Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
WellsTrade? (Question for Asset Allocators Using ETF's)
Old 05-03-2009, 11:29 AM   #1
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 925
WellsTrade? (Question for Asset Allocators Using ETF's)

For those of you who are asset allocators primarily using ETF's but not with WellsTrade (with their 100 free trades per yer), why aren't you using WellsTrade?

For those of you using WellsTrade, I would appreciate any feedback, insight, etc. (whether positive or negative) that you can provide.

The reason I ask: I currently have accounts (both tax deferred and taxable) at more of the other major discount brokers than I would like to admit; and, I am planning to start consolidating this year to simplify my life a bit. WellsTrade seems like the obvious choice for me; but, I have no personal experience with them. So, I am soliciting your advice.

My current plan, unless those of you with more experience/expertice persuade me otherwise, is to transfer as many of my taxable holdings as possible in-kind to WellsTrade where I can sell the individual stocks, actively managed funds, etc. that no longer fit my investing philosophy without paying a commission or continue to hold the securities that do still fit without tax consequences. I do have plenty of capital losses to offset any gains incurred with funds which WellsTrade does not accept. I am not as concerned about like-kind transfers from/to taxdefered accounts since most of these are old 401(k) accounts without transaction fees but, which I need to be out of because of the limitted choices, high fees, etc.

I do realize the subject of best discount broker has been covered here before; but, I hope you will allow me to ask this specific question without taking too much offense or giving me too much grief.

Thank you very much.
__________________

__________________
If there's one thing in my life that's missing; It's the time I spend alone
Sailing on the cool and bright clear waters; There's lots of those friendly people
Showin me ways to go; And I never want to lose your inspiration
CoolChange is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 05-03-2009, 11:34 AM   #2
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Gotadimple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,762
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolChange View Post
For those of you who are asset allocators primarily using ETF's but not with WellsTrade (with their 100 free trades per yer), why aren't you using WellsTrade?
Perhaps I am reading too much into your situation.

Asset allocation often implies a buy and hold philosophy, with occasional readjustment. I understand the need you have to keep your trading costs low as you consolidate.

What's your plan after that? Will you be actively trading or just sitting with your defined allocation?

Rita
__________________

__________________
Only got A dimple, would have preferred 2!
Gotadimple is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 11:49 AM   #3
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 925
Rita,

My long term plan, once I have unwound my current unwieldy/nutty/testosterone inspired situation, is to rebalance periodically (probably every 14-18 months) which will involve some buying and selling of ETF's in both my taxable and tax deferred accounts. I am still interested in keeping my trading cost low since I will probably slice and dice a bit more than normal wich will result in a few more trades during rebalancing periods.

Thank you again.
__________________
If there's one thing in my life that's missing; It's the time I spend alone
Sailing on the cool and bright clear waters; There's lots of those friendly people
Showin me ways to go; And I never want to lose your inspiration
CoolChange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 12:17 PM   #4
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,625
WellsTrade and the PMA relationship is simply one of the best things going in terms of service and cost. I was customer before the trades were free. The checking account is superb as well with free everything. Our WF accounts are the workhorses for our finances.

When we transfered funds and investments into WellsTrade "in-kind", they actually kept all our transaction history with those investments.

One can find all kinds of positive reviews of WF over at Bogleheads Investing Advice and Info Not only do you get free trades on stocks, but also free trades on mutual funds including Vanguard funds. That makes WF even better than Vanguard itself.

One thing I would like WF to have is real-time level II quotes. I keep my TDAmeritrade account just so I can use their trading platform to buy/sell in my WF account.

If you have specific questions, send me a PM or ask here, but you are on the right track to use WF if you can keep $25K in assets there.
__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 12:24 PM   #5
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
dex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,105
Where does WellsTrade make their money? Spreads?
__________________
Sometimes death is not as tragic as not knowing how to live. This man knew how to live--and how to make others glad they were living. - Jack Benny at Nat King Cole's funeral
dex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 12:30 PM   #6
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,625
Probably not spreads. I've gotten excellent execution on more than one hundred trades in the last couple of years. I've used mostly limit orders, but also a few market orders and have noticed no funny business. Furthermore, it's hard to see how spreads would apply to buying Vanguard mutual funds which are traded at NAV.

