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Old 07-26-2007, 02:31 PM   #21
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I would like to thank everyone who has responded. This site was an eye opener for me. I wish I discovered this place early on. I envy everyone here and the knowledge and intelligence in this place.

And there are thousands, if not millions, of people in this country who envy where you are. Ain't perspective a funny thing?
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Old 07-26-2007, 02:52 PM   #22
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Steve, Thanks for sharing. I don't see struggling from what you just laid out for us. I see frustrated with this job. You are not the job and the job is not you.
I will "third" Spanky's suggestion you return to school. If your personal schedule needs will allow it you could go at night without quitting this job or you could take a less stressful job and go to school or as has been mentioned you could stop working long enough to finish your degree.
It appears you are in a good financial position. Your net worth is nicely on track for a 46 yr old. Your wifes income is 70% of the household take and your only debt beyond the mortgage is a 24,000 car loan. You guys should be able to get by on her income and if you can't selling a car is easy then go buy a $2,000 car (that's what I drive). If your cash flow still seemed tight you have plenty of options with $380,000 in equity you could sell the joint and pay cash for something. You guys could flip burgers for 20 years and cover your grocery bills with no debt. I am not recommending this strategy I just want to point out that you have worked yourself into a nice enough position that you are still set up to win even if some items work against you.
You're on track don't let the other kid's at work get you rattled.
Thanks for the kind words. You are not the job and the job is not you certainly is a true statement. I used to look up to people in management and above. When my wife got into management boy we just shake our heads.
My former yale ivy league boss was a voyeur and frequented strip clubs and xxx sites. I had no problem with his vice as long as he stays away from my kids. He asked me for direction on how to handle situations at work. sheez. He eventually was terminated and found another gov job.
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Old 07-26-2007, 07:14 PM   #23
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Steve,

Check out Dr. Nemko's site. He is a career consultant. His advices in general are very useful and thoughtful.
Career, Education, and Life Advice from Marty Nemko

Good luck - whatever you choose - finding another job in which your talents are appreciated or returning to school to enhance your prospect of a brighter future.

Spanky
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Old 07-26-2007, 10:07 PM   #24
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Hi Steve,

I hear you! I also work for the local government and it does get hopeless sometimes. It's usually fairly hard to get a promotion of any kind. Employees have to submit a request and job review to be considered for promotion, and the process sometimes takes 2+ years. I submitted my application for a promotion in November 06, and up until now, my boss still hasn't had time to read it. It's not even that long.

I have been in my job for about 8 years. A lot of highly qualified people have left our agency during this period, and they all seem much happier now. Perhaps you're risk-averse like me. I have a hard time giving up a stable income and going for something totally on my own.

One thing you may want to consider is to have a side job. I know people who have a real estate license on the side, and it seemed to have worked for them. Ideally, though, that would be a jumping board to go full-time into that new career.

I agree with the other posters that it is a huge risk to buy another business. You're probably better off as a sole proprietor to start with, minimizing your overhead. Many businesses, such as real estate, mortgage, insurance, and other sales, don't require a large upfront expense if you're willing to work hard and socialize. Good luck!
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Old 07-27-2007, 08:31 AM   #25
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Steve,

Check out Dr. Nemko's site. He is a career consultant. His advices in general are very useful and thoughtful.
Career, Education, and Life Advice from Marty Nemko

Good luck - whatever you choose - finding another job in which your talents are appreciated or returning to school to enhance your prospect of a brighter future.

Spanky
Thank you very much for the link. That is a great site.
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Old 07-27-2007, 09:06 AM   #26
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Hi Steve,

I hear you! I also work for the local government and it does get hopeless sometimes. It's usually fairly hard to get a promotion of any kind. Employees have to submit a request and job review to be considered for promotion, and the process sometimes takes 2+ years. I submitted my application for a promotion in November 06, and up until now, my boss still hasn't had time to read it. It's not even that long.

