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Old 04-10-2009, 08:25 PM   #21
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We keep some MRE's and extra food around mostly as a precaution against natural disasters. I suppose that if we were without food and power for an extended period I would break out the stash of brewing grains (have at least 150# in the basement at the moment) and start grinding them up for flour/subsistence. But a longer term breakdown of society is probably something you simply cannot hedge against.

As for peak oil, I find it hard to believe that it will materialize as a major issue. Why? Hmmm, every time I turn around Petrobras or someone else stumbles across a gargantuan new mess of oil, usually somewhere expensive to get to. We will simply see an increase in the cost of oil over time that will probably track the marginal cost of production moving up as new sources of oil have to be extracted from less handy places. At some point in the process, oil will be costly enough that all sorts of alternatives will become relatively attractive. I already get all my power from small hydro and wind sources. It costs me an extra whopping $10 a month. If that is the upshot of peak oil - ho hum.

For OP: switch your reading. If you feel compelled to stay on your current subject, try "Go-Go Girls of the Apocalypse" instead.
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Old 04-10-2009, 11:48 PM   #22
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I have been reading the book The Long Emergency
Don't believe everything you read.
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Old 04-11-2009, 12:36 AM   #23
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Indeed, I should probably change the type of books I read. Another book that thoroughly depressed me recently was "Hot, Flat, and Crowded" by Thomas Friedman. Instead of being inspired to take action, I just feel hopeless about the future.
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:18 AM   #24
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This is one advantage of living in a self-contained home on wheels. As long as we keep the fuel tank and freshwater tank topped off we are good for a while, we usually have plenty of food in the motorhome, and the fridge runs off propane, and we can leave an area if that is required.

The one thing we don't have lying around is gold. We don't even keep that much cash around. Maybe we should store a few hundred dollars in our fire safe in case credit cards suddenly stopped working. But since we stay out of areas where weather causes AMT machines to shut down we hadn't really figured out the scenario where we might need this.

No guns or ammo either. Really don't know what we would do if things got to the point that you needed weapons. To me that would feel like the world had come to an end.

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Old 04-11-2009, 07:25 AM   #25
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Instead of being inspired to take action, I just feel hopeless about the future.
[don serious hat] You could be a candidate for antidepressants. I suggest consulting an MD. [/remove serious hat]
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Old 04-11-2009, 08:44 AM   #26
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...try "Go-Go Girls of the Apocalypse" instead.
Finally, something actionable!
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Old 04-11-2009, 09:10 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by brewer12345
...try "Go-Go Girls of the Apocalypse" instead.


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Finally, something actionable!
Sounds like it would be a better movie than book...

Ah, there is hope!

Crimespree Cinema: Victor Gischler's GO-GO GIRLS OF THE APOCALYPSE: Author, producer share thoughts on project.

Quote:
Victor Gischler recently announced the sale of the film rights to Go-Go Girls of the Apocalypse to producer Brad Wyman.

Wyman was behind the phenominal Monster with Charlize Theron and Christina Ricci.


-ERD50
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Old 04-11-2009, 10:01 PM   #28
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I'm trying to picture this: I dutifully hoard gold (coins and/or small bars of gold). Then I decide want to buy a fan (with my 20% off coupon) at Bed Bath and Beyond. I want to pay for the fan with some of the gold in my pocket. Then what happens? Can you lead me through this transaction?
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Old 04-12-2009, 08:18 AM   #29
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Strike employee nearest door on head with gold brick, flee store with fan.
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Old 04-12-2009, 10:37 AM   #30
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Key is remember:
1. They are no longer your friends and family, it's just brains they're after
2. Get to someplace high, since it's unusual for them to climb
3. If someone in your party gets bitten don't wait and hope, shoot them in the head
4. Never assume a barricade is strong enough, have enough people for sentry duty
5. Stay away from places where you can be cornered


Don't forget though, it depends on whether they're runners or shufflers. That changes the equation dramatically.
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Old 04-12-2009, 11:46 AM   #31
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Strike employee nearest door on head with gold brick, flee store with fan.
Hilarious rejoinder!

But seriously, under the circumstances for which you might consider hoarding gold, no "regular" stores would be open anyway, and there would be no electricity to operate a fan. There would be a barter & trade system rather than a cash society and any "markets" would be on a street corner selling pilfered goods. "Negotiating" for goods would take on a whole new meaning.

