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Old 05-27-2014, 01:30 PM   #81
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Nothing of the sort. I'm simply trying to understand where the savings is coming from. I can't get the numbers to add up in the way you describe. What do you make of my numbers?

Without understanding it, it's pretty hard to tell if this information about energy savings gadgets is useful to me, the OP, or anyone reading this thread. And for some of us, some of these look like they would be expenses, not a savings at all, which was what the OP (and many of us) are looking for (savings).

-ERD50
I think you have to just run the numbers for yourself with a Kill A Watt and estimate the hard wired lights and appliances with numbers from the web on generic average energy usages. Make a spreadsheet and try to allocate your daily kw usage by appliance / light / furnace fan / TV / computer / whatever.

Then make before and after columns by kw with cost / savings estimates by light / appliance / fan and just go down the list to see what changes have a worthwhile positive ROI for you to do and which ones do not.

My FIL lives alone and doesn't cook at home much, so he probably wouldn't save a dime buying kitchen gadgets.
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Old 05-27-2014, 01:51 PM   #82
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In the days before the internet... before eBay... my parents used to sell at flea markets. It was their hobby and they made money on the side.

After my dad died and I bought the old homestead from my mom,
I inherited lots of their old flea market stuff... all packed away in boxes.

I was a single working mom with a disabled child, so I didn't have time to deal with all that "stuff"... so I let those boxes remain as they were for over a decade until I was ready to sell the house and move. By then I had also accumulated too much of my own "stuff."

After selling the house and moving out what I wanted to keep,
I hired estate sale professionals who went through all those boxes and other stuff I left behind, displayed it and sold it for about 30% of the profit [they were worth every penny of that 30%.] To my surprise all that useless "stuff" netted several thousand dollars.

Btw... those estate sale professionals were two retired couples.
I always thought that would be an interesting part-time job for retirees.

.
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Old 05-27-2014, 02:56 PM   #83
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Thanks, I meant to mention that, but forgot.

Yes, in the store, fresh herbs are actually quite expensive, and I usually need less than the package size in the time they go bad.

Many herbs are very, very easy to grow, and generally don't have insect problems. We have a big pot of rosemary, bring it into our 3 season room over winter, and have fresh rosemary all year round. I think we end up replacing one of the three plants about every third year.

Thyme and parsley are great too. Mint and chives are only slightly more work, and we don't really use much. I'm not crazy about our oregano, maybe I'm just used to the taste of dried? I haven't bothered to dry/crush it, and I think dried oregano is not so expensive (don't really recall the price).

It takes so little space and effort to grow those herbs, don'g it for the 'fun of it' is a really small step, and though I never calculated it, some savings to boot.


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-ERD50
+1

I love growing our herbs! We have thyme, rosemary, basil, sage, parlsey, and cilantro. Also Thai Basil....and some other one that I can't remember that has flowers that taste like peppers.

I hated wasting herbs bought in the store. Even though we live in a townhouse (i.e. mini-garden), I make sure I have pots for the herbs!
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Old 05-27-2014, 03:15 PM   #84
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I know it's been mentioned, but cancelling cable TV and watching over-the-air broadcasts has been wonderful for me. I save $110/month and honestly, I am watching the same shows and the HD is just as good or better. I have Amazon Prime but since I "cut the cable" I have streamed only part of one show. I don't feel I am missing anything.

My reasons for changing my cable service were not that I needed the money, but that I need to get at least some value from the money I spend. The extra money saved is just a bonus and I am happily blowing it on whatever appeals to me.

Next, the landline is going! I get zero value out of having it.

Living in a relatively small (1600 square foot) house helps a lot in keeping property taxes, insurance, maintenance, and energy bills down.
I agree with you about cable tv.I cancelled my cable about 4 years ago.I do not miss it at all or their high rates.Of course I am not a big sports fan and I think that is how the cable company plans on keeping old customers and gaining new ones.I have a digital tv converter and I get over 100 free channels.I am lucky to live within range of Los Angeles tv.
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Old 05-27-2014, 05:12 PM   #85
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I imagine that I would love to cut cable, but I know I never will. It is our primary source of "entertainment". For $110/month I get 100 TV stations (of which I watch about 20), midlevel speed internet and a home phone.

I totally agree with "staying out of stores" to "save" money (in reality, its a way of "not wasting" money).

I ONLY buy protein when it is on sale, except for eggs which are rarely on sale. I ONLY buy canned / jarred goods when they are on sale or from Aldi (for the most part the only canned / jarred goods I use are tomatoes, tuna, sardines and coffee). I stock up on these sale items, buying approximately 3 months worth of goods (which generally brings me to the next sale cycle).

