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Old 04-21-2015, 10:56 AM   #101
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Parochial is this case meaning "myopically regionally biased". It is not "logical" to assume that SoCal would be everyone's cup of tea to the point of dwarfing all other economic factors affecting rent/housing prices anywhere in Georgia - is it?


It's "apples to oranges" to compare just about any place to just about anyplace else - isn't it? Why so more the "hipster part of SoCal" to anyplace, GA? Are you not suggesting that the "hipster part of SoCal" is a gold standard of desirability as a living location that can only be offset by the economics of the cost of the living location?
No, I didn't say that at all. I said there are cheaper places with nice scenery and lots of outdoorsy stuff to do in California than hispter areas of S Cal. Ukiah was discussed previously in this thread. Why compare one of the priciest parts of California to the entire state of GA. Why not compare Redding or Modesto to anyplace in GA? Neither one makes any sense. CA and GA are both big states with lots of cities with different attributes. I am not going to post on this particular topic any more because I am not interested in trading insults nor seeing a point in being expected to defend things I never posted or even implied.
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Old 04-21-2015, 11:15 AM   #102
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Whoops - did not read your comments that way at all (until this explanation). Sorry.
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Old 04-21-2015, 11:17 AM   #103
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So bantering and going back and forth as to what is comparable between locations gets hard to conceptualize in a public forum like this. Just my two cents!
My only point was in response to a previous post that is doesn't make sense to compare rent to one city in pricey area of California to the entire state of Georgia. There are many nice, livable places with much cheaper rent in California, too.
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Old 04-21-2015, 11:46 AM   #104
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My only point was in response to a previous post that is doesn't make sense to compare rent to one city in pricey area of California to the entire state of Georgia. There are many nice, livable places with much cheaper rent in California, too.
Exactly!
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:30 PM   #105
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Curious, when is a good time to seriously think of where to live after retirement? 10 years before? 5 years? 1?

I'm still more than 20 years away from retirement and have toyed with the following ideas:
1. SoCal/Los Angeles area (basically just stay put) - high cost of living
2. Florida - no state tax on retirement income
3. Philippines (where I grew up) - low cost of living (my grandmother lives on just $1,500/mo in a nice condo and that's inclusive of salary for 2 caregivers)

It's really just vague musings at this point, however.
If you like Philippines, no contest. Just head back there after you retire. Maybe establish residence in Nevada for a year or so to cleanse the California tax collectors off your shell

Ha
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Old 04-21-2015, 02:54 PM   #106
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A friend of mine lives in Orange County and loves the weather and health care. The traffic is not great but manageable.
This is absolutely untrue and it's not a good idea to mislead people. Traffic is never manageable when it takes you an hour to get into San Diego when you are only a few miles outside, when the 405 and the 5 freeways are parking lots more often than not, and when you can encounter serious traffic at 2:00 in the morning on the 710. No matter what time of day you drive in SoCal, and that includes all of Orange County, you encounter traffic.

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Arguing about CA is pointless with anyone living there that has not lived somewhere else. I grew up (SF bay area) and went to college (central coast) and first career job (LA area) in CA. Also moved back there (SF bay area) for work later in career. I have also lived around the country so have personal experience with areas different than CA.

Several things I identified, especially after moving back to CA:
1. People that have never left CA do not realize how bad some of CA is. You can use your definition of what bad is - water, taxes, crime, COL, traffic, immigration, education, environmental issues, etc.
2. There is more to life than living by the beach. BTW the ocean water off anywhere north of LA is way too cold unless you have wetsuit. Even LA water is too cold most of the year for any extended time.
3. Most people in CA accept the downsides of traffic, high cost for things and high taxes as just part of living there. Many do not know any different so it is their normal.
4. CA was the land of opportunity back in 70's and prior, now it has lost that.
5. Politically CA is dominated by liberal democrat party and there is insufficient opposition. So you have to like/accept/tolerate this. It will stay this way for a long time.
6. The high populated coast and big city areas dominate the state, although land-wise it is a fraction of the state. Deep blue along the coast and big cities, much more red inland.
7. CA has beautiful outdoors and mountains to enjoy, a lot of the state is beyond 10 miles from the ocean.

Whether your list of positives outweighs the negatives is different for each person. I am glad to be out of there, too many negatives for me. Also retiree living vs working has different priorities.

...
This. Spot on. I live here (but not for long), and no, I don't find it normal at all (#3). Regarding #4, most of LA was a cesspool in the 70's, with air pollution still pretty bad. Since the early 2000's, the city has come roaring back and would indeed be a pretty cool place to live in were it not overcome by the negatives.

