets to make restitution but maybe they still do public hanging in his state
__________________

__________________
"Up sluggard and waste not the day, in the grave will be sleeping enough." Benjamin Franklin
Backpacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 06-25-2014, 11:30 AM   #42
Dryer sheet wannabe
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
Here's an interesting story. I once observed 2 small deposits into my checking account. While wondering what that was all about, I got a voice message on my phone recorder, asking to know the values of these small random deposits!!!
Years ago that was the verification that Paypal used to verify that you were the owner of an account that was being linked to their system. With that information they could have basically cleaned out your checking account with no real trail to follow. (Instead you were smart and probably made 30 cents on the deal).
__________________

__________________
JLoft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 11:34 AM   #43
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,403
I was fairly upset that they were pulling this trick to snare less knowledgeable people, and did not think of playing with them by calling back and giving them the wrong amounts, keeping them in contact while alerting the police.

As I mentioned, I notified my bank, but they probably did nothing.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 01:00 PM   #44
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLoft View Post
Years ago that was the verification that Paypal used to verify that you were the owner of an account that was being linked to their system. With that information they could have basically cleaned out your checking account with no real trail to follow. (Instead you were smart and probably made 30 cents on the deal).
The online banks like CapOne and HSBC and others still use this technique.
. . . and there would be a trail ... the routing and transit numbers of the receiving bank and the account number of the receiving account, although getting the money back might be problematic.
__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 01:50 PM   #45
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Backpacker View Post
I get e-mails if a bill is scheduled to pay and if a "vendor" is added.
In 2011 I noticed some charges from Amazon on my credit card that were not ours and when I called to inquire and got through to the Amazon fraud department he confirmed that the charges were not from my Amazon account. I was asked if I knew anyone called Louise as this person had created an Amazon account and was using my credit card to pay for her purchases. I replied in the negative and asked how someone could create an Amazon account and use a credit card from someone else. The fraud guy told me that it happens all the time, parents with children, friends with friends. I then asked why I wasn't at least informed by email that my credit card was being used on some person's account. (my name on the credit card matches the name of my Amazon account).

Hopefully they were able to catch the perp.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 01:58 PM   #46
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,403
We have had fraudulent charges made on our AmEx cards 3 times. One was right after my wife came back from a trip to Argentina. The 2nd time was when someone made 1 small charge for an Internet transaction with iTunes and another one with a dating Internet site. The 3rd time was for a hotel charge in Mexico, and that happened right after my wife used the card to pay for our Mexican time share annual fee.

In all 3 cases, AmEx noticed the fraudulent activity right away, and called us before we even noticed it, even though we looked at our accounts online every 2 or 3 days.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 04:18 PM   #47
Moderator
Walt34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Eastern WV Panhandle
Posts: 16,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan View Post
Hopefully they were able to catch the perp.
Catching him and actually doing something about it are two different things, and since Amazon is a business that is a business decision and not a legal or moral one.

What I mean is that to prosecute this type of case Amazon (or the bank that issued the cc and sustained the financial loss) has to send a warm body representing that business to the jurisdiction where the transactions occurred. That means someone on the payroll has to physically go there so the business is looking a air fare, car rental, per diem, hotels, and the like. That gets real expensive real fast and will probably add nothing to the bottom line profit of the business.

This may make sense if the transactions were large and the suspect has the assets to make restitution. Upsetting as it is to a lot of people this is why prosecution of this type of crime is the exception and not the rule.
__________________
I heard the call to do nothing. So I answered it.
Walt34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 06:53 PM   #48
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt34 View Post
Catching him and actually doing something about it are two different things, and since Amazon is a business that is a business decision and not a legal or moral one.

What I mean is that to prosecute this type of case Amazon (or the bank that issued the cc and sustained the financial loss) has to send a warm body representing that business to the jurisdiction where the transactions occurred. That means someone on the payroll has to physically go there so the business is looking a air fare, car rental, per diem, hotels, and the like. That gets real expensive real fast and will probably add nothing to the bottom line profit of the business.

