What Women Want

[donheff]

I admit that I like living in nicer places with nicer things than Greg does. We would have been FI a lot sooner if I was as frugal as my spouse. But because I liked spending more than my spouse did, I kept working and he ER'd first.

Same situation here, although DW doesn't have significantly higher luxury requirements -- just a higher security threshold. Also, she worries that she may not be as "self sustaining" as me. She sees that I keep myself fully occupied but still worries what she "will do all day."

 

[Helen]

I can't imagine wanting luxury knowing that my partner's health was at stake from working. I have seen examples of this very thing, however.

-helen

 

[KM]

Twenty-three years ago my spouse and I had a fight.

Spouse: "I work hard. If I want to go do something fun on my vacation, I should be able to!"
Me: "We already did. We spent what we put aside for vacation. We're not spending any more."
Spouse: "That's ridiculous."
Me: "Fine!" I replied and threw the bank book and checkbook at my spouse. "You take care of all the finances then."

While sitting in the other room, I heard my spouse open the accounts and say "Uh, wow, we've got a lot of money in here." (Our son had just been born and we were trying to save for a bigger house at the time...and trust me, we didn't make much money then).

Me: "Yes, I know. Because we aren't spending it!"

Spouse: "Here" he said, handing the books back. "You're doing just fine."

We have never argued about money again. We will be retiring at 55 (6 years) and will be (I believe) be very comfortable. I have worked as many years as my spouse, make twice as much, and do all the budgeting, investing, etc, etc.

Not all women want husbands that will work forever to support them - but many women have been catered to for so many years, they have no idea how else to live. And there husbands have no one to blame but themselves.

Your response to wife #4 was spot-on! Get a job....

 

[Nords]

Are some people in this threat using BPD for borderline personality disorder, while others thing it stands for bipolar disease? I'm confused.

Nothing borderline about it-- bipolar disease!

Don, I split out the electrical question as "Human Electrical Resistance" and moved it to the "Other Topics" section of the board.

 

[Martha]

Are some people in this threat using BPD for borderline personality disorder, while others thing it stands for bipolar disease? I'm confused.

You might be right. I assumed borderline personality disorder because that is what rmark referred to in his post that started the discussion.

 

[Delawaredave]

As a single working woman who has taken care of herself
[and her disabled son] the past 30 years, I just want to be
able to enjoy God's blessings and the fruits of my labor...
ie, have a comfy nest and retire early.

You deserve above and a lot more.

 

[LeatherneckPA]

You know,,,, I just re-read what I wrote in someone's quote, and maybe it didn't come out the way I thought it did. It was supposed to be a sincere note of gratitude. But the section quoted made it sound like I was complaining about my DW sticking me with all the distasteful tasks. And then there was someone else's bit about the 5000 sq ft homes.

I truly am a lucky man. Aside from the fact that my DW actually wants only 2000 sq ft or less, she is openly embracing the idea of my ER and possibly even hers. The decision to continue working will be entirely hers. I've planned on retiring on just my pension and TSP since the very beginning. Certified "old fogey" that I am, I never wanted my wife to work outside the home. Again, that was her choice and I love her for it. She has made many things more possible for us that would not have been on my salary alone. (A Harley, a Suzuki, and a sailboat, plus a fully outfitted woodworking shop)

And now she appears to be as enthusiastic about my countdown as I am. Although I suspect a large part of that is the concept of me cooking more than her and having dinner ready when she comes home. Not a lot of that happening right now since I work evenings. So I guess I am in the minority when I say, "Who cares what she wants? She deserves it."

Of course, a woman as understanding as my DW is in an even smaller minority, I think.

 

[REWahoo]

You know,,,, I just re-read what I wrote in someone's quote, and maybe it didn't come out the way I thought it did. It was supposed to be a sincere note of gratitude. But the section quoted made it sound like I was complaining about my DW sticking me with all the distasteful tasks. And then there was someone else's bit about the 5000 sq ft homes.

I truly am a lucky man. Aside from the fact that my DW actually wants only 2000 sq ft or less, she is openly embracing the idea of my ER and possibly even hers. The decision to continue working will be entirely hers. I've planned on retiring on just my pension and TSP since the very beginning. Certified "old fogey" that I am, I never wanted my wife to work outside the home. Again, that was her choice and I love her for it. She has made many things more possible for us that would not have been on my salary alone. (A Harley, a Suzuki, and a sailboat, plus a fully outfitted woodworking shop)

And now she appears to be as enthusiastic about my countdown as I am. Although I suspect a large part of that is the concept of me cooking more than her and having dinner ready when she comes home. Not a lot of that happening right now since I work evenings. So I guess I am in the minority when I say, "Who cares what she wants? She deserves it."

