Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
What does "enough" mean to you?
Old 01-22-2018, 07:30 PM   #1
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 6
What does "enough" mean to you?

Greetings,

I'm 37 years old, married, no children (but we will likely have one child within a year or two). I have real estate investments that produce approximately $85,000 of taxable income per year after business deductions. I live in the Great Lakes region, so aside from high taxes it's a low cost of living relative to most metropolitan areas. Intellectually I know that I could survive for the rest of my life on this amount of cash flow. I find myself pursuing the purchase of more and more rental property with the sole intent of increasing my eventual "retirement income." I live a lot like a retired person right now, but I'm always thinking that more is better and thus continue to buy.

For those who have already retired, what was your "enough" number? How did you settle on that, and how did you reign in the inevitable temptation to increase your passive income--even if you didn't really need it to live comfortably? I don't care about fancy cars or other status symbols, but I do have an unnatural obsession with passive income (e.g. the more the better).

What is "enough" for you? Any advice on how to slow down?
__________________

captain picard is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 01-22-2018, 07:47 PM   #2
Confused about dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Front Range
Posts: 4
Not yet retired. At one point it was was $1M, now I have $2M and think $3M is the answer. Not sure if it’s just inflation or hedonic adaptation.
__________________

FVFIRE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 07:52 PM   #3
Full time employment: Posting here.
Jerry1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 872
Do you enjoy what you do? At 37, if you like doing the real estate gig and you're driven to purchase more, there's no need to worry about what is enough. Go get more.

For me, enough came when I didn't feel like working any longer. I looked at what I had and asked if it was enough. It was not enough to keep living like I did when I was bringing in the cash, but the changes I have to make far outweigh the cost of continued work.

Right now, you don't have enough. Get a couple to several million in the bank and make sure that child/children have enough for college and then you can start thinking about what is enough. BTW, it's a very personal thing.
__________________
Retired 9am 1/17/2018 - 56yo
Jerry1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 07:54 PM   #4
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 97
If we had more, we could do more for the church and the homeless and veterans and our family. So I endeavor to get more and do more.
Bruceski44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 08:29 PM   #5
Full time employment: Posting here.
Luck_Club's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 543
For me, enough came when the income gains just didn't seem worth it. In other words, spending 10-14 hours over 2 days to paint a house, isn't worth the stress of squeezing it into my day or giving up my cocktail hour, so I gladly pay $300-$400 to somebody else.

Same with my business. If I can't smell real big $$ potential, or I smell micromanagement, no interest.

Starting around mid forties, I found myself having to go way out on the risk premium to increase my income. When I first bought some property my incremental income increases were really good about 15%+ boost. Eventually the number began to like they would be less than 5%, and required more cash, so I got less interested. I'm still in the market, but only if I can see a home run. Marginal deals are done.
__________________
2017 dry run spending: 2018 accelerate debt elimination: 2019 RV procurement & 1MY begins: 6/19 DW last month: 9/19 start cross country loop: 1/20 first reinforcements arrive. 6/20 sell business or shut doors. 9/20 begin globe trot: 4/26 401K reinforcement.
Luck_Club is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 08:35 PM   #6
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Major Tom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SF East Bay
Posts: 3,188
It definitely sounds to me that you're nowhere near ready to hang it all up. You say that intellectually, you know you could live for the rest of your life on what you have, but it's obvious that you enjoy the process of accumulating more passive income. For the time being, I'd say keep doing what you're doing. There may be a point in the future where the satisfaction of what you're doing for a living lessens, and the prospect of actually retiring starts to look pretty good.

You say that you have an unnatural obsession with increasing your passive income. If you ever genuinely feel that it is really becoming a problem and getting in the way of you enjoying your life, that might be a good time to take a look at that. I'm curious as to why you said that. Do you really feel that it's a problem, or perhaps you were just being self-effacing?
__________________
ER, for all intents and purposes. Part-time income <5% of annual expenditure.
Major Tom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 08:36 PM   #7
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Onward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,740
I never had a number. I saved and invested until the w*rking world had me ready to blow my brains out. Then I left.

