Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
rolling over an IRA after RMDs have started?
Old 09-20-2018, 11:48 AM   #1
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 160
rolling over an IRA after RMDs have started?

Trying to study up on RMDs... until now I thought I had 15 years before I'd have to worry about them. I've been googling, but the subtlety of "AFTER RMDs have started" is ignored.

Dear old (84) Dad (DOD) got suckered into an ING/Voya IRA annuity 9 years ago.
My initial math says he could do much better rolling it into brokered CDs (including surrender charges and paying back part of the "bonus" they gave him to open it).
The curve ball is its already paying out RMDs... I'm concerned that if he rolls it over, the new custodian will recalc RMDs based on his current age and dramatically increase his withdrawal rate.


To complicate matters, DOD didn't keep ANY paperwork on his annuity purchase contract or original RMD calculation info.... all I have to work off of is a few of the recent statements he did keep.


Anybody rolled an IRA and maintained your current RMD schedule?

Anybody know where I can read up on if/how he can maintain the original RMD schedule when rolling to a new custodian?
It might be specific to the custodian so I'll have to bark up that specific tree... but was wondering if there are underlying IRS rules on the topic.
__________________

Spock is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 09-20-2018, 11:54 AM   #2
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 10,235
You may not correctly understand how RMDs are calculated. Since your RMD is dependent on the 12/31 value of your IRA the previous year, there is no schedule. It must be calculated every year.

Call the financial house where you plan to move the money and ask them how they will handle doing the calculations for you post move. If you've already done the RMD for 2018 and move the money now, the new financial house will know the year end 2018 value to calculate the 2019 RMD.
__________________

__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 11:54 AM   #3
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
OldShooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: City
Posts: 2,144
The custodians provide RMD numbers as a courtesy. They have no legal standing and hence can be ignored when you are calculating Dad's RMD. You still have your question, I understand, but once you get the answer there is no reason to worry about whatever number some custodian might come up with and, of course, the custodian can't force someone to take a distribution.
OldShooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 11:56 AM   #4
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Dash man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Limerick
Posts: 2,171
Isnít the RMD calculated on an age based percentage on the value of the retirement funds on Dec 31 of the prior year? Why would a rollover change that?
Dash man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 12:02 PM   #5
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 160
RMD recalc at start of every year:
OK.... I'll start homeworking there. I had (mis)understood that they used the schedule table when RMDs start... didn't realize that its reset every year anyway.
That does answer the unasked question about RMDs and the effect of portfolio gains/losses.
Thanks!
Spock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 12:02 PM   #6
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Ypsilanti
Posts: 83
If your Dad's Annuity is contained within an IRA, there is no RMD owed. The IRS treats the Annuity disbursements as a substitute for the RMD regardless of the amount of the disbursement.
MI-Roger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 12:08 PM   #7
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 212
Generally, the company you are moving an IRA from will complete the RMD for the year if it has not been done. The receiving company will start the RMD in the next calendar year. You just need to tell the new company the method of payment (monthly, quarterly etc.) and when you want the payment to start.
pjm-7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 12:20 PM   #8
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,017
get some professional advice as you need to know what you have. Some annuities in IRAs are not counted toward RMS (QLACs), some other that kick out payments are able to have the payments count as their RMD (not sure of specifics).

Your base question of rolling over after starting RMDs is not that complicated in normal investments in the TIRAs. But you really want to know how to deal with and change an annuity that is kicking out payments used for RMDs that may not be related to RMD calculation tables.

I'm 13 years from RMD and at this point have not thought about annuities in TIRAs for myself.
bingybear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2018, 12:54 PM   #9
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,246
ask your question at fairmark.com in the retirement forum. Look for an answer by Alan S.

The annuity complicates the situation since as mentioned by another previously, often the annuity may not require RMDs since the distributions are considered to serve that function for the annuity.
__________________

kaneohe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Started the ball rolling GalaxyBoy Life after FIRE 2 12-14-2016 01:29 PM
Rolling Over After Tax 401k Contributions Corporate ORphan FIRE and Money 8 06-30-2015 07:49 AM
Stupid question about rolling over an IRA RhodyGreg14 Young Dreamers 8 04-22-2008 05:25 PM
We started the ER ball rolling! tangomonster Hi, I am... 4 05-20-2006 09:52 PM
Rolling over 401k/IRA to Fidelity, any ideas? OldAgePensioner FIRE and Money 0 10-22-2005 08:10 AM

» Quick Links

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:06 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.