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Old 07-21-2018, 04:39 PM   #1
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Hey, gang..quick update. As some of you probably read, current job is absolutely intolerable/impossible, and it's high past time to go. Problem is, I've been at this for 30+ years and I simply don't have the desire - or the drive - to try to just switch companies yet AGAIN, because I've learned through painful experience that they pretty much all suck. Just in different ways, and rarely something you can predict during the interview cycle.

So, I'm done. Just south of 55.

Been waiting on an upcoming stock vest in mid August before putting in my notice, but the day to day has gotten beyond brutal. It's so bad that everyone on my team (about 10 of us) basically all decided together to respond to the "employee survey" that just came out with super low scores (basically 1 out of 5 where 5 is good and 1 is abysmal) on both our Director and our company. Basically, we all agreed that we were going to respond and speak the truth vs. holding anything at all back. Should be major fireworks when they read the responses. Who knows if anything will change..I doubt it, but we tried..

It will probably do absolutely no good, but felt good to be 'brutally honest' (but professional) in my responses. HOPEFULLY, that's anonymous as it's all administered by one of these 3rd party companies, but even if not - what we all said needed to be said.

The thing I'm struggling with is the decision to leave. I have a plan that pays the bills so suppose I am "FI". But still..the W-2 income is nice. The benefits (especially HC that is among the best I've ever had) are nice and very good. The stock is VERY nice. But all that niceness is obliterated by an incredibly dysfunctional, Machiavellian hell hole that would make an astounding Harvard Case Study in what NOT to do in running your company. (Just as an example, one of the employee survey questions was.."Our company has a good culture" or something to that effect and I answered "No. This is the most political, Machiavellian company I've ever worked for, and everyone on our team is looking to leave at the earliest possible opportunity" (or something like that). Does that sound jaded? It's true.

I think about ER and all that I can do. How much I can enjoy my free time and hobbies.

And am completely miserable and stressed out of my freaking mind.

Basically, I don't WANT to quit. But I HAVE to quit. It's just not even remotely reasonable to stay. I'm also walking away from heavy six figure stock vests to do so, but the money doesn't do me any good dead.

Anyone ever been in this situation? If so..how did you deal with it?

TIA..
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Old 07-21-2018, 04:42 PM   #2
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Why not wait until August when the stock vests and then say goodbye?
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Old 07-21-2018, 04:45 PM   #3
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Why not wait until August when the stock vests and then say goodbye?

That's exactly the plan. It's just super hard to bail.

I've worked REALLY hard to get to this point in my career. Just because I work for a dysfunctional company doesn't mean it should end. But I've interviewed for many companies over the years and they (as mentioned in the last post) pretty much all suck. Finding one that's decent? That's like finding a purple unicorn.

Add in the fact that I vest quarterly on my RSUs and there's years to go to get them all. Golden Handcuffs, anyone?

I probably WILL bail after the next vest, but it is REALLY hard to do so just south of 55. That was kinda the whole point. I don't WANT to be done, but I HAVE to be done. Make sense?
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Old 07-21-2018, 04:49 PM   #4
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When I retired I gave a long term notice (six months I think) because it was going to take some doing to replace me and I was on good terms with everyone. But one thing I did notice was that simply having the retirement decision made and the date written down made a lot of the stress go away.

So as a temporary measure you can make the decision to retire in August and see if the stress drops to a tolerable level by simply making the decision. If not then go back to "Plan A" and bail ASAP.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:14 PM   #5
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I would take a week or two vacation before making such a big decision.


Are you sure you don't want to delay your decision for 3 months to see if there are any management changes based on the survey results?



If you have a 401k with this company, it's a good idea to review the Summary Plan Description (SPD) to see if your plan allows you take penalty free withdrawals if you separate from your employer in the year you turn 55 or later.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:28 PM   #6
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You know what you're running from. Do you know what you're running to? This takes as much planning as choosing a job or a spouse or a home - all at the same time.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:56 PM   #7
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You know what you're running from. Do you know what you're running to? This takes as much planning as choosing a job or a spouse or a home - all at the same time.