This may make sense if the transactions were large and the suspect has the assets to make restitution. Upsetting as it is to a lot of people this is why prosecution of this type of crime is the exception and not the rule.

Thanks Walt, that is what I would expect. What bugs me is that Amazon allow any Tom or Dick to create an account and use Harry's credit card to buy stuff, without seeking Harry's permission.

Last year when thieves cloned my card and charged $22k over a couple of days I initially dealt with someone in the Penfed fraud department who reversed all the charges, as happened the previous 2 other times fraudulent charges appeared. After the initial contact and reversal of charges I was handed over to someone else and I got the impression that they were actually going to do some investigation. No idea of course, but I would like to think so.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:20 PM   #49
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Mulligan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 7,376
Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger View Post
I'm not as kind and forgiving as you. On something like this I'm probably more old testament. Stealing gets a hand removed. It only takes a couple of times before they would require voice recognition to continue and there is a solution for that too.

Cheers!

If you ever run for office, Badger you got my vote! If I was caught at a weak moment though, I could be persuaded just to dump them all on a lawless island and let them do to each other what they want to.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
__________________
Mulligan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 07:30 PM   #50
Moderator
Ronstar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: A little ways southwest of Chicago
Posts: 9,345
About 10 years ago at work, our bookkeeper noticed an error in our checking acct ledger vs the bank statement. I think it was a $100k difference. Someone had requested a $100k bank transfer overseas. The request was on our corporate fax form with the boss's signature and directed to our corporate banker at our bank. Very scary. Luckily our bookkeeper caught it before the funds were 100% transferred. I can't remember what the deal would have been if she hadn't.
__________________
Ronstar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 08:36 PM   #51
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
pb4uski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Vermont & Sarasota, FL
Posts: 16,424
Quote:
Originally Posted by kramer View Post
Regarding casualty loss, my understanding is that you can only deduct the portion above 10% of your MAGI. So he may not even be able to deduct any, or perhaps just a small amount. OK gotta get on my flight now . .
And as I read your OP his unreimbursed loss will probably be ~$30k (85% of $35k). So if your friend's AGI is $300k then he is out of luck, but if his AGI is $200k he'll get a $10k deduction. Better than nothing.
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.
pb4uski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2014, 09:34 AM   #52
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Rustward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,572
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan View Post
Thanks Walt, that is what I would expect. What bugs me is that Amazon allow any Tom or Dick to create an account and use Harry's credit card to buy stuff, without seeking Harry's permission.
When one creates an account at Amazon, does Amazon verify that Tom is Tom, and Dick is Dick? I don't know how they could. They do verify the email address, but one can create any email address they wish.

When I look back at my own card usage, in person or online, a very large majority of the time that I have used a card, I never had to show any proof that I am indeed the card holder.

It does seem that some retailers do require that the ship to name matches the name on the card, but how hard is that to fake. If I order from Amazon using John Q Public's card and have the order shipped to John Q Public at Rusty's address, who is going to catch that?
__________________
Rustward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2014, 06:42 PM   #53
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustward View Post
When one creates an account at Amazon, does Amazon verify that Tom is Tom, and Dick is Dick? I don't know how they could. They do verify the email address, but one can create any email address they wish.

When I look back at my own card usage, in person or online, a very large majority of the time that I have used a card, I never had to show any proof that I am indeed the card holder.

It does seem that some retailers do require that the ship to name matches the name on the card, but how hard is that to fake. If I order from Amazon using John Q Public's card and have the order shipped to John Q Public at Rusty's address, who is going to catch that?
Amazon certainly allows you to set up multiple shipping addresses that are not your billing address. What they obviously don't do is check that the card you enter has a billing address that matches the card. Even gas stations around here ask you to enter the zipcode for the card you are using.

Since that event happened I now scratch off the 3 digit identification code on the back of my card which is what on-line retailers use to verify that you are in physical possession of the card. That way if someone takes my card away for a payment and copies the details then they won't be able to copy those 3 digits. Even when a card is skimmed the 3-digit is not copied and has to be copied manually.

