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Old 05-22-2014, 01:07 PM   #21
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But what are the alternatives and advantages and risks?
Looking for someone else to tell you how to invest and make money is what earned you the privilege of owning all those wordy annuity contracts. You need to spend the time to read and learn how to do your own investing, not ask unknown, anonymous individuals on an internet forum to tell you how. Start here: Bogleheads® investing start-up kit - Bogleheads
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Old 05-22-2014, 01:18 PM   #22
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Sell everything you have. Take the butt whipping you have coming. Put everything into Wellesley or Wellington and never make another decision.
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Old 05-22-2014, 01:35 PM   #23
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Looking for someone else to tell you how to invest and make money is what earned you the privilege of owning all those wordy annuity contracts. You need to spend the time to read and learn how to do your own investing, not ask unknown, anonymous individuals on an internet forum to tell you how. Start here: Bogleheads® investing start-up kit - Bogleheads

A big 'ol +1. If OP does not even understand what alternatives are to annuities, I don't understand how the annuities were anything other than the result of the salesman screw job.
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Old 05-22-2014, 01:59 PM   #24
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A big 'ol +1. If OP does not even understand what alternatives are to annuities, I don't understand how the annuities were anything other than the result of the salesman screw job.
Brewer; What a hoot. I viewed your response before signing in so there were adds showing on your post. The add was for annuities.
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Old 05-22-2014, 04:10 PM   #25
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Read Dick Bogle's tenants longtime ago. Looked at Wellington and Wellsley but couldn't reconcile using their Vanguard's managed fund vs unmanaged Vanguard's indexes. Two primary postulates that DB has: #1 You can't beat the market; #2 Low fees. Not a bad argument and we had some managed money in Fidelity(grandfathered) and Indexes in the brokerage account. Even had Dreyfus LiquidAssets originally started in '74. Vanguards in 401k.

We all remember 9/11's aftermath? It took 2 years before the market hit bottom. We weathered it OK, DCA all the time. So, what happens in an occurrence of the fall 2008 and winter 2009? When jobs were in jeopardy, housing values pluments, and Vanguard various funds drop 30-40% and you have not time left to DCA?
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Old 05-22-2014, 04:17 PM   #26
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If you don't have time left to dollar cost average, you are probably (or close to) decumulating. That can be done over time.
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Old 05-22-2014, 04:33 PM   #27
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Long; Or should I call you Rumsfeld; Please don't interpret my comments below as suggesting you should change your investments but you have asked for alternative views. I'm not "selling" anything. I have two bookshelves of PF books that I have gathered, read and in some cases reread numerous times. I have subscriptions to PF magazines and general newsletters. Our own approach was to first, determine our tolerance for risk(Conservative/moderate/aggressive) We then developed an AA plan breaking down our Equity Allocation between Large/Small/Growth/Value/Int'l/ Reit/Commodities. We own several dividend blue chips but we now purchase index funds exclusively, do not time the market and rebalance annually. Our FI has been primarily in a bond ladder, however we are now overweight cash due to poor FI returns.

We didn't sell during the 07/08 tumble and serendipitously rebalanced the portfolio on 3/9/09, having no idea that 3/9/09 was the low until after the fact. We continued to add to our investments from annual LBYM savings during the recession and have doubled our portfolio since the darkest days. We try very hard to ignore all the noise, do not watch CNBC and we sleep pretty well at night.


It's pretty much a Set It and Forget it approach.
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Old 05-22-2014, 04:40 PM   #28
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Looking for new & old ideas for current allocation and future (1-4 yrs) inheritance money : So sell me something or sell me to your thinking.
You seem to be upset that you're not getting specific advice/recommendations.

But you have yet to ask a specific question -- only ones that call for an open-ended answer.

Really, we're not internet forum bullies; we just have a lot of experience with trolls. Treat us right and we'll treat you right.
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Old 05-22-2014, 05:03 PM   #29
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One interesting way to look at your annuities.

What cash have you put in, and when? If your cashed out today, ignoring taxes, what would you walk away with in cash? What is the IRR for those cash flows?