+1. You mentioned that you've given some to how you would enjoy more free time and hobbies, but I don't get the impression that you've really thought the decision to retire through very thoroughly. I get it that your job is intolerable - but the fact that you say you really don't WANT to retire makes me wonder if you are really 100% ready for retirement. I guess my only advice is to slow down a bit and think this decision through, and especially think about what you will do with the rest of your life once you are retired. In my case, I dreamed about the day I could retire (and planned for it) for years before it happened, so it's a bit hard for me to relate to your situation, which seems to be a little rushed and impulsive.
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Old 07-21-2018, 07:43 PM   #8
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Have you spoke to your boss about going part time or maybe a day at your home office? They don’t have to know you are going to snag your RSUs and bail.

With regard to the survey its likely that it won’t make a bit of difference if the company is making its numbers thats really all that matters. Particularly if they are publicly traded.

No.......I’m not jaded
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Old 07-21-2018, 08:06 PM   #9
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mid-Aug is 20 work days away. Take 2 weeks vacation, and a week off sick. Or maybe two off sick. Then you have to push thru 5 days or less for the 6-figure vest. Have a mental breakdown, and take a month of re-hab. Declare a substance problem and go for re-hab for a month. Other than that, if it really bothers you, walk away. Eventually, you will walk away from a big paycheck, or HC, or some other item.
Life is short my friend. Money isn't everything. When I was tasked with a similar situation to the one you are in, I left. Lots of money was left on the table in stock options and bonus. But, that extra money (north of 6 figures) was not enough to radically or measurably change my standard of living. So, I left it. No, it did not feel good to leave it. After all, that was part of why I put up with the BS for as long as I did.
Four years later, I wouldn't change my action. And, I wouldn't sell my time away from the BS for the money left behind. It seems like a great deal of money, but time is all you really have. And at 55 years old, your "good years" are limited.
Take off and have fun.
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Old 07-21-2018, 08:23 PM   #10
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+1. You mentioned that you've given some to how you would enjoy more free time and hobbies, but I don't get the impression that you've really thought the decision to retire through very thoroughly. I get it that your job is intolerable - but the fact that you say you really don't WANT to retire makes me wonder if you are really 100% ready for retirement. I guess my only advice is to slow down a bit and think this decision through, and especially think about what you will do with the rest of your life once you are retired. In my case, I dreamed about the day I could retire (and planned for it) for years before it happened, so it's a bit hard for me to relate to your situation, which seems to be a little rushed and impulsive.
You make some excellent points here. I definitely “ran away” from my job. I left a modest amount of RSUs on the table. Also, I am a similar age to you.

I was not emotionally prepared for retirement. I would have much rather stayed a few more years to let my investments grow more. It just wasn’t in the cards for me though. The job was beginning to effect my health and I was miserable. I was spending a lot of time in doctors offices.

Now that I am gone I am doing better in the absence of a toxic workplace. Health is showing an improvement. So, I am feeling better but I have no darned idea what I am going to do with my life now. The job WAS my identity for so many years. I worked 60 ish hours a week for many,many years and I really only picked up 2 hobbies. I must admit, I’m a bit lost. I will find my way out of the rabbit hole but it’s going to take time.

Also, make sure you put a entertainment / hobby line in your budget. I screwed up on that one. Some of the hobbies I want to try are a bit expensive and that has presented its own set of challenges.
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Old 07-21-2018, 08:46 PM   #11
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I expect retirement works out best if you're not simply escaping an intolerable situation, but moving toward a life that you want. Why not take that long vacation, maybe quit the job, and take some time off to think about things?

You can work part-time, find a completely different, lower-pressure career, or retire. You don't feel ready for retirement, but for the sake of you health and longevity, you need to get away from this toxic environment. It's not a black and white choice between one or the other. With a little time away, your thinking will be less frantic and more flexible. The blog retirementmanifesto.com (as well as others, I'm sure) has some focus on the social/emotional side of retirement. It's important to spend some time thinking about what you want in the rest of your life.
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Old 07-21-2018, 09:03 PM   #12
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I think is sad that people here won’t name and shame the companies.
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Old 07-22-2018, 05:22 AM   #13
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Thanks for the replies..I actually DO have some idea of what I want to do in RE, and that's spend some time studying how to be a fee-only CFP.

