What does '70% of salary' mean?!?

randall

Dryer sheet wannabe
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Messages
11
Location
Duluth
I am looking to take early retirement in 2012. I often read e.g. that one needs 70% of one's salary upon retirement. But what does that really mean? If for example I have a salary of $100,000 but I save HALF of that (401k, 403b, liquid mutual funds), so that I am used to a take-home GROSS 'salary' of $50,000, will I need 70% of $100,000 or 70% of $50,000 upon retirement? Confusing to me. The term salary seems relative to what one has for take-home gross, or does it just refer to initial gross, not counting what is put into 401k, Vanguard liquid asset mutuals each month out of my checking account, etc.?
~randall (new here, this is my first post)
 
Welcome randall.

We've discussed this a ton and it's pretty simple really. When FP's and others discuss retirement financial requirements in terms of pre-retirement salary, they're addressing the hoards of folks who work for gov't, MegaCorps, etc., who have steady incomes and spend based on that income.

For most here, the focus is on planning a retirement budget in absolute dollars (as opposed to a percentage of pre-retirement budget or salary) and acheiving the resources to fund that retirement budget. So, take a breath - it's not a big deal, and continue to calcuate your requirements based on your plans for what you'll need in retirement independent from what your current salary is.
 
It means the person who wrote it is an idiot. He/she doesn't realize that there are people who don't spend all of their income.
 
To the OP...

What you are referring to is an income replacement ratio. Google that phrase to find out more than you ever wanted to know.

An income replacement ratio is just a simplistic guide, a rule-of-thumb etc. to help someone understand about how much income you may need to have a somewhat level lifestyle after you quit working. It is based on an idea that after you retire your taxes just may go down and you probably aren't saving for retirement anymore.

It goes without saying that if you have been saving half your income that you won't need 70 percent of your past (gross) income to keep a level lifestyle after retirement. Many on this forum fall into this category. For high savers they'll only need maybe 30-40 percent of their income to live as they have been.

It's just a guide and like any guide there are some problems with the model.

If you are scrapping by on $20k/year while working you just may need all of that income and more in retirement.

If you are a fat cat making $500k chances are you would be just fine with a 10 percent income replacement ratio.

But if you are an average family with a family income of around $50-70k, then that 70 percent model may just work out fairly well. You will get some of that income from social security and possibly a pension. The rest has to come from your savings.
 
It means the person who wrote it is an idiot. He/she doesn't realize that there are people who don't spend all of their income.

Thank you for confirming my thoughts. That 70% figure just seemed too simplistic and speaks nothing about ultra frugal people like me who live on next to nothing compared to my gross salary. I save massive amounts of my savings, I am Mr. Frugal, so it just did not makes sense that I would need 70% of $100,000 when I take early retirement. I live a non-materialistic life except for my PC and books and art supplies, and I prefer a small house.
 
I am looking to take early retirement in 2012. I often read e.g. that one needs 70% of one's salary upon retirement. But what does that really mean? If for example I have a salary of $100,000 but I save HALF of that (401k, 403b, liquid mutual funds), so that I am used to a take-home GROSS 'salary' of $50,000, will I need 70% of $100,000 or 70% of $50,000 upon retirement? Confusing to me. The term salary seems relative to what one has for take-home gross, or does it just refer to initial gross, not counting what is put into 401k, Vanguard liquid asset mutuals each month out of my checking account, etc.?
~randall (new here, this is my first post)
welcome to the board and congrats on your upcoming FIRE.

I have found that guidelines such as the one you quoted are a 'one size fits no one' recommendation.

The real answer is that it is dependent upon your lifestyle and spending habits. If you were living very comfortably on $50k then that is probably your upper bound and you could survive on less, perhaps 70% now that you don't have w*rk expenses and higher income taxes due to big salary. If you were just sqeeking by on it, then it might be the minimum. Only you can tell.

For example, I was like you and lived on a substantially lower percentage of my salary and was comfortable with it. Our budget is essentially the same (minus w*rk expenses and extra taxes plus travel) as when I was working.

With the little info you have given, it would seem that you are in good shape.

Another thought, ... you really won't know what your 'new' lifestyle and spending will be until you actually start doing it. Things change ... that's life. :cool:

Good luck to you and I encourage you to review past posts. Lots of info here from a lot of like minded people.
 