I have been in my job for about 8 years. A lot of highly qualified people have left our agency during this period, and they all seem much happier now. Perhaps you're risk-averse like me. I have a hard time giving up a stable income and going for something totally on my own.

One thing you may want to consider is to have a side job. I know people who have a real estate license on the side, and it seemed to have worked for them. Ideally, though, that would be a jumping board to go full-time into that new career.

I agree with the other posters that it is a huge risk to buy another business. You're probably better off as a sole proprietor to start with, minimizing your overhead. Many businesses, such as real estate, mortgage, insurance, and other sales, don't require a large upfront expense if you're willing to work hard and socialize. Good luck!
Hi goodsense,
Yes at the end of the year I look in the mirror and say geez is this really all I can do? I learn so many things and like to be challenge. Also when your rolling into middle age and still making the same you look around and the other ones are just cruising along. Its really hard for me to do this but I really have to cut my losses. I have big dreams and aspirations. Why did I stay for that long? Well the first 5 years I was in the building phase and wanted to provide security for my kids. The other 2 years I was on the waiting phase. Th 1.5 years my wife got laid off and the last years was seriously looking into other avenues.

One more thing about the local govt. If you start seeing them addressing the media more and more... addressing the public about the dangers of anything. Basically crying wolf (IMO)! That means their dept want more fundings from the public in the way of raising taxes or they want a cut of the federal budget. In our dept the illegals are one of their revenues or job security. They look the other way so we could provide service for these people and charge the feds for these. Its amazing and no wonder why our deficit is through the roof. Many unproductive pat in the back meetings and when everything is idle they try to fix things that are not broken.
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Old 07-27-2007, 08:49 PM   #27
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Steve,

My 2 cents:

You are only making about $11/hr. You could do better working as a driver for UPS, and they have a lot less stress (or maybe a different kind). What's wrong with driving a truck? I'll bet that the guys who fill in the potholes for your city make more than you. How are those jobs filled? Don't be trapped into a white-collar-only mentality.

Since you have stayed as long as you have in this situation, I am thinking that you don't have very good business sense and little experience in entrepreneurship. (No offense intended.) I would strongly advise against jumping into your own business. As you have recently found, it is a minefield. I am afraid you would lose your shirt.

Going back to school sounds like a very good option since you are so close to finishing.

Get some occupational counseling!!!!! It is available and worth the money. Your school will have some kind of placement center. Call them. Use them. Your state probably has some such function, too. Make your real job finding your next job or occupation. Find something that pays better. Good money is more important than a tie.

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Old 07-28-2007, 10:14 AM   #28
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Steve,

My 2 cents:

You are only making about $11/hr. You could do better working as a driver for UPS, and they have a lot less stress (or maybe a different kind). What's wrong with driving a truck? I'll bet that the guys who fill in the potholes for your city make more than you. How are those jobs filled? Don't be trapped into a white-collar-only mentality.

This is true ed. I attend my kids soccer games and hear other parents (blue collar)on the sidelines what they do and make. I just shake my head.

Since you have stayed as long as you have in this situation, I am thinking that you don't have very good business sense and little experience in entrepreneurship. (No offense intended.) I would strongly advise against jumping into your own business. As you have recently found, it is a minefield. I am afraid you would lose your shirt.

Going back to school sounds like a very good option since you are so close to finishing.

Get some occupational counseling!!!!! It is available and worth the money. Your school will have some kind of placement center. Call them. Use them. Your state probably has some such function, too. Make your real job finding your next job or occupation. Find something that pays better. Good money is more important than a tie.

Ed
Ed no offense taken. I welcome all suggestion and comments. This will help me learn. What do you mean by good business sense? Some ideas of my background. I was raised around business owners and this has been a long passion for me. I just never had a capital to start a business.

Your last paragraph about the tie cracks me up. I did look good but certainly the money wasn't there. I calculated everything and I know in the end I will be paying for my inaction.
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Old 07-28-2007, 10:25 AM   #29
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Steve
Go to earlytorise.com and enroll in their daily newsletter. You will get a steady stream of ideas for how to make more money.