Like other discount brokers, they don't pay much on the cash sweep interest.

Also WF has full-service financial advisors which apparently many people use. One of the 15 local WF branches in my area is staffed with more folks than the local TDAmeritrade, Fidelity and Schwab offices combined. They won't talk to us "free-trades" folks though which is just as well.

But once WF has the software going, it doesn't really cost them anything for each new account.
__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 01:21 PM   #7
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
growing_older's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,608
There will likely not be too many trades if all you do is rebalance occasionally, but if you are still contributing regular weekly or monthly amounts, the free trades can keep the transation costs of accumulating positions down as well.
__________________
growing_older is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 01:29 PM   #8
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 925
growing_older,

You noted an important piece of information that I neglected included in my original post: I am currently accumulating. And, in fact, hope to continue accumulation for a few years via independent consulting engagements even after retiring (on my own terms or otherwise) from my current W2 position as long as my technical skills are in sufficient demand.

Thanks again.
__________________
If there's one thing in my life that's missing; It's the time I spend alone
Sailing on the cool and bright clear waters; There's lots of those friendly people
Showin me ways to go; And I never want to lose your inspiration
CoolChange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 01:56 PM   #9
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,625
If you have a taxable account, then tax-loss harvesting can use up free trades as well. In the past 12 months, I switched from VEU to VEA to VEU to VEA and back to VEU. Ditto for ETFs in other asset classes.
__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 08:43 PM   #10
Recycles dryer sheets
figner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 329
I've used WellsTrade for slightly over a year now. It seems to be a good deal if you have the 25K needed for the PMA account / free trades. I too am in accumulation mode, and use the free trades to tax loss harvest as well as DCA smaller amounts than I usually would if I had to pay commissions per trade.

The only annoying thing I've found so far:

You have to sign up for their WF checking in order to become a PMA customer. But I only use the checking acct to transfer money in/out electronically from my other accounts. (I keep a primary checking account at another bank which pays better interest.) A couple months ago, my WF checking disappeared from the online account listing. I called in, and a rep finally figured out the checking acct had gone dormant because there had been no activity for a year. Well that can't be right, I told him, since I'd just transferred money into it a couple months ago. Apparently electronic transactions don't qualify as 'activity'. It has to be a check or debit transaction to keep the account active. So once a year I'll have to write a check to myself or something. The rep was able to reactivate my checking acct in 3 business days, and assured me my PMA status was safe. But it was a bit unnerving to get WF brokerage statements that no longer said they were part of a PMA account. So far it seems to be resolved with no further issues.
__________________
figner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 09:44 PM   #11
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 925
Thank you all for the replies.

LOL! and figner, thank you for sharing actual WF experience. The checking account warning from figner will almost certainly save me from a panic in about a year.
__________________
If there's one thing in my life that's missing; It's the time I spend alone
Sailing on the cool and bright clear waters; There's lots of those friendly people
Showin me ways to go; And I never want to lose your inspiration
CoolChange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2009, 11:25 PM   #12
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
clifp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,450
After looking at Wells Trade website again. I think if I was starting from scratch, I'd seriously consider Wells Trade.

In my case, I am not sure I'd save any money. First I "only" do about 50-60 transactions a year (although last year I hit close to 90 in all of my accounts). The majority of those are the writing of covered call or put, which aren't covered by the 100 free trades and are more expensive at Wells than at Schwab. Pure stock/ETF trade are only about 25-30 a year, so I'd only save $250 moving all my stock purchases to Wells

I think Schwab offers a better and wider variety of research and more sophisticated trading platform (Level 2 quotes etc.) as well as access to alternative investments, inexpensive bond trades, and wider selection of mutual funds..