Thank you MasterBlaster. Makes sense. I earn $100,000 a year but I live on maybe $2000/month take home (I own my home and car, have no debt, a single guy-- artist, writer, etc). When I take early retirement in 3 years (age 55) I will have a retirement pension of $3000/month, then $1500/month in social security at age 65. And about a million saved away in mutuals, 401k, etc. So I just can not figure why I would need $70,000 a year once I retire. I should be okay right, drawing maybe 2-3% from my savings on top of my pension? It is a bit scary to think of no more paycheck, but I feel like I have been so frugal most of my life and saved so much over the decades I deserve to take FIRE at age 55 and enjoy writing, art, etc.. I just want to make sure I am not screwing myself over cutting the ties with employment and a regular paycheck, as I know I have to account for inflation and medical insurance and all that stuff in the coming decades.
~randall
 
Randall - It really isn't worth your time to figure out why the author of what your reading is an idiot or why he thinks his audience are idiots. You won't need $70k a year unless you're going to spend $70k a year... It's that simple...

Now with inflation you just might reach that level someday - cola's on pension/SS can help with that. With the resources you mention 'ER' should NOT be a problem and it sounds like you will continue to get a check bigger than what you spend. If you ever feel like spending more than what you have coming in, you have ample resources to supplement for a very long time. Enjoy what appears to be a very comfortable retirement.:cool:
 
randall.....

It really sounds like you need to write a retirement budget. What do you want to have as income while you're retired to live your retirement life as you wish? Then use FireCalc to test the survival rate of your plan.

My guess is that you're in great shape. But you need to understand what amount does it for you. You're correct to not want to rely on a percent of current income guess. But, you need a number.
 
Yes, I do need to figure out my retirement budget. So foreign to me, I am so used to my employer paying 100% of my medical and dental, so I have NO idea whatsoever what that insurance costs, I do not even know what the heck medicare and medicare even are all about, I am insulated from all that thus far.

I just googled and discovered that FIRECalc website/tool, very very cool, reassuring too.
 
It is inflation that concerns me. I am old enough (52) to know that when I was 12 a candy bar was 15 cents, milk 50 cents a gallon, magazines a quarter or 50 cents. Then I see today's costs, and what they could grow to in 20-30 years. I guess I just have to be sure not to draw too much out of my savings on top of my pension and SS. (btw, What is 'ER'?)
 
In addition, your expenses in retirement may be far different from your expenses while working.

Some may go down (clothes, gas, lunches out?), while some (maybe even those same categories) may go up (more clothes to meet different activities like hiking, etc?, higher gas costs due to more free time to travel, more lunches out with friends?). And the big one for some is health care costs.

So don't listen to some writer, figure out your wants/needs for retirement and budget accordingly. There is a wide range of numbers on this forum, hopefully everyone's budget is the "right" budget for them.

wooops - just saw others posted much the same info already - oh well, here ya go anyway ;)

-ERD50
 
It is the medical/dental insurance costs I need to learn about, big unknowns for my future retirement budget. If anyone feels like tossing me a bone to lead me to a site to start figuring that budget item out I would be quite grateful; I will also do some googling.
~randall
 
It is the medical/dental insurance costs I need to learn about, big unknowns for my future retirement budget. If anyone feels like tossing me a bone to lead me to a site to start figuring that budget item out I would be quite grateful; I will also do some googling.
~randall

Randall:
Welcome.

Try ehealthinsurance.com for health insurance quotes.

Rita
 
Thank you Rita, that site was fast and quick to get some idea on the cost of my health insurance once I retire!
 
Thank you Rita, that site was fast and quick to get some idea on the cost of my health insurance once I retire!
They assume you have no pre-existing conditions, also some (UHC)
give low rates, but increase them after 1st year (20%). Buyer beware.
TJ
 
With your assets, you could easily consider self-insuring (OR perhaps just a very high deductible option) for the 10 yrs until you reached medicare eligibility.
Unless your expecting problems over that period.
 
With your assets, you could easily consider self-insuring (OR perhaps just a very high deductible option) for the 10 yrs until you reached medicare eligibility.
Unless your expecting problems over that period.

I have no health problems, knock on wood. Only a cancer or something like that could hit me hard financially. I actually thought of what you said though-- self insuring, because I heard about someone who does just that, just a couple of days ago on public radio.
 
Compromise, go high deductible. Pay for routine doc visits, etc., out of pocket. But have backup in case something very expensive to fix comes up.
 
