Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-19-2008, 08:26 PM   #21
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Goonie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-Central Illinois
Posts: 3,198
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinanceDude View Post
How those guys made it to the CEO desks I have no idea.
The janitorial jobs were already filled.
__________________

__________________
Goonie is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 11-19-2008, 08:32 PM   #22
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
lazygood4nothinbum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,895
how insulting to the 3 stooges

__________________

__________________
"off with their heads"~~dr. joseph-ignace guillotin

"life should begin with age and its privileges and accumulations, and end with youth and its capacity to splendidly enjoy such advantages."~~mark twain - letter to edward kimmitt 1901
lazygood4nothinbum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2008, 08:49 PM   #23
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 678
Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl View Post
Even if it were justifiable (do you want the CEO to waste time sitting around in the airport, or working on the problem?)
If they want $25 Billion of my tax money because they claim to be in financial trouble, they should not be flying around in 36 million dollar private jets. (Each of them flew in a separate jet)
__________________
JustCurious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2008, 09:40 PM   #24
Recycles dryer sheets
nphx's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 285
I tuned in to cnbc for parts of that sitcom today. Puhleeeze .. didn't they defend $75 /hr salary and entitlements by saying new workers were coming in at less? So people making 15 an hour and losing SS in coming years are supposed to secure those bad deals? No way. No way. No way. And STOP disparaging the stooges, when they screwed up a job they went on to another line of work at entry level instead of looking for a bailout.
__________________
nphx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2008, 10:40 PM   #25
Moderator Emeritus
Bestwifeever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,372
Quote:
Originally Posted by TromboneAl View Post
That CEOs flew private jets to ask for bailout article is the nail in their coffin. It is deliciously ironic.*

Even if it were justifiable (do you want the CEO to waste time sitting around in the airport, or working on the problem?) it just doesn't look right. It will make it hard to justify the bailout to main street.

*That same phrase (deliciously ironic) is in the article. I thought I came up with that, but I must have read it.
T-Al, you should start a restaurant called Delicious Irony....
__________________
Bestwifeever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2008, 10:51 PM   #26
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
haha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hooverville
Posts: 22,380
Quote:
Originally Posted by saluki9 View Post
Worse than their performance, how about the guys doing the grilling? Isn't that more funny? Remember these are the folks that gather their revenue at gunpoint, I guess that makes it easier to criticize real businesspeople.
I was thinking the same thing. No matter how bad the business people at Congressional hearings are, the congress people are bound to be infinitely more useless.

Also, it's all a charade, very similar to pro wrestling. I can just see them before the cameras start rolling, "Hey Alan and Rick, we're gonna put you guys into a headlock followed by a body slam, but hey, don't forget, it's all for the stupid voters. We really do love you guys!

By the way, can I borrow your jet for a junket to Paris over the Holidays? My girlfriend needs a little loving in a foreign locale or she will ditch me.

Great!! I knew you guys could help a buddy."
__________________
"As a general rule, the more dangerous or inappropriate a conversation, the more interesting it is."-Scott Adams
haha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 04:28 AM   #27
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,072
Quote:
Originally Posted by haha View Post
I was thinking the same thing. No matter how bad the business people at Congressional hearings are, the congress people are bound to be infinitely more useless.

Also, it's all a charade, very similar to pro wrestling. I can just see them before the cameras start rolling, "Hey Alan and Rick, we're gonna put you guys into a headlock followed by a body slam, but hey, don't forget, it's all for the stupid voters. We really do love you guys!

By the way, can I borrow your jet for a junket to Paris over the Holidays? My girlfriend needs a little loving in a foreign locale or she will ditch me.

Great!! I knew you guys could help a buddy."
Yup... We will see how hard line the congress is if they do the bail out.

IMO - Wagoner should be fired along with most GM division heads (no golden parachute or bonus.
__________________
chinaco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 04:57 AM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
clifp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,450
My former company not only didn't have corporate jets, but nobody flew first class, and everybody worked in cubicles. When bad times came the first people to get hit with bonus and paycuts was senior management. Wall St types were certainly greedy, but the Big 3 are greedy and stupid and that combo is just unforgivable.

My favorite line about the bailout, came from woman who grew up in Cleveland and moved to Hawaii about 10 years ago.

"This is God's way of telling people to leave Detroit before winter"
__________________
clifp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 06:47 AM   #29
Dryer sheet aficionado
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 25
My husband, a pilot, was aghast when he way their planes (jets). He couldn't believe that they are still flying around that way when their companies are drowning. And the one CEOs response when asked about it, like he just couldn't see what was wrong with that. They make me sick.
No bailout! Read my lips, No Bailout!!
__________________
catdance62 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 08:46 AM   #30
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
FinanceDude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,484
Quote:
Originally Posted by nphx View Post
I tuned in to cnbc for parts of that sitcom today. Puhleeeze .. didn't they defend $75 /hr salary and entitlements by saying new workers were coming in at less? So people making 15 an hour and losing SS in coming years are supposed to secure those bad deals? No way. No way. No way. And STOP disparaging the stooges, when they screwed up a job they went on to another line of work at entry level instead of looking for a bailout.
I wish just ONE of the Senators would have said: "OH, WISE GUY HUH"
__________________
Consult with your own advisor or representative. My thoughts should not be construed as investment advice. Past performance is no guarantee of future results (love that one).......:)