Also beware that the number one skill you need in your own business is marketing and sales. Most businesses fail because they lack the right mix of those skills.
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Old 07-28-2007, 10:35 AM   #30
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Steve
Go to earlytorise.com and enroll in their daily newsletter. You will get a steady stream of ideas for how to make more money.

Also beware that the number one skill you need in your own business is marketing and sales. Most businesses fail because they lack the right mix of those skills.

Thanks for the link. I forgot to add that I really get excited when I read about being a business owners or the ones who has a business. I was so close on buying an ice cream franchise as a start 5 years ago. I felt that my money would get better returns in the stock market. wrong! I am resourceful when it comes to marketing and sales. My strong points are interaction with people.
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Old 07-28-2007, 12:47 PM   #31
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Steve
Go to earlytorise.com and enroll in their daily newsletter. You will get a steady stream of ideas for how to make more money.

Also beware that the number one skill you need in your own business is marketing and sales. Most businesses fail because they lack the right mix of those skills.

Don't forget finance. Many businesses fail because of the lack of cash flow.
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Old 07-28-2007, 01:59 PM   #32
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Some ideas of my background. I was raised around business owners and this has been a long passion for me. I just never had a capital to start a business.
OK, it isn't as bad as I feared.

However, you may have been in the room, but you haven't been in the game. Your career so far appears unusually risk-averse. Except for the fact that your wife works, your situation looks a little risky to me. And it looks like you still are short of capital. (I don't like franchises, by the way--they cost too much. If you have the experience, you don't need them.) I have seen too many people with no experience in business try and lose big. I don't worry about the ones that have never worked for anybody but themselves.

How about this: If you can live on your wife's income alone, why not try something that does not require capital? How about sales? Get on with a brokerage. (You have the tie already. ;-) ) Work in an ice cream shop and learn the business at someone else's expense. You should become a manger in no time. You could do this more than once. Sell used cars. (Easy entry and you get a thick skin very fast.) Then move on to Mercedes. (Buy a better tie.) The idea is, don't bet the farm if you don't have to. All you risk in sales is your time. And you get used to working without a net.

Best of luck to you.
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Old 07-28-2007, 04:22 PM   #33
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Steve,
From what I've read here, I'm not sure what to suggest. It seems like there are two practical courses of action:
a) Re-boot into corporate work: Find a gap-filling job while you go back to school and finish up there (or, if you can grit your teeth and temporarily do without the paycheck, then just go to school full time to get the schooling done faster.) Getting the degree will make you more marketable to employers, but you'll also have a chance to develop some new contacts/ideas that you might not otherwise get. There will be career counseling at the college, you might look into doing an internship to get your foot in the door with a good company, and some of the adult students might be aware of opportunities you could pursue.

b) Keep money coming in while you develop an entrepreneurial future. Get a gap-filling job (ideally in the same type of business you'd like to start yourself--there's NO better way to learn the ropes, determine if it is really what you want to do, and how to get into biz the most efficient way--at lowest cost to you).

Unfortunately, if you pick one course and then change ideas, you'll have lost some valuable time. A college degree is seldom as useful to a small businessman as using that time to gain experience/build contacts. Course of action "A" would probably be seen as lower risk by most of us, but (honestly), it sounds from your experiences that, for whatever reason, you've had limited success in advancing while being part of a big machine.
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Old 07-28-2007, 04:49 PM   #34
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Could we move this thread to "HI, I am" section....I really dont think it belongs in "Fire and money"....

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Old 07-28-2007, 05:34 PM   #35
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Thanks for the link. I forgot to add that I really get excited when I read about being a business owners or the ones who has a business. I was so close on buying an ice cream franchise as a start 5 years ago. I felt that my money would get better returns in the stock market. wrong! I am resourceful when it comes to marketing and sales. My strong points are interaction with people.
You're doing great. Wife's got great job, nice home equity, nice savings. Be a great father and spouse.