My biggest fear is that I'm getting a bit old to tackle something like this. If I start today, I finish 58-59'ish (due to the 3 years relevant work experience needed) and "hanging my shingle" to go into business with my own Financial Services company for retirement planning is tougher than if I did that in my 30s or 40s.

Anyway..I have many interests beyond this (mountain biking, rollerblading, cooking, camping) and am sure I will fill my days with other things. It's just that work has defined who I AM for so long that it's essentially going to change a big part of that. I also truly just don't want to give up the good W-2 income and HC, either, but at some point I guess we all get to that point where we shift from paychecks to living off our plans..
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Old 07-22-2018, 05:33 AM   #14
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I think is sad that people here wont name and shame the companies.

Megacorps have code of conduct and one signs their life away on this implied contract.


Part of that includes not naming Megacorp.


So, please, don't shame us for living up to our employment contract.
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Old 07-22-2018, 05:43 AM   #15
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Here's another vote to take a few weeks vacation and re-evaluate.... I was in a somewhat similar situation.


Time to change my username.....
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Old 07-22-2018, 05:51 AM   #16
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Here's another vote to take a few weeks vacation and re-evaluate.... I was in a somewhat similar situation.

Time to change my username.....
Good advice, but this has been a long time (year plus) in the making - and I did just take a week off around July 4th. That's part of what gave me additional clarity that I do indeed need to bail. My health was better that week..stress was WAY lower. My wife said she finally recognized the man she married, not the miserable person I'd become in recent years. We went for hikes..went mountain biking. Cooked some nice dinners. Just plain RELAXED. We haven't done that in years.

Did not want to go back to w*rk after that, and the month and half from July 4th to bailing seemed/seems like a freaking ETERNITY. Longest month and a half of my life so far, and it feels like one of those dreams where you're in a long hallway running and the hallway keeps getting longer and longer like you're essentially running in place - or even going backwards. Yep..it's been just like that..

If it wasn't for the (not overly large but still enough to pay a few house repair bills we've been putting off) RSU vest coming up mid Aug, I would have submitted my notice right after that week..it was that obvious that it was and is the right thing to do at this point for all the reasons mentioned..
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Old 07-22-2018, 05:59 AM   #17
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It wouldn't hurt to take some time off as others have said. Think things through a little more. But odds are not many changes will be made if any by your company. So I wouldn't get my hopes up.

I highly recommed retirement. But the transition is difficult for some. A part time gig a possibility? That works for many.
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Old 07-22-2018, 06:20 AM   #18
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Act for the next 30 days like you have already given notice and no longer care. Come in late (or, not early). Leave at 5. Stop answering emails after 5. If you read this and say "oh I can't because they...." then you are kidding yourself. You could get hit by a bus tomorrow and everything would be normal in a week at your MC.

But I have a (sad) feeling you won't pull the plug in August. Why? You've been more than ready to do so but there's always some other reason to go a little longer.

You've written various versions of this post, your readiness, stress, and the carrot or obligation just barely in front of you, several times over the past year. Work has been described much the same way "killing you" and "extremely stressful" in every thread. You might want to go back and re-read them, and then decide how many times you want to keep living this back-and-forth-decision in your head.

When you vest in Mid-Aug you should have your two week notice ready, at most, and be done. And spend the next 4 weeks acting like someone who just does not care.
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Old 07-22-2018, 06:31 AM   #19
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What’s your net worth? In what is your money invested? Annual salary? How much money is not yet vested at work? Is your wife still working?
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Old 07-22-2018, 07:18 AM   #20
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mid-Aug is 20 work days away. .....
What happens to your RSU's if you submit your resignation effective August 31st? (in five weeks). If your RSU's still crystalize then submit your resignation... perhaps that and the survey results will shake the tree some. Obviously, if submitting your resignation now queers your RSU's then wait.

Either way, life is to short to stay in a stressful job that you despise.
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