"Old White Men?" That's me,I guess

[bUU]

It is easy to say to do things differently, but the very same could have been said about we were in college. So in an apples-to-apples comparison, there is no way to talk around the fact that students are graduating with twice as much debt as twenty years ago, and probably three or four times as much debt as those of us here had, on average.

By the way, part-time jobs aren't the same as when I was in college. I typically had my pick. There were many more opportunities, especially as I got closer to graduation. Now, my niece is competing for such opportunities with people who need those jobs to feed and clothe their children, and perhaps have been doing that job for years, given the dearth of other opportunities, so why should they consider a transient... a college student looking to move onto a real job in a year or two?

My niece is moving in with us in several months, after she finishes her senior year in college, and is looking forward to the few babysitter jobs that my spouse has lined up for her. It's a very scary time to be entering the workforce.

 

[btdt22]

I have a neighbor who will never invest in the stock market. All his 401k money is in a Target fund

I suspect he is not the only one who is confused by stocks versus equities versus mutual funds versus index funds.

 

[eytonxav]

There is a bigger concern here as
1. Tradition pension are nearly extinct in the private sector
2. Firm contributions to retirement accounts have dropped significantly..

Hence if the younger generation is to have any chance at a well funded retirement they will have to save early and save more.


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum

I would add one other concern: career advancement and salaries have stagnated since the great recession, due to lack of jobs and very low inflation, and compared to the opportunities that baby boomers had, its a totally different world today for many college grads.

 

[target2019]

The article in the OP is fluff. A blog writer does this for sensationalism, and clicks.

This pdf - Understanding Human Capital - complements imoldernu's graph. It is for the individual to decide whether a Masters from Duke will pay off or not.

I have a nephew who lives in the land of startups and VC. He has done very well, even with college debt. It's not something I strove for, but he provides very well for his family.

https://corporate.morningstar.com/u...ManagerUnderstandingHumanCapitalFactSheet.pdf

 

[travelover]

I have a neighbor who will never invest in the stock market. All his 401k money is in a Target fund

I suspect he is not the only one who is confused by stocks versus equities versus mutual funds versus index funds.

I suspect you are right, because depending on the year targeted for retirement, most target funds do contain significant stock holdings.

 

[fishndad42]

A few years ago we had convinced my son, then late 20's that he should open an IRA. Unfortunately when he went to his bank to do so, the financial "advisor" told him not to do so - he should finish paying off college debt (he was already close, so payments were bringing down principal at a good rate), and save for a new car and a new house first.

It was several years later that I learned he felt the banker wouldn't "let him" open an IRA, and didn't seek more advice on where and how to do so. He turned 30 last year and does now have one, but if these kids are being told not to invest, its easy to see how they can be confused.

 

[fishndad42]

I'm not sure I agree 100% ...
A young guy comes into my office an intern... We get to chatting ..he tells me when he gets his well known university degree (think basketball giant) he will owe $200 grand. I thought to myself my god man what have you done to yourself?

My daughters total cost for 4 years at another well known university will be under $100k. (I was able to fund it so no debt.) Had she stayed home and attended the local university (15 minute drive away) the total cost for for years would be roughly $50k.

Had she started at the local community college we could probably knock it down a few thousand. Throw in a part time job... That's how I did it.

My point being college expense and resulting debt is quite a bit about choices. No one needs to spend $65k a year, they choose to.

This may depend on what career the student is most interested in, and the type of company they hope to work for. Our MegaCorp only recruits from a couple dozen universities. All others can apply through the black hole of the careers website and then find an actual job elsewhere. I suspect this is true across a variety of careers, otherwise the whole allure of ivy league schools or the MIT's of the world wouldn't make a difference. Even in Silicon Valley you are much more likely to land a job at an interesting startup if you came from Stanford compared to the community college.

Financially you may have a point. While a $200K degree may land you in a more prestigious company, unless you got a free ride, that additional 100K plus student loan interest may not be overcome in a typical career.

 

[Danmar]

I agree that young people today are probably no worse at investing than we were. Heck, I didn't buy an equity until my late 30's and didn't really start investing until my late 40's. My parents weren't of any help as they certainly didn't understand any of this stuff either. Having said that I think young people have a tougher time getting established in their careers and generating excess cash flow for investing.