This Thread is USELESS without pics.........:)
FinanceDude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 08:48 AM   #31
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,543
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustCurious View Post
If they want $25 Billion of my tax money because they claim to be in financial trouble, they should not be flying around in 36 million dollar private jets. (Each of them flew in a separate jet)
for them it's probably cheaper to buy a company jet than to always buy airline tickets. the jet is probably used by a lot of management and business class open ended tickets are very expensive
__________________
al_bundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 09:44 AM   #32
Moderator Emeritus
Bestwifeever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 16,372
They should have each driven their companies' cheapest, best gas mileage car in a caravan--it's 524 miles from Detroit to DC, or just under 9 hours per Googlemaps so they could make it in a day and three tanks of gas round trip per car--to show their support of their products.
__________________
Bestwifeever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 09:58 AM   #33
Full time employment: Posting here.
sailor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Atlanta suburbs
Posts: 881
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
for them it's probably cheaper to buy a company jet than to always buy airline tickets. the jet is probably used by a lot of management and business class open ended tickets are very expensive
No Al, it's definitely more expensive to buy a company jet than to buy business (or even first for that matter) open ended tickets. For some people/companies the ratio is worse than 100:1
__________________
sailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 12:00 PM   #34
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 417
Would have loved to see them get the bailout--since I live in the center of Indiana and know what devastation a BK will bring. But those 3 idiots really screwed the pooch!
__________________
Payin-the-Toll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 12:03 PM   #35
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
saluki9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,032
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
for them it's probably cheaper to buy a company jet than to always buy airline tickets. the jet is probably used by a lot of management and business class open ended tickets are very expensive
You do realize that a full size get like a GIV, GV, Global Express, etc can run upwards of $6,000 an hour to run, plus landing fees and other costs.

That doesn't include the 15-45M up front lease payments they pay to lease the jets.

First class is cheaper by a factor of 10 at least.
__________________
saluki9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 12:14 PM   #36
Full time employment: Posting here.
Frugality_of_Apathy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 622
Sure they could buy out the entire first class cabin and save money. But is it even worth answering the congressional subpoena if you can't play air-hockey on the way there?

They'd probably rather take the prison time then have to travel with sub-billionaires.
__________________
Frugality_of_Apathy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 01:00 PM   #37
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,543
when you factor in all the people the jet flies compared to regular business class tickets it's at least break even. and you can have a private meeting on a company jet unlike an airport

the jet just made it stand out they came to beg for money with no plan on how they will use it and no plan to cut costs. i'm all for the middle class but when a company the size of GM is about to go bankrupt because they are paying close to $100,000 per person in pensions plus medical benefits most people would kill for and they have a union contract with more fat than a whale there is something wrong
__________________
al_bundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 01:08 PM   #38
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,614
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
when you factor in all the people the jet flies compared to regular business class tickets it's at least break even. and you can have a private meeting on a company jet unlike an airport
There is no way it is a "break even" from a $$ spent standpoint. Maybe it is possible to justify the expense of the use of a corporate jet on the basis of utility (it keeps these high-power guys at work rather than sitting in an airport, they can work ont he airplane, etc). There'd be a stronger case if there was evidence that their amazing management abilities were resulting in big improvements. Regardless--flying in style to this hearing with tin cup in hand demonstrates a tone-deafness that does no inspire confidence. Maybe they stopped by the AIG executive spa/retreat on the way back to decompress as well.
__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 01:12 PM   #39
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
REWahoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Texas Hill Country
Posts: 42,065
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
when you factor in all the people the jet flies compared to regular business class tickets it's at least break even.
Not even close.

Company owned aircraft cannot be justified on a cost basis, not by any stretch of the imagination. They serve as status and convenience perks for the top brass, nothing more.
__________________
Numbers is hard

When I hit 70, it hit back

Retired in 2005 at age 58, no pension
REWahoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2008, 01:13 PM   #40
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
saluki9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,032
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post
when you factor in all the people the jet flies compared to regular business class tickets it's at least break even. and you can have a private meeting on a company jet unlike an airport

Are you actually being serious? Do you think that the other big 3 execs just happened to have meetings in DC that day?

Even if you ignore the opportunity costs of the tens of millions up front, and throw out the $15 - $40K a month in storage, maintenance, and piloting costs it still does not even come close to break even. Having a plane is about luxury, you can't make the numbers work out even if you try.

I have seen it come close once. We had a client who had to take 6 corporate attorneys to St. Louis for a deposition. They managed to find a jet operated by a local business that was idle for the day. It actually was cheaper for the client to pay for 3 hours of time at $3500 an hour than to buy 6 business class tickets at the last minute and pay the lawyers to wait at the airport. That's the only one I've ever seen. Having your own plane NEVER makes sense from a $$$ perspective.
__________________

__________________
saluki9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
CSI - Committee for Skeptical Inquiry dex Other topics 6 04-29-2008 09:27 AM
Senate Economic Stimulus Plan Helena FIRE and Money 6 01-31-2008 06:19 PM
Craig Vows to Stay in Senate Wags Other topics 37 10-08-2007 04:08 PM
Senate Armed Services Committee hooks up the flag officers Nords Other topics 2 10-18-2006 07:47 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:22 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.