Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 12:55 AM   #21
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 195
Re: Switching Social Security

jdw:

Thanks, for the appropriate correction!
__________________

__________________
Sundance Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 01:32 AM   #22
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
lazygood4nothinbum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,895
Re: Switching Social Security

i'm a bleeding heart liberal who is fully for safety nets (& getting my own ss contributions back). however, legit or not, i wouldn't do it as a matter of character. and if karma comes into play at all, i would find empathy hard to muster when that little loophole closes around someone's neck as they attempt a leap through.
__________________

__________________
"off with their heads"~~dr. joseph-ignace guillotin

"life should begin with age and its privileges and accumulations, and end with youth and its capacity to splendidly enjoy such advantages."~~mark twain - letter to edward kimmitt 1901
lazygood4nothinbum is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 04:46 AM   #23
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,408
Re: Switching Social Security

you can do it...my father had to go into a nursing home and had next to no assets except for his pension and social security...he was 20.00 a month over the limit in florida at the time to qualify for medicaid....my step mom called social security and said dont send anymore checks.........they said they couldnt do that unless he changed his plan with them by paying everything back that he got so far
__________________
mathjak107 is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 08:15 AM   #24
Moderator Emeritus
Martha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,212
Re: Switching Social Security

I'll be darned. Another benefit for the rich. Interest free loans from the SSA.
__________________
.


No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA

Martha is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 09:59 AM   #25
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,083
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martha
I'll be darned. Another benefit for the rich. Interest free loans from the SSA.
[/quot

Maybe not. As I asked previously, if you were that rich you might be taxed on part of your payments. If you decided to repay 8 years of SSA payments, how would you amended the oldest 5 years?

Greedy and curious (retired taxpayer) minds want to know.
__________________
I look to the present moment because that's where I live my life.
MJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 10:40 AM   #26
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
tryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,449
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
you might be taxed on part of your payments
Interesting point ... the taxes would probably be more damaging than the interest earned (assuming you invested conservatively).
__________________
FIRE'd since 2005
tryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 12:18 PM   #27
Moderator Emeritus
Martha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,212
Re: Switching Social Security

Oh yeah, taxes.

So you do it for three years only and amend your return when you pay it back. If you can amend.

__________________
.


No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA

Martha is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 12:40 PM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
mickeyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: South Texas~29N/98W
Posts: 5,880
Re: Switching Social Security

You can indeed do this but you need to be able to repay SS with the necessary funds and then wait until they recalculate your SS benefit with an age 65/66/68. If you can be assureed that you will not spend the money in the meantime it may be worth your time and effort but it also give SS a chance to screw up your account with all of the machinations.
__________________
Part-Owner of Texas

Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read. Groucho Marx

In dire need of: faster horses, younger woman, older whiskey, more money.
mickeyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 01:03 PM   #29
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 403
Re: Switching Social Security

I'm confused, if you are in a 20%+ tax bracket, and want to repay SS, do you have to repay exactly what they sent you or do you only repay what you took home after taxes?
__________________
macdaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 01:12 PM   #30
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,083
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by macdaddy
I'm confused, if you are in a 20%+ tax bracket, and want to repay SS, do you have to repay exactly what they sent you or do you only repay what you took home after taxes?
Good question. My guess would be that SSA wouldn't care about your past tax obligations and would want the exact amount they gave you over the years.
__________________
I look to the present moment because that's where I live my life.
MJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 01:55 PM   #31
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
REWahoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas Hill Country
Posts: 42,078
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundance Kid
Cuz, darlin,---I'm not the one that raised the question.

I tried to help a guy out, by answering his question. You don't wanna believe,
then it's on you. You don't have time to make a phone call; then don't ask me to do it for you.

Hope ya'll have a good day!
Just a minute, Kid. I need to remove your zinger from my a$$ before I can continue.
The reason for my response asking why you didn't call the SS was your three posts stating:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundance Kid
Yeah, you can do that! Just call your SS office.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundance Kid
I'd just call your local SS office and in your own "I wanna but a pair of shoes voice," just ask them, how to do this?

Check out : www.ssa.gov, or call them on their 1-800 number They'll answer your question, in a heartbeat.

Get back with us and let us know what you found out!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundance Kid
Just call The Social Security Administration! They have an 800 number. Just ask
the question.
It appeared to me that you were "sure" this could be done but wanted someone else to call and find out for you, especially after your second post above. If I misinterpreted, my apology.

Thank you and thank jdw_fire for the reference to the SS handbook. After reading the applicable section, I still have difficulty believing SS routinely approves these requests unless there are extenuating circumstances (like the example mathjak107 gave about his dad). But what the heck, it's our gummit at work here and that means logic and common sense probably do not apply.

PS: Kid, I didn't reazile we were related. Are we cuzzins on your momma or your daddy's side? Sounds like you're from the southern part of Kansas, am I right darlin?

__________________
Numbers is hard

When I hit 70, it hit back

Retired in 2005 at age 58, no pension
REWahoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 01:59 PM   #32
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 403
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by vagabond
Good question. My guess would be that SSA wouldn't care about your past tax obligations and would want the exact amount they gave you over the years.
That sucks, so only those in a low bracket, who probably need to spend the cash anyway, can really benefit from this trick.
__________________
macdaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 06:30 PM   #33
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 195
Re: Switching Social Security

REWahoo:

Sorry, If I offended! I couldn't find the info. I was looking for to support my claim.
I figured that, anyone interested could call SSA. I certainly didn't expect or intend
for anyone to do the research for me.