My solution for my daughter (aged32) is to help her financially get established, pay for her education, and gift her enough to get started with an investment portfolio. I feel sorry for kids who graduate with significant student debt. I have a very lucky daughter indeed.

 

[mickeyd]

save early and save more.


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum

Sounds exactly like my early plan. It worked well.

 

[bUU]

I have a neighbor who will never invest in the stock market. All his 401k money is in a Target fund

All Target Date Funds I've seen have at least some, and in many cases, quite a bit of, assets in the stock market. For passive investors, Target Date Funds are a relatively safe, often inexpensive, and prudent way to save for retirement.

 

[Amethyst]

"millennial women, defined as those between the ages of 18 and 34, don’t understand investing. More than three-quarters of the women surveyed, 76 percent, found investing confusing.
Millennials in general are not investing in equities, according to Stash. Seventy-nine percent of the survey’s respondents said they are not currently investing in the stock market,"

Meh. I didn't buy my first "equity" until my late 30's; and Mr. A. who is much older than I am, was learning right along with me. We made all sorts of investing mistakes.

Amethyst

 

[Gumby]

Pretty much everything I know in life is only because I screwed it up at least once before.

 

[MichaelB]

Pretty much everything I know in life is only because I screwed it up at least once before.

Pretty good title for a book.

 

[ls99]

In my mid twenties I knew nothing about investing.

When my employer terminated defined benefits program, converted to defined contributions, a nice lady Phd from Marine Biology lab and another from Geochemistry, who had lunch next to me at the long table in the cafeteria mentioned that the offering of TIAA CREF was a good thing and putting money in there would be relatively safe. So I did. They were right. If I ever meet them again I'll offer my thanks.

I learned about investing in college which I started around age 35, in economics, business finance and Federal Taxation courses.

 

[petershk]

Eh
I'm a "gen Xer" and the same stuff was around then.

Most of my friends in the late 90s were either not saving or investing in tech stocks (oops). After the 2000 crash many swore they'd never go in the market again (oops).

None of that is different today.

College IS different. My tuition was around 6K/year (1993-1997). Lived at home. Decent state school.

When I run the numbers today I'd probably NOT go to college and instead try to learn as much as I could from the massive number of online learning (I'm a computer programmer) and then try to build up work on freelance sites and personal projects. I think in tech a degree is not as critical as it used to be compared to proving you can do stuff. Unfortunately I think "degrees" are the "everyone should own a home" idea all over again.

As for financial advice I agree with you guys. I didn't get it from my parents when I went looking for professionals they made what was simple very complex in order to get their cut.

It took me many years to realize it's actually very simple... although the behavioral side takes a lot of effort to get going.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Early Retirement Forum mobile app

 

[rodi]

All Target Date Funds I've seen have at least some, and in many cases, quite a bit of, assets in the stock market. For passive investors, Target Date Funds are a relatively safe, often inexpensive, and prudent way to save for retirement.

That was the point... the person didn't realize they had equities... but they did.

I agree that target date funds are a good solution for lots of folks.

 

[harley]

Pretty much everything I know in life is only because I screwed it up at least once before.

Pretty good title for a book.

See my sig line.

 

[Amethyst]

Some folks are very fixated on "things are worse now" and there is no way to change their minds. I am not even sure what their motivation is for dwelling on it; are they hoping for some form of wealth transfer, to even things out and make things fair?

I do tend to wonder how 1979 can have been such a wonderful year to be a young person entering the work world, given personal experience. I had a straight-A average in college. I couldn't find a job to save my life. All those naughty "older baby boomers" had taken all the good jobs and were busily driving up the house prices. It was all their fault. I ended up taking a secretarial job through an employment agency. (Do those still exist?) The agency took half my earnings for the first 6 months. What an awful time.

Amethyst

 

[bclover]

I'd broaden that to both sexes. I have friends - men and women - who earn their living through their mastery of complex subjects, but can't get through a simple book on investing. I think they just don't want the responsibility & would rather hand that (and a chunk of change) over to a financial advisor.

Financial education is absolutely needed, but it has to go beyond investments. Kids have to learn to have a healthy relationship with money. But then, how would our consumerist society survive?

some truth to that. i'm a Chemist with a few letters behind my name and I hate this "investing" stuff. you are right, on my kindle now I have just about every book recommended here. I'm sorry I find it boring, tedious and haven't finished one.

