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Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 01:54 PM
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#1
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,855
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Real estate-- calling the top.
It's time once again for my semi-annual prediction that real estate prices just can't possibly get any higher, and this time I really mean it.
We went to an open house last week for 94-1022 Upai Place. It's in a decent neighborhood with a good elementary school and OK higher schools, a bedroom community not too far from town and not too bad for traffic. (But not too great, either.) The area's not too noisy. 3BR 2BA, 1800 sq ft on a 5800 sq ft lot (around here that means "big lot"), a garage instead of a carport, tile roof, central A/C (~$200/month electric bills), cathedral ceilings. Its assessed value is $425K with $1400/year property taxes.
Inside it's like a museum. Both toilets are dated 1978. The water heater, what's left of it, is original (?!?). The kitchen and both baths are original flooring, original Corian, original porcelain, even the original cabinet doors & mirrors (with a two-inch band of corrosion along the bottoms of the mirrors). The stove & fridge are newer but the dishwasher is (*shudder*) original. The rooms have their original light fixtures. The carpet has been updated but not this millennium.
The house needs painting. The siding's fiberboard is crumbling at the bottom edges. Moldings are chipped. Drywall corner beads are exposed & rusting. Paint had been applied directly over some of the receptacle covers. "Drapes" are original and the blinds haven't been cleaned since Reagan left office. Dust and dirt fill the corners. No one had made even the faintest beginnings of an attempt to clean up for the open house, let alone spend time primping for curb appeal. The popcorn ceilings have collected dust along the lines of the roof trusses to give it a brown & white striped look.
No one put any effort into getting the place ready for sale, but they don't have to care. It's listed at $615K. Click on that link quickly because it won't have a second open house!
__________________
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Co-author (with my daughter) of “Raising Your Money-Savvy Family For Next Generation Financial Independence.”
Author of the book written on E-R.org: "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement."
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 02:07 PM
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#2
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,228
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Don't call the top yet. We got out in great shape on several real estate deals this year-land in Florida and two apartment buildings in Arizona. But we still have to sell out two condo developments in Arizona and sell out the condo hotel in Florida. Markets are still looking fine in both places.
__________________
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No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 02:18 PM
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#3
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 768
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
There is no top. Nationally, real estate prices have not fallen since WWII. Locally, over heated areas will fall. Probably next summer with the stock market, so that the politicians can make the economy hum the following 2 years for the elections.
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 02:28 PM
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#4
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 4,391
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
The value is all tied up in the land.
I had dinner about 6 years ago with a real estate apraiser. He told me a good formula for ballparking what the land is worth:* From the asking price subtract the Structure value. You can ballpark the structure value
by taking the square footage of the house multiplied* by $50 (construction costs per square foot) to get an approximate construction cost. Then lower that value by 1 percent for each year the structure is old. So if the house was built in 1978 I calculate that the structure is worth just over $66k (1810*$50*((2005-1978)/100)). (You can pick your own number for construction costs if you like)
Therefore at $615k you are buying a $549k lot with a $66k house structure. Or another way to look at is is 90 percent land (appx) and 10 percent structure. Therefore the quality of the chipped tile and lack of paint on the structure are really not strong factors in determing the final price.
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 02:56 PM
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#5
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,592
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Top? Maybe ... things have certainly leveled off over the last 6 months north of Boston. But there's still lots of time. I figure the bottom will be achieved in about 1/2 the time the run-up took. So this "run" was 1995 - 2005 (and counting) a bottom is at least 5 years away.
__________________
FIRE'd since 2005
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:00 PM
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#6
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Losing my whump
Posts: 22,708
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
I'm with ya. Its nuts. Gander at this beauty I stopped to check out a few weeks ago:
http://tinyurl.com/avvub
Nice newer home, good size, couple of storage buildings out back, an acre most of which is packed dirt. Rest of the neighborhood is 50 year old double-wides, knocker downers, car junkyards and overgrown yards. High tension powerlines a street over. Grain processing plant within view. Bad schools, gang activity in the area, biker bar you could hit with a rock from the front yard.
$620K.
Floored me.
Modified to shorten URL becasue () is a PITA and won't do it himself.
__________________
Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:13 PM
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#7
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,466
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Some of you are in different parts of the country. The SF Bay Area is one of the best places to live but the worst in terms of cost of living. Check out this house in a "regentrified" neighborhood of Daly City:
http://www.craigslist.org/pen/rfs/106871053.html
I'm so glad to see inventory staying on the market longer. The madness needs to stop.
__________________
fuzzy? cute?
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:33 PM
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#8
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Recycles dryer sheets
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 408
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Holy crap. Sure wish I could pick up my house and move it to a similar area in CA then sell.