I only buy lemons and limes when they are on sale. If they are not fully ripe I set them on the counter to ripen. But I ALWAYS freeze them before I use them. Seems to me I get 2x as much juice from a defrosted lemon or lime as a similar fresh one.

I generally cook from scratch, and my meals are exceptionally boring. DH claims that I don't like flavor and to some extent he's right - I like my food very plain. I either roast or grill my protein and I steam my veggies. For "flavor" I'll add a bit of basil or parsley or garlic (or some combo of those) to some olive oil and dress my veggies with that.

I grow basil and parsley since these are the herbs I use the most (3 - 4 times a week).

I ALWAYS make a meal menu for the week. This ensures that I remember to defrost the meat from my freezer and keeps me from throwing produce away.

Over the past 3 months I've cut my water usage in half ! I never let "good" water run down the drain. At the start of the day I plug the drain that has the garbage disposal. As I rinse things or wash my hands during the day I let that water accumulate in the plugged sink. At the end of the day I toss my dinner plates, utensils, bowls, etc into that water and let them soak. After 15 minutes I can swish the items around and they are generally spotless. If not, I use a sponge. I then put the items into the dishwasher. When the dishwasher is full (generally after 3 days) I run it on the "light" cycle.

We've also made an effort to turn the throttle down at least half way on the shower when we are soaping up / washing our hair.

I am also experimenting with only wearing black shorts, black slacks or sundresses. I have three pair of shorts and three pair of slacks plus about 6 sundresses. All my tops fit into two dresser drawers (one for tank tops and sleeveless shirts, one for golf shirts and "winter" shirts). I'm doing it mostly because I like to keep things simple, but I have a feeling its saving me money also since I don't have to worry about color coordinating an outfit. It also means I only need two pairs of shoes (both black - one 2 in heel, one 4 in heel), and two pairs of sandals (one comfortable, one more dressy).

I rarely use lights - most of the time I have daylight or nightlights guiding me through the house. I did mean to look into LED nightlight bulbs ... I still need to do that.

I agree with W2R that living in a relatively small (1500 sq ft) house has done alot to bring my expense run rate down. Property taxes are half, home insurance is half and electricity is less than half ! We'll see what happens on the maintenance front. Year 1 in the smaller home was expensive, but I think I'll have a 3 year payback. Given that I plan on being here at least 15 years (and maybe 30, like the previous owners !!) the extra initial expense was worth it.
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Old 05-27-2014, 05:28 PM   #86
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+1

I love growing our herbs! We have thyme, rosemary, basil, sage, parlsey, and cilantro. Also Thai Basil....and some other one that I can't remember that has flowers that taste like peppers.

I hated wasting herbs bought in the store. Even though we live in a townhouse (i.e. mini-garden), I make sure I have pots for the herbs!
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...
I totally agree with "staying out of stores" to "save" money (in reality, its a way of "not wasting" money).
...
I only buy lemons and limes when they are on sale. If they are not fully ripe I set them on the counter to ripen. But I ALWAYS freeze them before I use them. Seems to me I get 2x as much juice from a defrosted lemon or lime as a similar fresh one.

....

I grow basil and parsley since these are the herbs I use the most (3 - 4 times a week).

... .
Yes, basil is another one we grow (actually, DW seems to take care of that one). You can really go nuts with that, there are all sorts of varieties, lemon, lime, etc. And if you don't have quite enough to make pesto, you can blend it with spinach and/or arugula. Tastes good, and some prefer the milder taste.

I bought some cilantro seeds, DW says she has not had good luck with them in the past. If it gets hot they bolt and go to seed, but worth a try.


I'll have to try that with freezing a lemon/lie for juice. I usually just roll them around a lot before I squeeze them. I guess there is a lime shortage? They were $1 each last time I needed a few!


-ERD50
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Old 05-27-2014, 05:33 PM   #87
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Speaking of lemon, we use quite a bit of lemon juice, not just in cooking but for drinking too as it helps my prevention of kidney stones. But lemons can get expensive at times, and my lemon tree is not yet that big to supply the need.

I recently found out that the wholesale Costco (not the ordinary Costco) carries big bottles of lemon juice for really cheap prices, something like $3.50 for 1.5L of pure lemon juice. They also have lime juice. I am in lemon heaven!



PS. My memory is getting bad!

The price was around $2.50 for 2 bottles of 1.5L each of lemon juice. And it's around $3.50 for 2 bottles of lime juice. Buy, buy, buy...
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Old 05-27-2014, 06:11 PM   #88
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I guess there is a lime shortage? They were $1 each last time I needed a few!


