New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
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greg
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Then pull the front of your underpants up as high as you can and open the fly so that you can see the results exactly right.
--Greg
justin said:
Then pull the front of your underpants up as high as you can and open the fly so that you can see the results exactly right.
--Greg
retire@40
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
No, you would not ONLY count your dividend-paying stocks. You would count ALL the stocks you plan on using in the future, whether by dividend-generating OR by selling them.
And no, you would not ONLY count real estate you are renting. You would count ALL real estate that you plan on using in the future, whether by renting it OR by selling it.
If you buy an asset that will not generate income in the future, like a pencil that you plan on sharpening to it's useful end, it is an asset that should show on your personal balance sheet, but it is NOT an investment that would qualify as part of your portfolio to be used for retirement because it will never generate any income for you.
Similarly, if you plan on living in your home until you die without selling or renting it, it should be part of your balance sheet, but it should not be part of your portfolio from which you will be applying your 4% SWR.
Jay_Gatsby said:
No, you would not ONLY count your dividend-paying stocks. You would count ALL the stocks you plan on using in the future, whether by dividend-generating OR by selling them.
And no, you would not ONLY count real estate you are renting. You would count ALL real estate that you plan on using in the future, whether by renting it OR by selling it.
If you buy an asset that will not generate income in the future, like a pencil that you plan on sharpening to it's useful end, it is an asset that should show on your personal balance sheet, but it is NOT an investment that would qualify as part of your portfolio to be used for retirement because it will never generate any income for you.
Similarly, if you plan on living in your home until you die without selling or renting it, it should be part of your balance sheet, but it should not be part of your portfolio from which you will be applying your 4% SWR.
SteveR
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Agreed.
Basically anything you own that can be sold for cash, either now or in the future is on the asset side of your new worth equation....the other side any and all debt. Subtract the two and there is your "official" net worth. Income streams are not counted unless they can be converted into a lump sum while you are still alive or while your spouse is still living since we are talking about "shared" net worth here I presume.
I guess if you split hairs, there could be things in your estate that are not part of your net worth. I think that is where you put the pencils, stuffed animals, 20 year old TV sets (yes I have one) and other non-income producing items. However, if your business is selling these items as part of your business inventory then I guess they would be part of your business net worth?
I will let you experts go at this one.
retire@40 said:
Agreed.
Basically anything you own that can be sold for cash, either now or in the future is on the asset side of your new worth equation....the other side any and all debt. Subtract the two and there is your "official" net worth. Income streams are not counted unless they can be converted into a lump sum while you are still alive or while your spouse is still living since we are talking about "shared" net worth here I presume.
I guess if you split hairs, there could be things in your estate that are not part of your net worth. I think that is where you put the pencils, stuffed animals, 20 year old TV sets (yes I have one) and other non-income producing items. However, if your business is selling these items as part of your business inventory then I guess they would be part of your business net worth?
I will let you experts go at this one.
riskadverse
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
If your house is worth a million dollars and you spend all your other assets and you're so feeble that your kids put you in a nursing home, do you think your kids are going to sell your house?
house = asset . . . when you're broke you will sell it.
If your house is worth a million dollars and you spend all your other assets and you're so feeble that your kids put you in a nursing home, do you think your kids are going to sell your house?
house = asset . . . when you're broke you will sell it.
retire@40
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Your house is ALWAYS an asset. However, in your case, it doesn't become part of your "investment assets" until you go broke.
riskaverse said:
Your house is ALWAYS an asset. However, in your case, it doesn't become part of your "investment assets" until you go broke.
Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
I'd like to suggest one more survey . . . one that might actually be more relevant than a "net worth" survey. How about a survey comparing "cash flow" in 2005 dollars. I suggest that "retirement cash flow" be computed as follows: (investment net worth) x (fixed percentage (say 7.5% or whatever is reasonable)) + pension payments + social security payments + any other regular income payments = "retirement cash flow". This survey would factor out the house (and other non-income generating assets) in the net worth equation and give a clearer picture of how much income the retirees & retiree-wantabees in this forum have to fund their ER plans and dreams. I'd suggest sticking with the same fixed percentage for everyone for the "investment net worth" component so that we are comparing "apples & apples". Any one interested?
Robert
I'd like to suggest one more survey . . . one that might actually be more relevant than a "net worth" survey. How about a survey comparing "cash flow" in 2005 dollars. I suggest that "retirement cash flow" be computed as follows: (investment net worth) x (fixed percentage (say 7.5% or whatever is reasonable)) + pension payments + social security payments + any other regular income payments = "retirement cash flow". This survey would factor out the house (and other non-income generating assets) in the net worth equation and give a clearer picture of how much income the retirees & retiree-wantabees in this forum have to fund their ER plans and dreams. I'd suggest sticking with the same fixed percentage for everyone for the "investment net worth" component so that we are comparing "apples & apples". Any one interested?
Robert
Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Silly discussion. And we had it 1M times before. Net worth (which is being asked for, nothing else) is for all purposes assets - liabilities. Future income streams (or costs such as health insurance) are not to be involved.
We can then have a seperate discussion of the VALUE of future income streams - and how it certainly is important to FIREes but the OP question was pretty clear.
Cheers!
Silly discussion. And we had it 1M times before. Net worth (which is being asked for, nothing else) is for all purposes assets - liabilities. Future income streams (or costs such as health insurance) are not to be involved.
We can then have a seperate discussion of the VALUE of future income streams - and how it certainly is important to FIREes but the OP question was pretty clear.
Cheers!
dex
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
These are becomming wothless to those thinking about RE.
These are becomming wothless to those thinking about RE.
wabmester
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
I'm happy to see that nobody has complained about the absence of a $10M+ bracket.
I'm happy to see that nobody has complained about the absence of a $10M+ bracket.
Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Scum! Off our board!
....just kidding. I find it reveals a lot more about a person's character when they admit a shortcoming rather than crow of success. I do far too much of the latter.
Barry said:
Scum! Off our board!
....just kidding. I find it reveals a lot more about a person's character when they admit a shortcoming rather than crow of success. I do far too much of the latter.
BUM
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm........ pork bellies....
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm........ pork bellies....
SteveR
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Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Hey that pig looks like some of the chicks at the local country bar or at least that is what I hear
I don't want to cast my vote, maybe in 10 years or so.
Hey that pig looks like some of the chicks at the local country bar or at least that is what I hear
I don't want to cast my vote, maybe in 10 years or so.
HFWR
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
I'm thinking nipple rings......................
I'm thinking nipple rings......................
Re: The New Improved 2005 ER Forum Current Net Worth Survey
Looks much better than the bars on the survey...and now we can either tilt our monitors back or revolve our heads 90 degrees counterclockwise and Greg can lower his underwear.SteveR said:
