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Old 04-30-2008, 05:49 PM   #61
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I hope that's a saying you didn't hear often!

I understand where you're coming from. It's horrible to have to be put through what you want to do, what you're conscience is telling you the right thing to do is, what the real right thing to do really is, and what you think the consequences of each one are.

I lie now and tell everyone I'm broke. Maybe if I keep it up for the next 30 years they'll find easier fish to bait.
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Old 04-30-2008, 10:24 PM   #62
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My parents give financial aid to my brother....even though he is 30 and engaged to be married.
I refuse to associate with them....much less take their money.
As for friends....unless I can afford to give them the cash, I don't get involved in the lending business.
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Old 04-30-2008, 10:29 PM   #63
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I dunno, get a couple partners named Guido and Chip "bust yer knees" McGruff, and you could do well in the lending business. Or should I say the collecting business?
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Old 05-01-2008, 11:17 AM   #64
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FYI and in case some of you aren't aware of this trick: Many sales managers "encourage" their staff to keep up with the Jones' and buy expensive clothing ("You need to impress") and cars and other things that cost a great deal.
When I started out the manager I had told us we needed Cross pens; and I bought one like everyone else, because I was young, inexperienced and stupid (it was Bic all the way after that).
Why? Because they know if you are up to your whazoo in debt, you will HAVE to work harder. Many people get into sales because you work alone, can take days off if you get good enough--although that's not the way top performers do it--and, many times, have a big ego and think you "deserve" the best.
Anyway, it works often, and the dummies go out and spend, spend, spend. It's a game for suckers run by their "helpful" managers, and anyone who really believes that crapola is in for a horrible surprise. But they do...amazing, eh?
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Old 05-01-2008, 11:50 AM   #65
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Actually I think most people live below their means--some people choose to do it real early (and they then have a nice nest egg later), and some people choose to do it later (those who have lived above their means early and have less later). I don't feel that sorry for people who choose the latter. I save that for the people who have been dealt bad hands in life through no choice of their own.
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Old 05-01-2008, 11:51 AM   #66
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Many sales managers "encourage" their staff to keep up with the Jones' and buy expensive clothing ("You need to impress") and cars and other things that cost a great deal.... Why? Because they know if you are up to your whazoo in debt, you will HAVE to work harder.
According to the book Shark Tank, the late, unlamented law firm Finley, Kumble engaged in similar ploys with their associates.
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Old 05-01-2008, 12:04 PM   #67
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According to the book Shark Tank, the late, unlamented law firm Finley, Kumble engaged in similar ploys with their associates.
I never played those games when I was a manager, however, I knew when someone
i) got married
ii) had a new baby
iii) bought a house
iv) bought a new luxury car
v) took yearly big vacations
vi) bragged about 'what they had' a lot
... they would be highly motivated to keep their j*b.
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Old 05-01-2008, 01:57 PM   #68
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Self-inflicted wounds (except for a - good - marriage, which can add to one's net worth and quality of life).
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Old 05-01-2008, 02:27 PM   #69
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Interesting comments. My co-worker (and friend) received lots of financial support from her retired father (even though she was easily making 6 figures). He helped with the down payment on her high-end town home, with her high-end SUV and a couple years later when she upgraded to a much bigger home (as well as a surgery for her dog). He passed away 2 years ago and it turns out that he had taken out home equity loans to give her the money. It turns out that dad didn't have quite the retirement nest egg that the family thought (her mother was not involved in any of the finances). Now her mom continually complains about the money situation and makes her feel guilty.
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Old 05-01-2008, 03:03 PM   #70
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I'm listed as executor of her estate. Some day there's going to be an unpleasant conversation with my siblings. But my approach is to lay out all assets, split it three ways, and move on. No prolonged discussions. Hopefully it works out and if not, well, that'll be a bummer.
Actually, I think you'll find out that as executor of your mom's estate, you'll distribute any assets per her final wishes and not by any approach of your own. Perhaps those will be one in the same. But, if different, her wishes prevail.
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Old 05-01-2008, 03:08 PM   #71
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I used to know plenty of people in the navy who spent their entire paycheques on a combination of booze, cars, clothes and expensive stereos.
Gee Milton, I'm much older than you otherwise I'd think I was one of the folks you knew doing all that spending! Then I went on to break many of your other rules.....kids, house, wife..... the whole catastrophe. Somehow I got to FIRE.

Of course, it took me a long time and you'll probably make it by 35 or 40 yo. We just all have to live our own lives I guess.

Edited to add: Milton...... just re-read your post and I misspoke slightly. I spent big on booze, cars and electronics, but not clothes.
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Old 05-01-2008, 03:35 PM   #72
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Oh, I don't mean to suggest that my way is The One True Path to FIRE. As you say, everyone is free to make their own choices. And I suppose the more people that chain themselves to their jobs by making stupid decisions, the better for me as a capitalist.

As I've said before, I do think that sacrifices are required to arrive at FIRE. After all, there's no such thing as a free lunch.

Some people are willing to make less sacrifices than others; which is fine, it just takes longer. Some people aren't prepared to make any sacrifices at all; which is also fine, but they will never reach financial independence.
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Old 05-01-2008, 04:17 PM   #73
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And I suppose the more people that chain themselves to their jobs by making stupid decisions, the better for me as a capitalist.
The way I looked at it was that earning a living doing something, say a "job," you felt negatively about, something you felt chained to, was the truly stupid decision.
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Old 05-01-2008, 04:21 PM   #74
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....kids, house, wife..... the whole catastrophe. Somehow I got to FIRE.
"Zorba the Greek"? Love that line, "the whole (or full) catastrophe." Fluffy likes it, too.
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Old 05-01-2008, 04:34 PM   #75
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There is no question in my mind that if you have a job that you truly enjoy and that brings you fulfilment, early retirement is unnecessary (and would probably be a huge mistake).

But even those lucky few would be advised to try to become financially independent. Changes occur and bad things happen outside of our control. And even if one has excellent 'job security', many people find that what is interesting and stimulating now becomes rather stale and boring 20 years later.
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