More Money Than You'll Ever Need

[Sojourner]

All I need to do is to check out the price of a business-class ticket to Sydney, let alone first class, to remind myself that I am not that rich.

That's basically how I feel, even though I am pretty confident I have more than enough money to cover any and all reasonable needs and wants for the rest of my life.

I was curious, so I just checked the cost of round-trip business class ticket to Rome from my neck of the woods here in metro Atlanta, and I found some—at around $2,400—that I could pretty easily afford. As long as I don't discover the "need" to take more than one or two such flights per year, I should be A-OK. That's actually a pretty encouraging realization!

 

[Bamaman]

We're all on our knees to two things. Inflation could rise its ugly head again and take away purchasing power. And none of us know how long we're going to have on this earth.

I think we're fine financially in the short and long run--pending any great changes.
However, my wife and I still live frugally because that's the way we were raised. We continue to take our one or two international trips per year, but otherwise pinch pennies.

Our children have been offered more than most. Some are well educated and productive members of society and some are not. But we're past saving and living conservatively so they can spend our money. If there's money left over, that's fine. But we're now living for ourselves and enjoying it.

 

[Another Reader]

At my age, I am increasingly concerned about leaving so much that the IRS gets a large piece via the estate tax. I'm working on disposing of the less productive real estate in a tax efficient manner and increasing the cash flow to spend more, as the LBYM squirrel it all away habit is very difficult to break. Also setting up a plan to have most of the estate, especially anything over the estate tax limit, go to worthy charities (few and far between).

Even if we hit eight figures, I don't think I will get over the fear of "not enough" because of "what if..." More income off unleveraged assets may help to assuage that fear. Debt payoff is also on the agenda, despite favorable leverage.

 

[candrew]

Not sure I'd agree with either of those. Too rich and you'd need handlers/bodyguards/ and a somewhat isolation lifestyle (but maybe that's not too bad ), etc. Too thin (anorexia) is really not good.

In light of the obesity & savings rates in America, that quote may indeed have relevance!

 

[Chuckanut]

+1. I am in the process of disbursing my RMD's among our 4 children (Her two and my two). They need the money now not in 20 (God willing) years

Very wise! Give it to the children and any other worthwhile causes one selects while one can enjoy giving it away and helping others.

 

[kcowan]

Back in 2002, I was nervous because our portfolio had become marginal owing to the tech meltdown. I actively managed the portfolio with great success for 5 years then we bought a snowbird place for 6 months and switched to mostly dividend payers by selling all my risky growth stocks to buy the snowbird place.

Then we were hit with the meltdown! We held on and survived. Plus we reduced our SWR by 60% (but back filled with an annual trip to Europe) by living in Mexico for 6 months. Now 10 years later, we are looking at ways to reduce stash. It will not be with boats and cars! Been there, did that!

Right now we have increased our FI position, mostly by not reinvesting divies and interest. We are patiently waiting for the sale!

 

[fritz]

A recent popular thread about having more money in retirement than before retiring got me to thinking.

Are there any who visit this forum beyond ever having any money troubles, in fact, have way more than enough to last way beyond your lifetime?

If so, how do you look at money? It's there, you know it's there and you just go on living your life?

Something I see here, many retirees realize their money keeps growing with a low withdrawal rate and they believe they need to spend more.

I would guess it becomes a matter of financial maturity to realize that you have so much money and you're just are going to die with a high net worth.

I believe you hit the nail on the head for us. We're in our 8th year of retirement (retired 58/57), but unfortunately have no pensions and rely on SS (at 62) and our investments for retirement income.

We've always had a LBYMs lifestyle which has allowed us to save a considerable amount of funds, but it wasn't a steady diet of hotdogs and beans to get there. We live a comfortable life (before and after retiring early).

We don't feel like we need to ramp up the spending due to a nice growth in our investments and an extremely low withdrawal rate. We buy/do what we want (still suffering from our LBYMs lifestyle), and hope to have a high net worth left to leave to our children.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I think it is highly unlikely we would ever run out of money. If we downsized we could live off the rent from our current house alone or less than pensions + SS, not including investment income. Or if I worked half time I could probably cover all our expenses.

But I like the math challenge and bargain hunting part of saving money, reducing expenses and increasing easy side income. There's a lot of homeless people where we live so I'm okay with still saving money and leaving what we don't need for LTC to our adult kids and charities that help the less fortunate. I don't do any volunteer work right now so I figure leaving money to charity will be my way of giving back to our community.