The figures that they quote in the "retirement advice" columns nearly caused me to have a "meltdown" when my DH was "early retired" at 62. Those figures are outrageous. Start keeping a spreadsheet and find out how much you actually need to run your household. Is your house "free and clear"? If not, will it be when you are retired?

Health insurance is the biggie before medicare. It is very costly IF you can find it.

Once you have Health insurance nailed down, and you know the rest of your expenses --- THEN you will know how much you need for retirement. After that, figure in your inflation factor and any other unexpected additional costs.

That's how you get your "number".
 
As others have said, you have to consider what you are living on now and allow for inflation of all expenses. Remember that all expenses do not inflate at the same rate (at least not lately). Medical in particular has gone up a lot each year.

I'm in a similar situation - I save so much (out of necessity) that my salary has no relation to what I need to live on. Be sure to get at least enough health insurance that if something catastrophic happens, you have coverage for that. If you pay the first $5K or whatever, and they pay most or all of the rest, you won't become bankrupt if you have an illness or car accident or whatever. Think of it as bankruptcy protection.

If you know how to use spreadsheet software (hey, not everyone does) that's what I used, painfully, to consider options. What I did was look at my actual expenses, year by year, and inflate them by various amounts each year. I was trying to figure out if my money would last until I was nearly 100 (not likely but my dad is almost 89 so not unlikely). Anyhow it was a lot of work but IMHO well worth it.

Periodically I take my current assets and just lump them into a kind of starting point for the year, subtract expenses, and see how long it lasts. You don't have to track every penny but it helps to know roughly what you are spending on food, utilities, and so on.

I'm not usually this compulsive :D but I am heading toward early retirement (hopefully in June) and it is critical that I feel comfortable financially.

Smartmoney.com has retirement worksheets that seem to do the same thing with less work, but I wanted more control over the inflation % and so on.
 
I have no health problems, knock on wood. Only a cancer or something like that could hit me hard financially. I actually thought of what you said though-- self insuring, because I heard about someone who does just that, just a couple of days ago on public radio.
Growing up I never wore a helmet riding a bike and would have laughed at anyone who did - Today, that's obvious child abuse -

Risk => Reward - Look at the bright side - With any luck the catastrophic cancer you mention(fear) could be terminal and you'll have nothing to worry about financially ie. You'll never feel the financial hit or even notice it. :rolleyes:

So, I guess what you want is insurance to cover the surviving of a major calamity - no matter how unlikely it is you'll need it. Should be some relatively low cost options. Is it possible to 'buy' into your current insurance plan as a retiree?
 
We have in the last two months signed up for Blue Cross HSA anticipating our retirement in December 2010. We have a $1500 deductible, 100% preventive care coverage and $5950.00 tax deductible which we can pay for medical expenses. We pay everything out of pocket and hope to let the account grow. We are also 52 and 49 and very healthy and do not want our savings destroyed because of a health issue or accident.
 
Yes, I do need to figure out my retirement budget. So foreign to me, I am so used to my employer paying 100% of my medical and dental, so I have NO idea whatsoever what that insurance costs, I do not even know what the heck medicare and medicare even are all about, I am insulated from all that thus far.
.
medical is going to be a shocker for you if you have to go on the outside. It is very confusing. Each company does its best to give you so many options that you can't figure out what a good deal for your family is.
After waltzing through a lot of websites and having to register before being allowed to view alternatives, I got calls from a bunch of agents. Be sure you know what type of coverage you want, how much deductible you are willing to 'self insure' on, etc.
If you and your family are healthy and don't use a lot of healthcare, then you may want to take a large deductible. It will save you a bunch between now and medicare (btw, I know nothing about that also, but will need to start to learn soon). If you go to the Dr. for a bunch of stuff, then you may want to look at HMO's. Lots of stuff in between.

Good luck
 
OP,

ER, by the way, stands for "Early Retirement". "FIRE" is "Financially Independent Retire Early" or something like that. Both terms are roughly synonymous.

I just calculated that my retirement budget has me living on about 13.4% of my current salary. As people have already said, the 70% of salary is just a rule of thumb that doesn't really apply to ER folks.

You can take what you're spending now and use that as your ER budget, or if you want to get a little more detailed, you can take what you're spending now and go through it category by category and figure out how your budget would change when retired. Income taxes will probably go down, health insurance will go up, commuting costs down, travel up, etc.

2Cor521
 
Back
Top Bottom