Now my parents did teach us money management but as they themselves didn't invest in the stock market, it wasn't something they could pass along.

I do have a FA but I don't think I pass along my responsibility. I work with my gal, do my due diligence and never invest in something I don't understand.
I also don't do my taxes (just paid 700 bucks for 2016) don't cut my own lawn, don't shovel or numerous other things I could probably do on my own.

I'm ok with that

 

[Philliefan33]

Our daughters (age 26 and 24) have taxable mutual funds because a few years ago we told them that's what grown-ups do. They also have Roth IRAs because for the past two years we have gifted them a little money specifically for that purpose. They probably don't fully understand the workings of mutual funds and why a Roth IRA is a smart thing to have at this point in their career, but I have confidence they will learn.

I was about their age when I started learning about retirement funds and investing. I got most of my information from older coworkers. It would be tough for my oldest DD to do that since she is a PhD candidate, surrounded by other poor grad students.

 

[bclover]

Philliefan. That's pretty much where my sons are. They have p/t jobs at wawa and UPS. They participate in their respective 401k more because I made them, then any burning desire to worry about retirement
My kids don't seem to be like the kids here that understand and embrace investment at 22. They are weird, they rather have their first apartment
They are pretty good at budgeting and saving for what they want but its a hard sell to get them to worry about what's going to happen when they are 60. Lol, my 22 is at Temple with a girlfriend at Villanova, they are still basking in National championship glow

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Early Retirement Forum mobile app

 

[ChicagoGal]

I will admit I didn't know much in my 20's. I know my dad invested. But I asked for his help when I opened my first 401k. I didn't have good understanding of mutual funds, stocks, bonds... I think it's the age, not the gender, generation, or race.

There is definitely a cultural bias against women learning to invest. I see it with my friends... they let their husbands "manage the money". Or use "wealth managers" because they believe it's too complex. I do my best to show them they're wrong.

In my 20s, I had no concept of investing or planning for retirement. Fortunately, for my ignorant self, I always lived at least within my means, if not below. And I invested at least minimally in the 401k, because even I could figure out that the company match was a good idea

I do think it helped being single, in a way. I knew that no one else was going to be responsible for paying the rent or investing or planning for retirement (or doing the laundry, or mowing the lawn, or killing the spiders). So I had to figure it out for myself. (Except the spiders... still hate those buggers!). Must have done something right, as I'm on track for a somewhat early retirement.

I try to talk to my nieces and nephews (all in their 20s) about investing and planning. I wish someone had gotten me started even earlier. They don't seem to be terribly interested, though. None of them have debt (parents paid fully for college) and two of them have well paying jobs. Ironically, it's probably the 3rd one who is currently working as a nanny that may come out ahead, since she is learning to live on very little. We'll see...

 

[exige]

I feel bad for the millennials, I am one of them but this is not an issue for me at all.

I put myself through school while working full time graduated with my degree and zero debt. I found a career in my degree field 3 months before graduation making about 10% more than I was before not great but entry level since it was a complete career change.

During school and full time work I lost 141lbs of weight, bought a house on a 15 year fixed and got married. I have no debt but the mortgage and we currently put away 29% of our take home.

We are constantly working to improve and put more away ideally hitting ER. however I am building up the emergency fund a bit more we are at 6 months and I would prefer about 8 months.

I have received nothing from my parents and honestly I know for a fact I have more saved and invested than both of them. They do not understand the market,savings or investing.

 

[Gumby]

I feel bad for the millennials, I am one of them but this is not an issue for me at all.

I put myself through school while working full time graduated with my degree and zero debt. I found a career in my degree field 3 months before graduation making about 10% more than I was before not great but entry level since it was a complete career change.

During school and full time work I lost 141lbs of weight, bought a house on a 15 year fixed and got married. I have no debt but the mortgage and we currently put away 29% of our take home.

We are constantly working to improve and put more away ideally hitting ER. however I am building up the emergency fund a bit more we are at 6 months and I would prefer about 8 months.

I have received nothing from my parents and honestly I know for a fact I have more saved and invested than both of them. They do not understand the market,savings or investing.

Welcome to the forum, exige. And very well done! Keep up the good work.

 

[exige]

Thanks! I have been on the forums for a long time just a lurker