 

[dunkelblau]

I should be set if my so-far stable spendrate doesn't rise by a lot and if nothing major goes missing. So I'd rephrase that as "more than I'm likely to ever spend" because some kind of financial disaster is always a possibility.

Maybe its meaning has taken on a darker shade over the years? Decades ago I saw it as an exciting opportunity to gain but lately it's more of a headache of a responsibility to preserve. Yeah backwards from the proper attitude of responsibility to accumulate first and opportunity to enjoy later. So different kind of worries I suppose.

I have no qualms about a growing stash and checking out at my peak. To me spending and income have never been coupled, I've spent according to what I thought I needed and I earn as much as I think I can get. Maybe that's why my OMY has stretched out so long, as long as a paycheck is low hanging fruit, I'll probably keep taking it. My spending has been gated by what may be a utility curve with a lower ceiling than the norm. IOW to me this isn't about accumulation for future enjoyment, it's been my way of life. Just thankful my upbringing left me on the right side of Micawber's rule.

 

[Fedup]

That's basically how I feel, even though I am pretty confident I have more than enough money to cover any and all reasonable needs and wants for the rest of my life.

I was curious, so I just checked the cost of round-trip business class ticket to Rome from my neck of the woods here in metro Atlanta, and I found some—at around $2,400—that I could pretty easily afford. As long as I don't discover the "need" to take more than one or two such flights per year, I should be A-OK. That's actually a pretty encouraging realization!

I just checked, from LAX to London business class on Virgin is about $8,000 on British Airways is $11,000. I need two tickets so it's about $22,000.

 

[W2R]

Are there any who visit this forum beyond ever having any money troubles, in fact, have way more than enough to last way beyond your lifetime?

If so, how do you look at money? It's there, you know it's there and you just go on living your life?

I'm not sure if I fit into this category or not. If my expenses are never more than they have been in recent years, then sure, I guess I have more than I will need.

But who can say what future health care, assisted living, or nursing home costs may be in 20-30 years?

Who knows if I will end up with cancer or something and incur a lot of uncovered medical expenses?

Who knows if "Katrina II" will hit New Orleans in a few weeks and wipe out my dream house and everything in it, and Frank's house next door as well? Insurance only goes so far.

What if we have double digit inflation? War? Famine? Epidemics? Meteors? Political/economic collapse or social unrest?

It's nice to have some extra just in case the unexpected becomes reality some day. My relatives are mostly dead and I have the full responsibility of independently taking care of myself no matter what the future may bring.

That said, I have made an effort to spend more since I know that I can't take it with me after I die. However, due to stock market conditions, I find that the percentage of my portfolio needed is still less than it was, even though I spend more now.

I have had worse problems, that's for sure.

 

[googily]

I have way more money than I will probably ever spend, as well as two (non-COLA) pensions, and eventually SS.

Unfortunately it's because the nest egg that was built for two people retiring at 55/50 is now a nest egg for one 50-year-old. With no direct heirs. And the hobbies and pursuits that we spent so much money on (foodie-ism, travel) aren't things that are as interesting to do alone (yet, anyway).

But it means I'm not going to worry a whole lot about LTC insurance, and that if I ever do go to Australia, it would probably be in first class, as mentioned up-thread.

 

[Fedup]

It's hard to know the future. That's why I prefer not to be overly confident because I can't predict the future.

 

[Sojourner]

I just checked, from LAX to London business class on Virgin is about $8,000 on British Airways is $11,000. I need two tickets so it's about $22,000.

Hmm... seems like you are citing the most expensive options. A quick check of Google Flights shows numerous nonstop LAX to London business class flights available for a wide range of dates and numerous carriers for $4,500 or less. I found some flights/dates for around $2,600 if you're willing to deal with two stops. I suppose if it has to be Virgin or BA, nonstop, and within the next couple weeks, you could end up paying $8K or more. To avoid these ultra high fares, I never limit myself to just a select few airlines, and I always plan international travel many months in advance.

 

[travelover]

For me, it all depends on the spend rate at the end. At current spend rates, we have more than enough. If we both end up in an expensive Alzheimer's care unit for a decade, it will all be gone.

 

[Fedup]

Hmm... seems like you are citing the most expensive options. A quick check of Google Flights shows numerous nonstop LAX to London business class flights available for a wide range of dates and numerous carriers for $4,500 or less. I found some flights/dates for around $2,600 if you're willing to deal with two stops. I suppose if it has to be Virgin or BA, nonstop, and within the next couple weeks, you could end up paying $8K or more. To avoid these ultra high fares, I never limit myself to just a select few airlines, and I always plan international travel many months in advance.