When anything is better than another day on the j*b, it's easy to fit your lifestyle to your financial means.

It's a matter of survival.
__________________
And if I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know.
Onward is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 08:50 PM   #8
Recycles dryer sheets
Scrapr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Bend
Posts: 456
Your "enough" number will change the minute after your child arrives. You will look at that $85k and think how will our little one survive without the fancy stroller/outfit/shoes/play dates/private school/etc.

Kids have a way of expanding their needs to your income

Keep going. a 300 unit apartment building will be almost enough
Scrapr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 09:36 PM   #9
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
pb4uski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Vermont & Sarasota, FL
Posts: 17,905
I never really had a number... but there became a point in time where I knew that by all reasonable measures that we had "enough" to continue to live our lifestyle for as long as we lived. At that point, further work was just enriching Uncle Sam and our kids and i decided that I had better things to do.
__________________
If something cannot endure laughter.... it cannot endure.
Patience is the art of concealing your impatience.
Slow and steady wins the race.

Retired Jan 2012 at age 56...60/35/5 AA
pb4uski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 10:21 PM   #10
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
RobbieB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Central CA
Posts: 2,950
I, we've always had enough.

No budget, no tracking spending and no worries.
__________________
Retired at 59 in 2014. Should have done it sooner but I worried too much.
RobbieB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2018, 10:53 PM   #11
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 10,277
Dunno. I have more than enough to live on but I don't know how much it will cost me to die with dignity since I'm self funding my long term care. I'm hoping that an extra million will do it for both me and DW.
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 12:19 AM   #12
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,733
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry1 View Post
Do you enjoy what you do? At 37, if you like doing the real estate gig and you're driven to purchase more, there's no need to worry about what is enough. Go get more.

For me, enough came when I didn't feel like working any longer. I looked at what I had and asked if it was enough. It was not enough to keep living like I did when I was bringing in the cash, but the changes I have to make far outweigh the cost of continued work.

Right now, you don't have enough. Get a couple to several million in the bank and make sure that child/children have enough for college and then you can start thinking about what is enough. BTW, it's a very personal thing.


Great advice. It is very personal and changes over time. For me, “enough” was when we became financially able to fund our lifestyle plus a substantial contingency for unknown costs.
Scuba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 12:54 AM   #13
Recycles dryer sheets
Lawrence of Suburbia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Newcastle, WA
Posts: 173
When the moment arrives later this year, 'Enough' is: having dependable income (S.S., a small SPIA annuity, perhaps) which covers my basic costs (Medicare add-on coverage, condo dues, property taxes, insurance, power bill, etc.) so I'm never homeless. After that, a sustainable percentage of my portfolio (3%-ish?) taken out to pay for groceries, gas, car repairs, guitar strings, coffee, records, and general walking-around money.

I don't quite have 'enough' (you'd laugh if I told you how little), so, I'll be obliged to keep doing something to earn some cash early on ($3-400/month, say). I view this as a positive! Keeping engaged at the sharp end of life. I'm a pretty decent guitar player, so ...

The idea is, to maintain a bohemian style of life in a sort of modest, genteel poverty. To be an eccentric old man (why change now?)
__________________
Don't just do something; stand there!

- Jack Bogle
Lawrence of Suburbia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 02:25 AM   #14
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alberta/Ontario/ Arizona
Posts: 3,393
This is a good question with the answer very personal. Many factors will come into play such as do you enjoy your job, does working another year add a lot or only a little to your investment portfolio, can you “productively” spend more or is your current spending budget your “limit”, do you have a legacy objective?