If you stay, what will you be guaranteed to receive and when? What is the IRR implicit in what you could walk away with today compared to what you are guaranteed to receive in the future?

If you stay, what will you be likely receive and when? What is the IRR implicit in what you could walk away with today compared to what you are likely to receive in the future?

Follow the money.
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:04 PM   #30
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One interesting way to look at your annuities.

Follow the money.
Finally an intelligent question.
Reread the "lengrhy" descriptions of what I have in the annuities. Since you already seen some bad ones, have you seen a good one? You still have not understood why I bought the annuities.

I'll get back to you after I add up the spread sheet and tend to Mom.


I am looking for alternatives. And reasons why I should change. Fees to me, at this stage is silly. To buy and hold is a possibility and I got into trouble in 2008 doing just this. I'll give you the numbers later- but will you also show me yours?
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:09 PM   #31
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You seem to be upset that you're not getting specific advice/recommendations.

But you have yet to ask a specific question -- only ones that call for an open-ended answer.

Really, we're not internet forum bullies; we just have a lot of experience with trolls. Treat us right and we'll treat you right.

If you have been reading my other posts on other threads, OP's asked a specific question-I answered in what I have done in my situation. I was immediately attacked for being "stupid" for a lack of a better word. Call the posts trolling, but some one is thinking else they would not be reading.
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:11 PM   #32
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:17 PM   #33
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Finally an intelligent question.
Reread the "lengrhy" descriptions of what I have in the annuities. Since you already seen some bad ones, have you seen a good one? You still have not understood why I bought the annuities.

I'll get back to you after I add up the spread sheet and tend to Mom.
If we are talking about VAs or FIAs/EIAs, there are no good ones. You are engaging in a game of "find the lady" in a deck with 1000 cards and only one lady (up the dealer's sleeve).

As Far as I can tell, you bought the annuities because a bunch of salespeople bought you rubber chicken dinners.
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:20 PM   #34
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That doesn't mean that people are actually interested. It can sort of be like watching the monkey cage at the zoo.
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:32 PM   #35
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That doesn't mean that people are actually interested. It can sort of be like watching the monkey cage at the zoo.
Actually I find these acrobatics more entertaining.
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Old 05-22-2014, 06:47 PM   #36
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I can't post this, but go to YouTube and search for "Pryor monkeys".
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Old 05-22-2014, 08:43 PM   #37
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You have been bullies to me and to others. You should reread your posts in just this thread and determine if you even once asked what are my objectives, my AA, my risk tolerance, when will I need the money, are you properly insured, how long I have been investing-All you could say was that I was sold, Sold, and SOLD when I kept saying I was Looking, and Looking Very Carefully; Innumerable presentations, a lot policies, and a lot of agents-representatives. I detailed what I had several times because I was looking for a way to get portfolio insurance and have an upside.

I got an older bro, phD, economics, C level, private banking, A survivor in his world. Retail fees are nothing as compared to private banking. You somehow missed that I have 6 annuities from 2 different companies, bought at different times. Do you really think I didn't understand the fee structure when I kept ignoring your comments?

My measure of good advice is your measure of success. None of you volunteered so what do you expect me to believe that the only road to FIRE is to do Vanguard and I stupid and sold crap? Tell me your successes and your failures, so that me and everyone who reads this thread-forum can benefit and get to FIRE.

I will later start a new thread and hopefully get some better responses.

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Old 05-22-2014, 08:46 PM   #38
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1011 views in a 25 hours.

Thankyou
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Old 05-22-2014, 09:05 PM   #39
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At this point, I think you are just an attention-seeking troll. I am not sure why you are this way, but as I say (to annoy DW), "life is about choices."

You were given the best advice anyone asking silly questions can get: do your reading, educate yourself and learn to make good decisions. Learn to fish, don't expect to be fed by the fisherman.
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Old 05-22-2014, 10:28 PM   #40
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.....To buy and hold is a possibility and I got into trouble in 2008 doing just this. I'll give you the numbers later- but will you also show me yours?
How did you get into trouble buying and holding? the market has fully recovered and then some.
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