Of course, a woman as understanding as my DW is in an even smaller minority, I think.

Translation: I realized DW might read this thread and I'm dead meat if she does!

 

[scrinch]

I read this forum almost everyday, but never post as I'm only here to learn. I'm 59 years old and my husband is 63. Before we had children my husband and I each worked about sixty hours a week, but after the kids arrived I was a stay-at-home mom and now am a stay-at-home grandma. We live in a 3400 sq. ft. house we built ourselves and plan on adding another 600 sq. ft. in the near future. It has nothing to do with being a status symbol. We use every sq. st. and love every sq. ft. We have wonderful memories of our children and grandchildren playing in our house and running through our 15 acres. We also have great memories of grandparents, parents, aunts, uncles, cousins, brothers, sisters, nieces, nephews, friends, sitting around our table enjoying family meals, playing board and card games, visiting around our fireplace. We've had cookouts and games outside. Holidays are a special time here. We've walked the trails in our woods. We've shared happy times and supported each other in difficult times in this place. This is not just a house to us, it's our home and we love what it's been to us, and what we hope it will continue to be. "There's no place like home" is real to us. My husband never made me feel guilty for not working outside our home. He was happy making me happy. I returned his kindness by always keeping his home a good place for him to be when he wasn't at work. He's never cooked, cleaned, done laundry, gotten up in the middle of the night with kids. We have 15 acres, with about 1/3 lawn. I've always mowed the lawn, painted the house and outbuildings inside and out when they need it. Cleared trails through the woods, piled firewood, piled lumber (we had our own sawmill). Just because I've stayed home I haven't been lazy. If I'd continued working, I don't think either of us would have been as content as we've been because we would have been too busy to enjoy life's simple pleasures. We've both been extremely blessed in our lives, and I think we can both say we've had what we wanted.

Stillmuchtolearn, congratulations for finding a division of labor that works and is satisfying for your family! This, rather than strict equality of earning, is what spouses should strive for in a marriage. My DW and I entered marriage with the expectation and pledge that we would split the earning and family raising as evenly as possible between us. Well, it hasn't worked out quite as we planned. She ended up taking a few years off when the kids were small and we moved overseas for my job. My earning power thus grew more than hers did, so we have depended on my job more than hers for the past decade. Now I am ramping down on work and she is ramping back up, and I am trying to be home more to help with the teenage after school drama. I hope when we are both retired we can look back (as you can) and say that we found a work-play-family path that worked reasonably well and was fair to the entire family.

 

[renferme]

I retired 2 years ago and younger wife is still working. She did not mind that I retired. In fact, when I took the fun job at PNC Park working for the Pirates, she didn't want me volunteering for extra work; she said she wanted me home.
Needless to say I still work for the Pirates in the summer and love it and she lets me do it because she knows that's what I like. What a great gal she is ! !
.

 

[bbuzzard]

I am amazed at how much time, momey and effort is spent on preparing for the wedding; and how little is spent on preparing for the marriage.

Amen brother!

 

[2B]

I read this forum almost everyday, but never post as I'm only here to learn. I'm 59 years old and my husband is 63. Before we had children my husband and I each worked about sixty hours a week, but after the kids arrived I was a stay-at-home mom and now am a stay-at-home grandma. We live in a 3400 sq. ft. house we built ourselves and plan on adding another 600 sq. ft. in the near future. It has nothing to do with being a status symbol. We use every sq. st. and love every sq. ft. We have wonderful memories of our children and grandchildren playing in our house and running through our 15 acres. We also have great memories of grandparents, parents, aunts, uncles, cousins, brothers, sisters, nieces, nephews, friends, sitting around our table enjoying family meals, playing board and card games, visiting around our fireplace. We've had cookouts and games outside. Holidays are a special time here. We've walked the trails in our woods. We've shared happy times and supported each other in difficult times in this place. This is not just a house to us, it's our home and we love what it's been to us, and what we hope it will continue to be. "There's no place like home" is real to us. My husband never made me feel guilty for not working outside our home. He was happy making me happy. I returned his kindness by always keeping his home a good place for him to be when he wasn't at work. He's never cooked, cleaned, done laundry, gotten up in the middle of the night with kids. We have 15 acres, with about 1/3 lawn. I've always mowed the lawn, painted the house and outbuildings inside and out when they need it. Cleared trails through the woods, piled firewood, piled lumber (we had our own sawmill). Just because I've stayed home I haven't been lazy. If I'd continued working, I don't think either of us would have been as content as we've been because we would have been too busy to enjoy life's simple pleasures. We've both been extremely blessed in our lives, and I think we can both say we've had what we wanted.