As to number 7, yes the state has many beautiful amenities, including mountains, desert, beaches, all sorts of entertainment. It just takes hours fighting the traffic and crowds to partake in them.
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Old 04-21-2015, 03:40 PM   #107
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If you like Philippines, no contest. Just head back there after you retire. Maybe establish residence in Nevada for a year or so to cleanse the California tax collectors off your shell.
Well, I lived there for the first 20 years of my life while I've only lived in the US for 10 years. Aside from bemoaning slow internet, I don't really have to adjust much if I go back right now (particularly if I live in a nice area such as where my grandma is right now). 25 years from now? Who knows. But yeah, CA taxes are killer. I think I'm in the 9.3% marginal for CA state income tax. It's the primary reason why relocating is looking mighty attractive.

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  1. Reasonably low cost of living, including taxes
  2. Access to restaurants and culture, which could mean living within an hour or so of a larger city, but not necessarily living in the larger city.
  3. Airport nearby - again could mean living within an hour or so of a larger city.
  4. Good healthcare nearby
  5. These days we're thinking condo for maintenance reasons. We currently live on an acre outside of Austin.
  6. One thing to possibly consider is good long term care facility nearby in case one or both of us end up needing that.
These are actually what have me considering going back to the Philippines upon retirement. I can get the benefits of items 1-4 and still be able to save half my pension. For item 6, right now a skilled private nurse would cost maybe $1,000 a month. Probably a lot less if my Google search of PhP 120,000 annual salary for nurses (~USD 2,700/yr) is to be believed. Granted, if I hadn't grown up in the Philippines, retiring there probably won't be an option. I'd probably just look into relocating to other states in the US.
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Old 04-21-2015, 04:17 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by 38Chevy454 View Post
Arguing about CA is pointless with anyone living there that has not lived somewhere else. I grew up (SF bay area) and went to college (central coast) and first career job (LA area) in CA. Also moved back there (SF bay area) for work later in career. I have also lived around the country so have personal experience with areas different than CA.

Several things I identified, especially after moving back to CA:
1. People that have never left CA do not realize how bad some of CA is. You can use your definition of what bad is - water, taxes, crime, COL, traffic, immigration, education, environmental issues, etc.
2. There is more to life than living by the beach. BTW the ocean water off anywhere north of LA is way too cold unless you have wetsuit. Even LA water is too cold most of the year for any extended time.
3. Most people in CA accept the downsides of traffic, high cost for things and high taxes as just part of living there. Many do not know any different so it is their normal.
4. CA was the land of opportunity back in 70's and prior, now it has lost that.
5. Politically CA is dominated by liberal democrat party and there is insufficient opposition. So you have to like/accept/tolerate this. It will stay this way for a long time.
6. The high populated coast and big city areas dominate the state, although land-wise it is a fraction of the state. Deep blue along the coast and big cities, much more red inland.
7. CA has beautiful outdoors and mountains to enjoy, a lot of the state is beyond 10 miles from the ocean.

Whether your list of positives outweighs the negatives is different for each person. I am glad to be out of there, too many negatives for me. Also retiree living vs working has different priorities.

If anyone wants a NM perspective, PM me. Santa Fe is just one of many areas in NM that are popular with retirees. Santa Fe is not a large city, it is relatively small although it does have a bigger feel.

+1
I grew up in Orange County, went to school in SLO, lived in Sacramento, Riverside and Brawley on my early adult years before I'd had enough and moved away with no intention of moving back. I do visit there regularly to see family and have never questioned my decision to leave. I currently live in Pennsylvania, but gave also lived in New Mexico, Virginia, Delaware and Florida. I'd take any of those states over California. They all have friendlier people, lower taxes and lower cost of living. Politics are more balanced and each state had a variety of outdoor activities to enjoy. Cold winters can be tough, but at least we have water.
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Old 04-21-2015, 07:50 PM   #109
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In an urban hipster part of Georgia near a lot of high paying IT jobs and also near the beach with sunny 80 degree weather? Otherwise the rent comparison is apples to oranges. There are cheap rents parts of California, too, further away from the jobs, beaches, major colleges and cultural attractions but a lot of nice natural scenery and outdoorsy stuff to do.
The individual was talking about general California. Nothing was stated about IT jobs, beaches, or otherwise. Yet, central Georgia is the #2 spot for Engineers in the country (http://www.forbes.com/sites/kathrynd...for-engineers/). So yes, relatively well paying IT jobs. Its also a few hours away from arguably the best beaches in the country (Florida). If you want Hipster you drive an hour to the north and find Atlanta or to the east and find Savannah. If you want natural scenery Georgia has plenty of that too. Weather? It is hot and humid with no snow Major Colleges? Georgia State and Mercer are right here. Cultural attractions? Depends what you mean - how about the state fair grounds being 20 minutes away, various historical monuments, parks, and down town areas? Want to see live music or a play - yep that too and you wont hit traffic.

Overall, I think we are comparing apples to apples.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:02 PM   #110
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I've been in the Ft. Lauderdale area for 16 years and started looking for a place to finish raising my kids. . . . . .

I settled on Northwest Florida (AKA - Gulf Coast/Panhandle/Redneck Riviera), specifically the area between Panama City Beach and Destin.