-ERD50
The ethnic markets by us usually have lemons and limes for a fraction of the price of the retail stores like Safeway. The price varies by season, but usually between 3 and 10 for a dollar.
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Old 05-27-2014, 06:54 PM   #89
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Yes, basil is another one we grow (actually, DW seems to take care of that one). You can really go nuts with that, there are all sorts of varieties, lemon, lime, etc. And if you don't have quite enough to make pesto, you can blend it with spinach and/or arugula. Tastes good, and some prefer the milder taste.

I bought some cilantro seeds, DW says she has not had good luck with them in the past. If it gets hot they bolt and go to seed, but worth a try.


I'll have to try that with freezing a lemon/lie for juice. I usually just roll them around a lot before I squeeze them. I guess there is a lime shortage? They were $1 each last time I needed a few!


-ERD50
I've tried cilantro more times then I care to admit (since it would prove that I AM actually insane). It always bolts and goes to seed. I use Goya recaito for all my cilantro needs. If you figure out a way to keep your cilantro going please let me know !

I roll the lemons and limes around after they are defrosted to get the max juice. I think the freezing breaks the cell walls down and the rolling gets the juices flowing. Just a theory.
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Old 05-27-2014, 07:02 PM   #90
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We grow cilantro too, but only when it's cool. Here in the SW, it means growing it in late fall and winter. Delicate as it looks, it can stand a light freeze a lot better than other herbs. In season, it grows like weed and we have so much to give away.

Right now, I would not bother. I do not know how commercial growers do it.

PS. We usually save a few plants after their prime, let them dry out in order to harvest the seeds (coriander) for cooking as well as replanting.
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Old 05-27-2014, 07:36 PM   #91
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We grow cilantro too, but only when it's cool. Here in the SW, it means growing it in late fall and winter. Delicate as it looks, it can stand a light freeze a lot better than other herbs. In season, it grows like weed and we have so much to give away.

Right now, I would not bother. I do not know how commercial growers do it.

PS. We usually save a few plants after their prime, let them dry out in order to harvest the seeds (coriander) for cooking as well as replanting.
Have you ever bit into a green growing coriander seed? It's quite nice. I used to make a paste, very unusual taste, we loved them.
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Old 05-27-2014, 07:59 PM   #92
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I've tried cilantro more times then I care to admit (since it would prove that I AM actually insane). It always bolts and goes to seed. I use Goya recaito for all my cilantro needs. If you figure out a way to keep your cilantro going please let me know ! ...
Well, based on what I recall from growing other plants that tend to bolt - there's not much us mere mortals can do, it's up to Mother Nature. If it gets hot, they bolt.

But as NW-B says, depending on climate, you might be able to plant them in the fall. My recent experience was that I needed some Cilantro, and one option at the grocer was a small planted pot. I bought it, and that's when DW said she never has luck with them. I read up some, and yes, they are tricky. But I got some luck, this was fall, and I kept it in our 3-season room, which will stay a good 20-30F higher than ambient as we get into winter. So we got small amounts from it for a few months.

But this was a good reminder - I think I'll plant half the packet in a big pot (it gets a tap root) on the North side of the house that gets some morning sun - it does seem to stay cooler there the rest of the day. And I'll save the other half packet for Fall, and bring the pot into the 3-season room with the other herbs when it's getting cold.

But this is mostly for 'fun', and some convenience, and saving a few $ here and there is nice too. Even though fresh herbs are at relatively high prices in the store, we aren't using enough to make it a blip in the budget either way. But I really do get a lot of enjoyment from the herbs, just being to go out in the 3-season room and pluck some fresh herbs in the dead of winter brightens the day a bit. It's really worth it for me, for the very little bit of effort it takes.

'Real' gardening just doesn't do it for me anymore. Been there, done that (in a small way - well, and a big way since I grew up on a small farm). For us, it's just too much of a battle with the deer, critters and bugs. But I still miss it a little.

-ERD50
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Old 05-27-2014, 09:05 PM   #93
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I grow cilantro from seed (directly in garden - not in seed pots) and plant seeds every 3-weeks starting in very early Spring through early Summer and again in late Summer (I'm zone 7). Yes, the plants bolt in heat, but the newer plants get me a few more weeks of fresh Cilantro before bolting. I let them go to seed and often in early Fall I get some self starters and also get self starters the following Spring. Cilantro - my favorite herb!