The bottom line is that if you're both happy with the situation it's great. What I didn't hear in your post is that hubby is happy to keep working indefinitely to support the building and maintenace plan or that your finances are such that he can retire at will and life will continue as is forever. I didn't accuse anyone of being lazy only the different perspectives involved.

The point of my original post is that here were 4 couples. The men are all looking at some version of retirement in the short term but the cost of housing is keeping it out of reach. None of the wives have an income producing occupation nor do they have children of any age at home. They are, however, perfectly happy with their husband working indefinitely while they continue to fluff up the oversized home. Of course, they need the large home for the few days a year that the kids and grandkids come over. One of the women have permanent bedrooms for each grandkid that is decorated specifically for them. They sleep in them about 4 or 5 days a year per the husband.

The wives have already retired and don't realize or care that their husband can't -- after all, what would he do all day?

 

[stillmuchtolearn]

The question was asked whether or not my husband was happy to keep working to support our building projects. He has been retired for several years and only does a few woodworking jobs for extra income from time to time, mostly because he enjoys being creative with wood and it gives him a sense of satisfaction to make something of beauty. As far as our own projects, he does it for himself as much as for me. We plan and work on our projects together. It isn't work to us, it's our hobby and we have a great time doing it. It keeps us connected and excited about getting up and getting busy! As far as cost, it's surprising how cheaply we get by because we do all our own work, and have harvested and processed all our own lumber from our trees on our own property. All of our space gets used very frequently and isn't wasted space. I only posted to make a point that all somewhat large houses aren't a waste--I wasn't trying to argue with anyone. And as far as our finances go, we aren't nearly as wealthy as a lot of people here, but we have a comfortable life. And when the house doesn't get used as much, or we feel it's too much work for us, we live in an area where real estate has always sold very well, so we'll have something of value to help further finance our retirement if we choose. I'm sorry if I gave the impression I was arguing. I was just trying to present another view on the subject.

 

[2B]

stillmuchtolearn,

If you're happy, that's great. That's what it's all about. I wasn't attacking anyone's mutual decision. I was pointing out an issue with different objectives and perspectives.

One group is looking for change and a chance to exit what their role for the last 30+ years. The other group wants the status quo forever.

 

[tryan]

DW could have easily been one of the 4 cited; but after 20 years of a persistent message: "I am retiring as soon as economically feasible and with no decrease in standard of living" ... she was on-board.

Oh, I still hear the "If we have all this money, why can't we [fill in the blank]:

1. update the family room furniture
2. not rent the lake house
3. buy a new car every 4 years like the Joneses."

To which I say "we have 'all this money' because we have NOT [fill in the blank]".

Point being, BOTH partners in the 4 couples cited made the decision to maintain the status quo (keep up with the Joneses ...).

 

[Delawaredave]

Point being, BOTH partners in the 4 couples cited made the decision to maintain the status quo (keep up with the Joneses ...).

Read in a recent book, "most people can either look rich or become rich, but generally not both..."

 

[VoyT]

2B, you didn't happen to inquire about the gentlemen's spending habits did you?
Is it possible that while they're going on about their wives' spending on houses, they have no problem with trading in the luxury car every year, or buying top-of-the-line electronics, paying fees to the golf club, financing several golfing vacations a year or buying jewelry, etc., for the girlfriend?

 

[2B]

2B, you didn't happen to inquire about the gentlemen's spending habits did you?
Is it possible that while they're going on about their wives' spending on houses, they have no problem with trading in the luxury car every year, or buying top-of-the-line electronics, paying fees to the golf club, financing several golfing vacations a year or buying jewelry, etc., for the girlfriend?

Excellent point!!!!!

They were not living their lives wearing ashes and sackcloth. One has spent considerable sums in the outdoor activity arena but he also used it as "business entertainment." One I had just met that night so I don't know what his spending habits were. They lived in a nice middle call neighborhood is all I knew. One has worked himself hard and I don't see him doing much other than that but he also has the biggest house in an upscale neighborhood where his wife is busily decorating the place and creating individual bedrooms for each grandchild. One paid for one son through law school and is currently paying for another one to get his PhD in psychology. I see a significant spending pattern for all of them but the basic fact remains that they are "close" but can't retire with the big house around their neck.