I'd avoid "buying a business" as a reactive response. I would go work for a small company - less politics (but the owner is "king" and that can be worse than politics).

Maybe you can find a small company where the owner wants to retire in a few years. Maybe there's an arragement where you can take 1/2 your compensation as salary, and the other 1/2 buys you "sweat equity".

Good luck !
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Old 07-29-2007, 09:38 AM   #36
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Steve,
From what I've read here, I'm not sure what to suggest. It seems like there are two practical courses of action:
a) Re-boot into corporate work: Find a gap-filling job while you go back to school and finish up there (or, if you can grit your teeth and temporarily do without the paycheck, then just go to school full time to get the schooling done faster.) Getting the degree will make you more marketable to employers, but you'll also have a chance to develop some new contacts/ideas that you might not otherwise get. There will be career counseling at the college, you might look into doing an internship to get your foot in the door with a good company, and some of the adult students might be aware of opportunities you could pursue.

b) Keep money coming in while you develop an entrepreneurial future. Get a gap-filling job (ideally in the same type of business you'd like to start yourself--there's NO better way to learn the ropes, determine if it is really what you want to do, and how to get into biz the most efficient way--at lowest cost to you).

Unfortunately, if you pick one course and then change ideas, you'll have lost some valuable time. A college degree is seldom as useful to a small businessman as using that time to gain experience/build contacts. Course of action "A" would probably be seen as lower risk by most of us, but (honestly), it sounds from your experiences that, for whatever reason, you've had limited success in advancing while being part of a big machine.
Corporate work would be likely my next course of action. My limited success in advancing while being part of a big machine is hard for me to admit but it was my fault. Given all the circumstances stated on my previous post I had to take that route. My wife who will be getting a raise in the near future will put our net income in the same situation as if I was working. Just hard for me to put all the burden to my wife.
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Old 07-29-2007, 09:55 AM   #37
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You're doing great. Wife's got great job, nice home equity, nice savings. Be a great father and spouse.

I'd avoid "buying a business" as a reactive response. I would go work for a small company - less politics (but the owner is "king" and that can be worse than politics).

Maybe you can find a small company where the owner wants to retire in a few years. Maybe there's an arragement where you can take 1/2 your compensation as salary, and the other 1/2 buys you "sweat equity".

Good luck !
A father and a spouse is all I can offer at the moment. Owner is king or the workplace boss is king is always a problem. My boss was a pretend nice person that never made an effort to help us.

Maybe you can find a small company where the owner wants to retire in a few years. Maybe there's an arragement where you can take 1/2 your compensation as salary, and the other 1/2 buys you "sweat equity".

That would be great!
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Old 07-29-2007, 10:35 AM   #38
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OK, it isn't as bad as I feared.

However, you may have been in the room, but you haven't been in the game. Your career so far appears unusually risk-averse. Except for the fact that your wife works, your situation looks a little risky to me. And it looks like you still are short of capital. (I don't like franchises, by the way--they cost too much. If you have the experience, you don't need them.) I have seen too many people with no experience in business try and lose big. I don't worry about the ones that have never worked for anybody but themselves.

How about this: If you can live on your wife's income alone, why not try something that does not require capital? How about sales? Get on with a brokerage. (You have the tie already. ;-) ) Work in an ice cream shop and learn the business at someone else's expense. You should become a manger in no time. You could do this more than once. Sell used cars. (Easy entry and you get a thick skin very fast.) Then move on to Mercedes. (Buy a better tie.) The idea is, don't bet the farm if you don't have to. All you risk in sales is your time. And you get used to working without a net.

Best of luck to you.
Thank you very much for your input ed. My risk averse regarding my career has benefited my kids in the short term. The flexibility in my schedule has provided that. I will throw myself out there again and hopefully when I post here in the future it would be positive.
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