Also, when I thin out Cilantro plants too close to each other, I use the roots in soups - yum!
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Old 05-27-2014, 09:10 PM   #94
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Have you ever bit into a green growing coriander seed? It's quite nice. I used to make a paste, very unusual taste, we loved them.
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I have never thought of tasting green seeds. But I will be sure to try that in the next growing season.

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...Even though fresh herbs are at relatively high prices in the store, we aren't using enough to make it a blip in the budget either way. But I really do get a lot of enjoyment from the herbs, just being to go out in the 3-season room and pluck some fresh herbs in the dead of winter brightens the day a bit. It's really worth it for me, for the very little bit of effort it takes...
Another plant we grow a lot of is shallot. The bulbs multiply when given good fertile soil, and their green stalks are milder and better than green onions, kind of like chives. It's very easy to grow.
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Old 05-27-2014, 10:00 PM   #95
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Ditto on growing cilantro in the cool weather. I plant mine in September and grow it all winter. It bolts in the spring when the weather warms. I wash and chop it and freeze in a ziplock to use in the warm weather.

I usually juice my lemons and limes and freeze the juice in ice cube trays. I might try freezing them whole though, it sounds easier.
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Old 05-27-2014, 10:20 PM   #96
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But can 6 months of more work make that much difference? Or is it going to be OMY, then another OMY, and OMY, till you are no longer talking about ER, but just R?
Well, perhaps it would only be OM1/2Y, then another OM1/2Y, and OM1/2Y...
(Sorry, but I don't know how to make "1/2" in a small size). But, since I had something exceedingly important to express, I figured I just better say it. It might help, while looking at the large "1/2", if we all pretend that I'm an esteemed college professor who talks with an accent. It's something I often pretend--but, then campus security usually shows up pretty quickly...
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Old 05-27-2014, 11:23 PM   #97
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Is this what you intended: OM1/2Y, then another OM1/2Y, and OM1/2Y?

I guess then the OP will not reach ER, but ER? Hmm... I like that new symbol, as it would confuse the hell out of newcomers. But how do I even define that, if we have struggled to define ER itself?

Some people say that they know ER when they see it. Others say they know ER because they are doing it. See a recent thread that also discusses cat food, pet antibiotics, etc..., besides the definition of "ER".

Back on OM1/2Y, being an agnostic in everything, I do not claim to know anything, but like to raise questions anyway I can. It's nothing personal. I caused a lot of trouble in school. They let me graduate so I got out of their hair.
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Old 05-28-2014, 04:51 AM   #98
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The largest ROI I have ever seen is the proper use o birth control. I know numerous individuals who have given no thought to birth control before and/or after marriage. Even those with moderate incomes end up poor because they had four or five children instead of two. OTOH, some of the most well to do professional couples have made the decision to have one, two or no children. At last look, the cost of raising a child to 18 is in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Not disputing the perceived satisfaction of having or not having children, just saying that there are controllable costs.
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Old 05-28-2014, 08:11 AM   #99
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The largest ROI I have ever seen is the proper use o birth control. I know numerous individuals who have given no thought to birth control before and/or after marriage. Even those with moderate incomes end up poor because they had four or five children instead of two. OTOH, some of the most well to do professional couples have made the decision to have one, two or no children. At last look, the cost of raising a child to 18 is in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Not disputing the perceived satisfaction of having or not having children, just saying that there are controllable costs.
Not only does not having children save you money, it also saves you "long term money" by eliminating the possibility of having grandchildren to spend money on!
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Old 05-28-2014, 08:31 AM   #100
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The largest ROI I have ever seen is the proper use of birth control. I know numerous individuals who have given no thought to birth control before and/or after marriage. Even those with moderate incomes end up poor because they had four or five children instead of two.
Yes, this is huge. I come from a family of 5 children but it was a simpler time. No vacations involving plane flights or cruises, rarely went out to dinner, no fast food, Mom made many of our clothes and my sister and I made our own when we were old enough. (My sister is now an obstetrician, but was encouraged during Med school to become a surgeon because she was so good with the needle and suture! ) Parents, in early 80s, are still doing well, but they've always been savers and Dad is good at investing.

I had only DS; would have liked another but it didn't happen. I also didn't have him till after I got my actuarial credentials (which involved 10 exams over many years and a huge amount of personal time studying.) In retrospect, it was for the best. When he needed an alternative to the public school, I funded 4 years at NY Military Academy and it was a miracle. I got him through a good private university with zero student loan debt. My Ex pretty much abandoned his responsibilities as a father and 7 years after the divorce I married a man of very modest means, but who was/is a good husband and a spectacular stepfather. If I'd had 3 or 4 kids I'd be in a very different place now.
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