Since weekends aren't a good time to call, (if you expect a live person) guess I'll
call SSA on monday.

Have a Good Day!

Sundance
__________________
Sundance Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-29-2006, 06:35 PM   #34
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Switching Social Security

This is mind-blowing. *Someone's got to run this through the spreadsheet. *Thinking out loud here...

You start collecting at age 62.
You pay taxes on the SS money you receive.
You receive investment income on the money you receive.
At age 66, you pay it back (around $48,000).
Amended returns: How would that work, Martha, since you did receive the money?
Can the returned money be deducted in the year you pay it?
You start getting bigger benefits.
And you do it all over again at age 70.5.
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 08:50 AM   #35
Moderator Emeritus
Martha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: minnesota
Posts: 13,212
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl
T
Amended returns: How would that work, Martha, since you did receive the money?
I don't know how or if it would work. Maybe Sundance Kid can look it up for us.
__________________
.


No more lawyer stuff, no more political stuff, so no more CYA

Martha is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 08:59 AM   #36
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
tryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,449
Re: Switching Social Security

If taxes can only be refiled going back three years, why not have SS payments adjusted every three years (on the same cycle).

Point being wouldn't SS adjust the payment to credit you for a 3 year delay?
__________________
FIRE'd since 2005
tryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 09:37 AM   #37
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
maddythebeagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,450
Re: Switching Social Security

Some states also tax some portion of social security so Sundance Kid can also look up that why he is at it
__________________
- Hurry! to the cliffs of insanity!
maddythebeagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 11:00 AM   #38
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Re: Switching Social Security

More thoughts:
- The tax issue would be a PITA. Of course, if this becomes a popular tactic, someone wil publish a "how-to" article. Heck, maybe there'll be a separate sub-section of the TurboTax/TaxCut interview process for it.

On the "morality" of it:
-- I don't think it's "wrong" for several reasons:
--- The rules are written this way, maybe even for a good reason. Anyway, I'm past the point of trying to figure out why various tax breaks/advantages are built into the system. I disagree with "gummint" tryng to encourage various behaviors through the tax code, but that doesn't mean I don't take the breaks that are offered.
--- SSA took huge amounts of money from my pay long before t was needed for payouts. Okay-that's the way the system was designed. I'm not opposed to getting the $$ back and putting it to use as soo as I can legally do it.
--- If I wait until full retirement age to draw SSA and die one month short, I'd have received zero payback for the $$ I contributed (though my spouse will still get a check based on my work history). By taking the $$ earlier, help insure against this--the $$ will be there in the savings pot and she can use it without paying it back (and take the lower payout over time, if that's what she'd like to do).
--- SSA is headed for trouble based on dollars in vs dolars out. We all recognize that the earlier this is addressed, the less drastic the fix will need to be . Based on what we've seen to date, there's no political desire to "fix" te problem until it becomes a crisis. If everyone takes payouts sooner, the crisis arrives sooner and the fix will be less draconian. Then, when we pay the $$ back, we are contributing to the solution.
--- Also, if a lot of folks did this, there might even be some pressure to keep the promises made to middle-income/higher income workers. If the payouts become means-tested or otherwise reduced for folks who paid in more, folks who are saving up/repaying every few years will do the math and decide to keep the money they've saved, since the reduced rate monthly checks won't be worth trading in the lump sum. This creates an incentive not to "soak the rich" (i.e. everyone above the poverty line/everyone who saved for retirement) by cutting their already disproportionately small SSA checks.
Some people would consider this good, some would not.
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 11:32 AM   #39
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,083
Re: Switching Social Security

I suspect that if this is doable, that most people wouldn't do it because,
1) they don't have the funds to return, to reset the clock
2) they have the funds but wouldn't want to deal with the complications (taxes etc.)
3) they have the funds but don't even need the SS payments they are already receiving
__________________
I look to the present moment because that's where I live my life.
MJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: Switching Social Security
Old 04-30-2006, 11:41 AM   #40
Moderator Emeritus
Nords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,616
Re: Switching Social Security

Quote:
Originally Posted by vagabond
I suspect that if this is doable, that most people wouldn't do it because,
1) they don't have the funds to return, to reset the clock
2) they have the funds but wouldn't want to deal with the complications (taxes etc.)
3) they have the funds but don't even need the SS payments they are already receiving
4) they're too busy surfing or otherwise living their lives...
__________________

__________________
*
*

The book written on E-R.org, "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement", on sale now! For more info see "About Me" in my profile.
I don't spend much time here anymore, so please send me a PM. Thanks.
Nords is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
social security


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Former Military Social Security credits - interesting Fireup2020 FIRE and Money 1 04-10-2007 10:24 PM
Maximizing Social Security Benefits eyenitnoy FIRE and Money 20 06-18-2006 09:29 PM
A Solution to Social Security wabmester Other topics 5 02-19-2006 12:34 PM
When do Social Security payments start? Retiredtwice Other topics 3 11-18-2005 11:29 AM
Social Security will last longer ...maybe mickeyd FIRE and Money 7 06-28-2004 07:55 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:11 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.