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Old 04-12-2009, 01:05 PM   #32
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In the past, people with portable wealth like gold (well, semi-portable) are often able to flee to an area where things aren't as bad and where the gold is valuable.

In the middle of a riot, I'd rather have a gun.
In the next state/country where things aren't so bad, I'd rather have gold.

"But it's difficult to make predictions, especially about the future."
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Old 04-12-2009, 01:24 PM   #33
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Hmmm - I guess I need to store a vault in my motorhome. I can get to the next state as long as the roads aren't blocked and no-one tries to commandeer the motorhome. Unfortunately, in times of serious civil unrest the latter seems very possible.

If there is some advance warning of impending crisis (like there is with weather), there is plenty of time to get out.

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Old 04-12-2009, 01:36 PM   #34
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Hilarious rejoinder!

But seriously, under the circumstances for which you might consider hoarding gold, no "regular" stores would be open anyway, and there would be no electricity to operate a fan. There would be a barter & trade system rather than a cash society and any "markets" would be on a street corner selling pilfered goods. "Negotiating" for goods would take on a whole new meaning.

Audrey
I think that Audrey hit the hamer on the nail. I concure with her that we will see a lot of bartering. In 2001, I went to Argentina when the sh*t "yet again" hit the fan when the "temporary" president decided to not pay off its debt and created the first largest world debt default. Well, I knew then that I needed to go and start scouting for some property. While there, I can tell you it was "hell"...riots, looting, kidnappings, etc.....the gov. decided to close down the banks and freeze "ALL" deposits...people were desperate...NO CASH anywhere.....people were let go from their jobs...things were desperate. What did people do? They bartered....you could barter pretty much everything. One of my aunts who is a hairdresser bartered her services. In the city center, people gathered with tables signs that read "barter with me"....the people there included, carpenters, psychologists, architects, dentists, bakers, moms who wanted to babysit, etc. It was by far one of the most interesting times of my life....it made me appreciate being able to live in this country.
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Old 04-12-2009, 01:41 PM   #35
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Eek that makes me want to inventory what usable skills I have to barter.

Will develop server software, translate Chinese, or cook really good ribs for what you've got? Sounds like I'd be hurting man.
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Old 04-12-2009, 02:30 PM   #36
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Eek that makes me want to inventory what usable skills I have to barter.

Will develop server software, translate Chinese, or cook really good ribs for what you've got? Sounds like I'd be hurting man.

OK, let me try this bartering thing: I will trade you for your really good cooked ribs for my brand-new-never-even-once-used fan.
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Old 04-12-2009, 03:33 PM   #37
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The fan appears to have blood specks from clerk noggin. No deal.
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breakdown
Old 04-12-2009, 06:57 PM   #38
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breakdown

Went thru 12 days of no power in Jan this year during an icestorm which destroyed the local electrical grid. A few observations.

You can only depend on your friends & family & whatever resources you have or can get. There will be no goverment truck dropping off gasoline, blankets, & a generator at your house. Even, though given the thousands of dollars in taxes you pay each year you might expect this it will not happen.

I had emergency cash in a safe deposit box. The particular bank where I had the box suffered addtional damage and was closed even after the power was returned. Needless to say the money there was of no use to me during the emergency.

Another bank I had money in opened their doors without power each day for 4 hours. $200 withdrawl per person per day. The cheapest generator cost $700. One gas station in town brought in a generator to run the pumps. Gas line waits were 4 hours cash only.

No power means no gas pumps work & no credit card machines. The ice took out the cell phone towers but the old timey dial phones still worked.

My wife worked at a local hospital and was able to bring hot food home every day. That and the fact we luckily had natural gas logs installed in our fireplace were the two most important survival factors for us.

I am presently researching a permanently installed natural gas powered home electrical generator system. I think I would buy one of these and stock up on food before I stashed some gold.
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:06 PM   #39
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I'm stockpiling ammo. I'll just take the gold and food of those who stockpile it and don't have any guns. Trick is finding out who doesn't have any guns...
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Old 04-12-2009, 07:14 PM   #40
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Better add a port-o-potty to the list. Most urban/suburban homes would be susceptible to sewer outages, or worse, backups...
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