In the end, these are questions that are more likely answerable when you get a little older. If I were you I’d just keep going, add to your stash, and see how things go. At you age, I hadnt even thought of these issues.
Danmar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 02:34 AM   #15
Full time employment: Posting here.
Golden sunsets's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 863
I think enough in your case should include additional passive income generated from a different source than real estate so that you are diversified.


Sent from my iPad using Early Retirement Forum
__________________
"Luck favors the prepared mind"
Pasteur
Golden sunsets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 04:27 AM   #16
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 187
It is very personal. Remember that starting a family will change a lot of dynamics (and numbers) going forward. Also don't look at the rental cash flow to feel financially secure. Look at really passive inflation-adjusted returns as in S&P 500 dividend which has been steady 2% for like forever. If you can live off 2% of the invested capital then you and your heirs will be able to live off of that nest egg forever. I strive to get to this point and then I can truly feel FI. Like I said, it is very personal. So for now, enjoy the journey and do what you love.
pjigar is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 05:29 AM   #17
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 172
I think you have done a fantastic job at age 37. You are your own boss and have built and continue to build your real estate empire. That's the good news.

On the other side you are 37 years old. As I have posted before.....healthcare costs....are the elephant in the room. I know.....you are healthy,,,,now....but as we age...stuff happens. Do you have an ACA plan now? If your premiums/deductibles are manageable now.....think what they will be 20 years from now when you are in your late 50's?

Also you can live on $85,000/ year now, but inflation will quickly erode that number. MAke sure your rental increases keep pace with inflation. I know. Obvious.

Another X factor is your child. Between raising the little one and future college costs (if you plan to help out) you are probably looking at a number around $500,000 until he/she is out on their own. And what if you have more little ones?

Curious , as a real estate investor, do you currently pay into SS and /or MEdicare? Do you already have the required 40 qtrs. to qualify for future MEdicare/SS benefits? If not how will you mange this? Not sure since rental income is not considered earned income? If not then healthcare costs will be a factor beyond age 65.

I think you should keep expanding your real estate holdings cuz the eventual number you might need could be bigger than you think. Good luck.
MrLoco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 05:49 AM   #18
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
Midpack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicagoland
Posts: 12,476
When we reached double the academic SWR without SS, I retired. But I was 57 yo, there is no way I’d have quit accumulating at 37 even if we’d had enough, I would have worked until at least 55. We would have lived below our means, but we would have spent more in the decades leading into retirement. And if I had still been enjoying my career at 57, I would have happily kept working. “Enough” was not solely a number to me.
__________________
No one agrees with other people's opinions; they merely agree with their own opinions -- expressed by somebody else. Sydney Tremayne
Retired Jun 2011 at age 57

Target AA: 60% equity funds / 35% bond funds / 5% cash
Target WR: Approx 2.5% Approx 20% SI (secure income, SS only)
Midpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 06:25 AM   #19
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 433
If you ditch the kid, $85000 could be enough. With a kids or kids, it probably wont be enough sooner than you expected
__________________
No to consumerism, Living a simple life, enjoying the experience - not the material stuff
cyber888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-23-2018, 06:30 AM   #20
Recycles dryer sheets
iloveyoga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 368
We were busy working, saving, and raising a family and did not really think about it, until one of us decides they really don't like their job. This happened for us in our 50's. And then you take a look and say we have enough to sustain a modest lifestyle. I agree it is very personal.
__________________

__________________
Retired in 2013 and we are living the dream!
iloveyoga is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What does "ER" mean to you? sengsational Other topics 15 11-19-2015 11:29 AM
Job description: What does "Deals well with ambiguity" mean? RISP Young Dreamers 43 06-23-2014 08:27 AM
What does "Don't lose money" mean? km4hr FIRE and Money 8 10-12-2008 01:50 PM
What does "discount future promises" mean? pedorrero FIRE and Money 3 12-15-2007 08:19 PM
What does the term "ER" mean to U? rs0460a Other topics 36 06-10-2006 08:19 AM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:35 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.