I wish all on-line retailers would sign up to the "Verified by VISA" system and use the password you set up one time for your card. (Many retailers in the UK do this)

Quote:
Skimming is the theft of credit card information used in an otherwise legitimate transaction. The thief can procure a victim's credit card number using basic methods such as photocopying receipts or more advanced methods such as using a small electronic device (skimmer) to swipe and store hundreds of victims’ credit card numbers. Common scenarios for skimming are restaurants or bars where the skimmer has possession of the victim's credit card out of their immediate view.[9] The thief may also use a small keypad to unobtrusively transcribe the 3 or 4 digit Card Security Code, which is not present on the magnetic strip.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2014, 07:08 PM   #54
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,152
Quote:
Originally Posted by pb4uski View Post
And as I read your OP his unreimbursed loss will probably be ~$30k (85% of $35k). So if your friend's AGI is $300k then he is out of luck, but if his AGI is $200k he'll get a $10k deduction. Better than nothing.
Yes, that about sums it up.
__________________
kramer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 12:19 AM   #55
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustward View Post
....
It does seem that some retailers do require that the ship to name matches the name on the card, but how hard is that to fake. If I order from Amazon using John Q Public's card and have the order shipped to John Q Public at Rusty's address, who is going to catch that?
Few months back, got DH a GoPro as a gift and had it shipped to my Sister's address to keep it a surprise. GoPro called to confirm I was really the one who ordered it. So good for them.
__________________
Sarpy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 06:39 AM   #56
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
2B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 4,330
About a year ago I had a flurry of fraudulent credit card charges on two different cards. I have carried three different credit card accounts for years. One is absolutely isolated from physical use. It is only for on line charges. The other two are used based on whatever points I'm trying to maximize. There was a bad charge on one of these accounts for a small dollar amount in Italy. Chase called an sent me a new card and cancelled the old account. My other card had a bad charge and I had to call Chase again and they sent a new card for the new account. Within a month of getting the first replacement card, another bad charge showed up! I hadn't even made the first payment yet. I have no idea how the accounts were being identified. I had only used the card a few times.

I typically check my accounts several times per week except when traveling. I won't access my accounts without a secure internet connection. I don't consider a hotel wifi to be secure. So far, I've avoided getting a security token just to avoid the hassle of dealing with this when not traveling. At least I've got 60 days to report a problem and I don't travel that long.
__________________
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane -- Marcus Aurelius
2B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 07:15 AM   #57
Full time employment: Posting here.
Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 825
Both of our credit cards post to our email when ever a charge is made so we can keep track of the charges. They are never used when we travel. I have a separate bank account with a debit card for that. It is only used during that time and the bank is notified of the travel dates. Money is put into the account just prior to the trip and is removed (except for a minimal amount to keep the account open) when we return.

We have also notified all three credit agencies to freeze the ability to open any credit accounts or cards. Since we have no need for buying on credit there is no need for us to establish further accounts.

I don't know of anything else that can be done to safeguard ourselves from someone accessing our money or ID. If there is anything else I would like to know about it.

Cheers!
__________________
Badger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 07:46 AM   #58
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulligan View Post
..........I could be persuaded just to dump them all on a lawless island and let them do to each other what they want to ............
I think that Australia is already taken.
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 04:47 PM   #59
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Mulligan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 7,376
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelover View Post
I think that Australia is already taken.

Ya, that was it's history wasn't it if I am not mistaken. There are some empty islands between Puerto Rico and USVI. They better learn how to fish fast though based on my overhead view of them.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
__________________
Mulligan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2014, 09:49 AM   #60
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 920
I check mint (almost) every day, it takes 2 minutes to view the recent transactions across all accounts.
__________________

__________________
tuixiu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tips for getting back a stolen car? travelover Other topics 28 09-04-2008 02:48 PM
New mortgage question- money merge acct? Bimmerbill Young Dreamers 7 01-18-2008 04:55 PM
Stolen from TMF brewer12345 Other topics 3 08-16-2006 05:54 PM
Credit card number stolen bpp FIRE and Money 22 07-13-2006 09:32 PM
Fidelity's stolen laptop & customer service Nords Other topics 7 03-25-2006 01:53 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:26 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.