Because that's how I fly. My husband only wants non stop. I only fly BA or Virgin or maybe Air New Zealand. Why should I pick the cheapest option to prove a point.

 

[Sojourner]

Because that's how I fly. My husband only wants non stop. I only fly BA or Virgin or maybe Air New Zealand. Why should I pick the cheapest option to prove a point.

You shouldn't. You should do exactly what you want with your money, and I suspect you will regardless of what I post here. All I was trying to point out is that there are numerous nonstop biz-class flights that are far less expensive than what you cited originally. And I was pleasantly surprised to discover that, since I had been under the mistaken impression that most international business class fares were outrageously pricey.

 

[aja8888]

It's hard to know the future. That's why I prefer not to be overly confident because I can't predict the future.

Throw in those unknown unknowns are you really can't be sure about anything.

 

[Elbata]

Thank you all for posting.

Two of my takeaways are that the excess monies, if spent, will be on luxuries, not necessities. The other on how to give money away.

When I look at these comments, and the comments of Bill Gates and Warren Buffett, money is looked at how it can do the most good. We want to make the world a better place. Not to get political, that's why I thought those protests about the evil 1%ers was misguided. Most people hearts are set on doing good.

Lastly, it just blows my mind that for the rest of my life I basically have the world at my disposal. Restaurants, hotels, airplanes, whatever, the world is there ready for me to spend money. And honestly, one doesn't have to be rich to live this lifestyle.

 

[pj.mask]

I thought this link was interesting. It talks about all the 'early retirement is easy' blogs and notes they have mostly appeared in this bull market.

https://ournextlife.com/2017/05/10/conservative-projections/

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Throw in those unknown unknowns are you really can't be sure about anything.

With medical advances, I'm planning in case we live another 50 years. A lot can happen in 50 years. A lot has happened in 5 years for us - especially with health care costs. We've had crazy high and crazy low years after the ACA went into effect compared to our initial budget. I'm glad we had a fair bit of buffer to help in the crazy high years. We would have probably moved abroad if the ACA had not come along.

 

[audreyh1]

"You can never be too rich or too thin".

Wallis Simpson - The Duchess of Windsor

Too rich - probably not.

Too thin - you can definitely be too thin!!! Lots of health problems can result from being too thin, conversely, if you are really really thin it may be because you are in the advanced stage of a fatal disease.

 

[audreyh1]

That's basically how I feel, even though I am pretty confident I have more than enough money to cover any and all reasonable needs and wants for the rest of my life.

I was curious, so I just checked the cost of round-trip business class ticket to Rome from my neck of the woods here in metro Atlanta, and I found some—at around $2,400—that I could pretty easily afford. As long as I don't discover the "need" to take more than one or two such flights per year, I should be A-OK. That's actually a pretty encouraging realization!

Yeah - $2400pp is not bad. I'd be more willing if for two of us it would be less than $5K to fly to Europe business class, compared to $2500 for economy. But usually it's $4K per person business class ($8K total), and that extra $5500 - well, that would go so far to spend it on other things!

 

[pj.mask]

Too rich - probably not.



Too thin - you can definitely be too thin!!! Lots of health problems can result from being too thin, conversely, if you are really really thin it may be because you are in the advanced stage of a fatal disease.

I don't get why people seize on this comment. I think it is 99% true - most people are overweight, some significantly, and the perception of what is 'thin' is now actually someone who is normal weight or slightly heavy (based on my observation in Texas). There is no harm from being skinny but There is obviously a difference between skinny and malnourished.

I know I regularly get told I am "too skinny" even though I am firmly in the middle of a healthy BMI/body fat %.

 

[Badger]

I've been retired for about 4 years now (wife for 5). Lived an exciting although frugal life so far with lots of travel and experiences on modest incomes. It's hard to break our frugal life style but we still travel and have a full life. She plays tennis almost everyday and I work on my pottery/ceramics while volunteering with jobs at animal rescue, broadcasting at the local PBS station and the zoo.

So far we cover our expenses with SS and a couple of small pensions and have not yet dipped into our investments so they continue to grow. Fortunately we planned well, the house was paid off years ago, and medical is taken care of. If needed and the SS etc goes away our investments would last us at least 40 more years. I think the bucket will have been kicked before then.

Cheers!