Finally in normal times the Schwab/Vanguard/Fidelity money funds pay 1 to 2% higher interest rates than the Wells Fargo checking accounts on $25,000 that equals $250-$500 which makes up for a lot of the money you save in commissions.
__________________
clifp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2009, 09:29 PM   #13
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by clifp View Post

Finally in normal times the Schwab/Vanguard/Fidelity money funds pay 1 to 2% higher interest rates than the Wells Fargo checking accounts on $25,000 that equals $250-$500 which makes up for a lot of the money you save in commissions.
To get the free trades all you have to do is have a PMA checking account with WF. This ensures that all the wellstrade accounts that are linked to the PMA account get 100 free trades.

PMA accounts do have a monthly fee of $25 which is waived if you have more than 25k of balance at WF ( checking , savings , wellstrade, 10% of your mortgage etc )

This is different from BOA , i think you confused BOA with WF, which requires you to maintain 25k in deposit account to get the 360 ( 30*12 ) free trades a year.

And finally not sure if have schwab,fidelity & VG have lowered their commisions in such a drastic manner that you can equate $250-$500 to 100 trades with them.
__________________
dumadum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2009, 10:59 PM   #14
Dryer sheet aficionado
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 36
I don't use WellsTrade because I use a broker which has produced excellent service over a long time and which does not exact enough cost for the trading I do to manage ETF's to worry about the difference.
__________________
dbr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2009, 01:00 PM   #15
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
DblDoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,224
I'd use Wells instead of Scottrade if I didn't have a past history banking with Wells and will no longer deal with them.

DD
__________________
DblDoc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2009, 01:50 PM   #16
Recycles dryer sheets
figner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 329
Quote:
Originally Posted by clifp View Post
Finally in normal times the Schwab/Vanguard/Fidelity money funds pay 1 to 2% higher interest rates than the Wells Fargo checking accounts on $25,000 that equals $250-$500 which makes up for a lot of the money you save in commissions.
Just to confirm what dumadum said - you don't have to put $25,000 in your WF checking account. $25,000 total in all your WF PMA accounts including investment accounts (for example IRA, Roth, and taxable brokerage account at WF) is the requirement to waive account fees.
__________________
figner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 02:07 AM   #17
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
clifp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,450
Ok so if had $1,000 in a Wells Fargo checking and had $24,000 in the brokerage account. There would be no fee?
__________________
clifp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 03:44 AM   #18
Recycles dryer sheets
figner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 329
Quote:
Originally Posted by clifp View Post
Ok so if had $1,000 in a Wells Fargo checking and had $24,000 in the brokerage account. There would be no fee?
I believe that's correct. I only keep about $10 in my WF checking most of the time, but over $25,000 total in the other WF accounts. No fees, 100 free trades (per account I think) a year. Of course, it would be best to confirm this with Wells Fargo before opening any accounts if that's your intention.
__________________
figner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2009, 05:05 AM   #19
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,625
Quote:
Originally Posted by clifp View Post
Ok so if had $1,000 in a Wells Fargo checking and had $24,000 in the brokerage account. There would be no fee?
Correct. But I wouldn't cut it that close.
__________________
LOL! is offline   Reply With Quote
2009 Smart Money Survey
Old 06-12-2009, 02:51 PM   #20
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3
2009 Smart Money Survey

The survey is out and wellstrade gets a bad rating for high commissions, though there is a mention of the 100 free trades and link to the PMA account



Here is the link for the article SmartMoney's 2009 Broker Survey at SmartMoney.com
__________________

__________________
dumadum is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wellstrade, anyone else think it is a mess? Olav23 FIRE and Money 5 05-02-2007 01:06 PM
Asset allocation question Dry Socks FIRE and Money 4 04-21-2007 09:44 PM
Wellstrade bosco FIRE and Money 13 02-27-2007 11:49 AM
Asset Allocation Question frayne FIRE and Money 2 04-25-2006 12:44 PM
Question about Asset Allocation Sheryl FIRE and Money 23 08-10-2005 07:32 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:05 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.