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Re: public pension promises
Old 06-15-2005, 02:40 PM   #41
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Re: public pension promises

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Originally Posted by Caroline
What Chris said!

Call me radical (and I'm sure someone will ;-)* but I don't get the United Airlines pension ruling.* I understand that United didn't have the money to fund the pension AND stay in business, but why does staying in business win out over pension obligations?*
Life has a bias toward the future. Same reason we lavish more on our kids than our parents. A profitable airline is good for the econmy, good for its emplyees, good for the country.

Retirees are yesterday's producers.

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Re: public pension promises
Old 06-15-2005, 04:04 PM   #42
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Re: public pension promises

From Martha:

Quote:
Also, if the company ended up being liquidated and assets sold, most often unsecured creditors get little or nothing.* Lenders which finance the business almost always have the company's assets pledged as collateral for the loans.* The collateral is sold and if the lenders are lucky they come out whole.* After all the expenses, there is rarely left anything for unsecured creditors like employees.
Thanks for the education, Martha.* That helps a lot.* It's tough to see hard-working individuals get the shaft after working all their lives, but it doesn't sound like there was anything that could be done to help these poor United pensioners once the feathers hit the fan.

Rather, it sounds like one should focus one's congressperson, etc. on closing the barn door before ALL the horses are out, and save like mad in the meantime in case your savings are all you end up with.

Quote:
General Motors (nyse: GM - news - people ) is $8 billion in the hole, while IBM (nyse: IBM - news - people ) is facing $7 billion. The latter two giants need another 117 years and 47 years, respectively, to meet their obligations, which themselves are moving, and ballooning, targets.
Thanks again,
Caroline

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Re: public pension promises
Old 06-15-2005, 04:12 PM   #43
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Re: public pension promises

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Originally Posted by Spanky
BUM,

May be you should post this to another thread "private sector pension promises" since the government can always raise taxes or print money to pay for their pension obligations.

Spanky
Thought about it Spanky but I figured more people would see it here. That Martha has an audience


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Re: public pension promises
Old 06-15-2005, 09:05 PM   #44
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Re: public pension promises

[qoute]...I'm at the top of my game in a local government public sector job, and I never did and never will approach even the so-called average figure above. ..JonnyM,

My bother-in-law works for the Alameda county DA office as a MIS manager. The salary is: MANAGER, DATA PROCESSING TECHNICAL SERVICES, $6,817.20(min) to $9,106.93(max) per month -- $7961.5 (average) or $49.76 per hour, slightly better than $42.87.

Obviously, this may not a fair number since it is in an expensive area.

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Re: public pension promises
Old 06-16-2005, 01:36 PM   #45
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Re: public pension promises

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanky
JonnyM,

My bother-in-law works for the Alameda county DA office as a MIS manager. The salary is: MANAGER, DATA PROCESSING TECHNICAL SERVICES, $6,817.20(min) to $9,106.93(max) per month -- $7961.5 (average) or $49.76 per hour, slightly better than $42.87.

Obviously, this may not a fair number since it is in an expensive area.

Spanky
Agreed, I would expect a BayArea County to pay more, and he needs it too, to pay for his BayArea Real Estate. Or he lives next door to me and lives much of his life inside a slowly moving auto. On a weekend it's about 1 1/2 hour from my location in the Central Valley, just over the Altamont, but I could never have stood the commute on a workday.

I'd be curious what his private sector friends with the same responsibility make (those that survived the Tech Crash), I'd be suprised it wasn't similar to Grumpy's ratio of about double. :
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