LL
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:38 PM
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#9
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,228
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Another part of the country, northern Minnesota: http://tinyurl.com/a3yw3
House isn't that attractive from the outside, but the view is tremendous. I know someone that lives in the neighborhood. The property is walking distance to nice cross country and walking trails.
__________________
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No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:39 PM
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#10
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
WASHINGTON - Sales of new U.S. homes rose more slowly than expected in September, while the number of new houses on the market hit a record and median prices fell, according to a government report Thursday that could signal cooling in the housing boom.
The Commerce Department said new single-family home sales rose 2.1 percent last month to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 1.222 million units from 1.197 million unit pace in August — a sharp downward revision. New home sales were revised lower for June and July as well.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9838303
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 03:43 PM
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#11
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Martha,
The Minneapolis paper the last few weeks have been covering the insane real esate prices on the North Shore. They highlighted an 80 acred parcel in Two Harbors. Sold for 19K in 2000. It has sold 3 times since then. Currently on the market for $700K. Not lakeshore, but a great Lake view. I know my 40 acres down here near the cities has not appreciated that much.
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 05:14 PM
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#12
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,463
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Here's what you can get in Bellingham WA for about the same price range that*other folks have posted.*
http://tinyurl.com/b7vjd
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 05:29 PM
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#13
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,875
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheryl
Here's what you can get in Bellingham WA for about the same price range that*other folks have posted.*
http://tinyurl.com/b7vjd
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Nice! I paid $68,000 for our 1 BR/1Bath cottage in 2001. 100
feet of water frontage. Good neighbors, spectacular views,
and just the right size for a couple. One of my "fallback"
plans is to sell and go WAY OUT in the country. Probably won't,
but I could.
JG
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 05:29 PM
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#14
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,610
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheryl
Here's what you can get in Bellingham WA for about the same price range that*other folks have posted.*
http://tinyurl.com/b7vjd
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Nice house- - -Nice taxes $1140
Move that house to my neck of the woods and you'll pony up about $18,850 *
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 06:13 PM
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#15
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,875
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Honestly............if I had any excess cash I would buy land.
JG
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 06:30 PM
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#16
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,875
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterBlaster
The value is all tied up in the land.
I had dinner about 6 years ago with a real estate apraiser. He told me a good formula for ballparking what the land is worth:* From the asking price subtract the Structure value. You can ballpark the structure value
by taking the square footage of the house multiplied* by $50 (construction costs per square foot) to get an approximate construction cost. Then lower that value by 1 percent for each year the structure is old. So if the house was built in 1978 I calculate that the structure is worth just over $66k (1810*$50*((2005-1978)/100)). (You can pick your own number for construction costs if you like)
Therefore at $615k you are buying a $549k lot with a $66k house structure. Or another way to look at is is 90 percent land (appx) and 10 percent structure. Therefore the quality of the chipped tile and lack of paint on the structure are really not strong factors in determing the final price.
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Agree with this approach, but the
$50 per SF is too low.
I use it sometimes,
but even out here in the sticks I think it is inadequate.
JG
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 06:32 PM
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#17
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,459
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nords
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That doesn't look too bubbly to me. * At least compared to places I looked at in Newport Coast, CA. * $1M+ for a condo. *$2M+ for a crappy house. * These are not waterfront, and most of them don't even have water views. * Just crazy prices.
Newport Coast
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 07:15 PM
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#18
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Full time employment: Posting here.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 768
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
That's just monthly fluctuation.* The price is still up from the start of the year (185 to 215).* Home prices go up in a zig zag fashion over the short term. Odds are that they will finish the year higher than the 185 start, and next year they will again finish higher yet.
http://www.realestateabc.com/graphs/natlmedian.htm
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 07:26 PM
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#19
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Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 5,381
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Great article on one of the worlds savviest real estate investors:
http://www.fortune.com/fortune/inves...117911,00.html
Best quote:
Quote:
"I feel totally safe playing polo on a field full of pros," says the bronzed 58-year-old. "But when amateurs are all over the field, someone can get killed. They have more guts than brains. They charge after every ball and don't know when to hold back." It's the same with the U.S. real estate market right now: "There's too much money chasing too few good deals, with too much debt and too few brains." The amateurs are going to get trampled, he explains, taking seasoned horsemen, who should get off the turf, down with them. Says Barrack: "That's why I'm getting out."
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__________________
Retired early, traveling perpetually.
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
10-27-2005, 08:39 PM
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#20
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Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,463
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Re: Real estate-- calling the top.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael
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That curve appears to be "asymptotic to infinity."* That is a goofy, geeky phrase my dad and I used to use to refer to anything that was being carried to an absurd extreme....
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