Great salt water fishing, plenty to catch in the huge bays just inland and many fresh water lakes within 100 miles. Housing prices and styles range from stupidly expensive on the beach to very affordable as you move inland just a few miles.

Shopping and services including health care are adequate, but don't have the range of choices I've been accustomed to.

Once you're 5-10 miles north of the beach, you're in the rural South, and that won't be to everyone's liking. Fine for me, though.

The major downside I found is the summers are crazy with tourists. Traffic moves slowly on the weekends and beach parking can be difficult. Both are manageable if you plan ahead though. Plus - no state income tax
I just spent the weekend in Seaside (FL). It's west of Panama City, east of Destin. Cheapest house in town was $1 million, and most expensive place was $21.5 million. Restaurants were crazy expensive. The beaches are fantastic, however.

You can go off beach 5-10 miles, however there's absolutely nothing there but raw land. I didn't see much shopping inland, and very little society.

Consider moving where Floridians go on vacation--No. GA, Western NC, East TN. I personally prefer east of Knoxville in the mountains. It's a straight shot on interstate highways back to Pennsylvania. The whole region has fantastic vistas and beautiful lakes. Weather has 4 seasons, but Summer's pleasant at higher elevations. Remember that Tennessee has no state income taxes for most people.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:07 PM   #111
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More on California, particularly the radiation coming from Japan and impacting California air and water as a result of Fukushima (of course, the same radiation impact could be said for Oregon and Washington):

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-0...ornia-diaspora
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:31 PM   #112
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I think I'm liking this "bash California" theme. Everyone will move out... and the traffic will improve.

As to whether those who like it have never lived elsewhere... I'm a native who spent 11 years in 3 other states before I moved back. I'm fine with folks deciding it's awful here and moving out. But I like it... especially now that I'm retired and don't have to deal with the pain of commuting.

So... Keep it up. California is AWFUL!!!! You must move now if you live here. And those of you that don't live here, don't come here!!! And get off my freeway and my lawn!!!!
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:20 PM   #113
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I'm in TX and we are thinking of relocating part-time to SoCal. But then, I lived in NYC for my first 58 years. DS is out there but that's not the reason. But reasonably priced over-55 communities are.


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Old 04-21-2015, 10:22 PM   #114
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I happen to think that Sonoma County, California is paradise on Earth, but your paradise may be somewhere else. It's all good. Sure, we have state income tax here, but I sleep well knowing my property taxes (my second largest expense category) will never shoot up. Traffic congestion is a problem in and around urban areas, but I left the city and now traffic never touches me. I live within a short walk or drive to redwood forests, a scenic river, vineyards, farms, and the stunning Pacific coast. Hiking, fishing, and boating opportunities abound. Yes, I lived other places, including Pennsylvania and Massachusetts, but THIS part of California is definitely for me, and many others. COL is higher here, so one needs an adequate ER budget to make it work. But California is a big state and one's negative experience of a part of does not wash over the whole.
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:30 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by rodi View Post
I think I'm liking this "bash California" theme. Everyone will move out... and the traffic will improve.

As to whether those who like it have never lived elsewhere... I'm a native who spent 11 years in 3 other states before I moved back. I'm fine with folks deciding it's awful here and moving out. But I like it... especially now that I'm retired and don't have to deal with the pain of commuting.

So... Keep it up. California is AWFUL!!!! You must move now if you live here. And those of you that don't live here, don't come here!!! And get off my freeway and my lawn!!!!

+ at least 1

I am getting so weary of all the
California Cassandras.

Don't like it? Don't come here, or leave, as many have.

No place is perfect.However, this is my home.

Rodi, we need a list like the one REWahoo made for TX.
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Old 04-22-2015, 05:19 AM   #116
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Where to retire

As my family are spread out on the east coast - California is out of the question. Were I to consider California it would have to be northern Ca. I've been to LA (many years ago) and Forgive me but I found it to be a cesspool. I believe it's only gotten worse. Drive on el Segundo Blvd and a the hood goes on for miles and miles. It's a big state I'm sure there are plenty of great places and people ... It's just too far.

I've gotten some good ideas from this post.. Guess the Mrs and I have some visiting to do.

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Old 04-22-2015, 05:43 AM   #117
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+ at least 1

I am getting so weary of all the
California Cassandras.

Don't like it? Don't come here, or leave, as many have.

No place is perfect.However, this is my home.
+1 and then some.

Thank you.
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Old 04-22-2015, 06:53 AM   #118
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California is AWFUL!!!!
I'm just bemused by it all.
California is so enormous that it has practically everything, both good and bad.
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Old 04-22-2015, 07:02 AM   #119
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Kind of like the blind men and the elephant. I agree, there are both cheap and expensive places to live. Two things it doesn't have--ridiculously low winter temperatures and too much humidity.


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Old 04-22-2015, 07:08 AM   #120
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Kind of like the blind men and the elephant. I agree, there are both cheap and expensive places to live. Two things it doesn't have--ridiculously low winter temperatures and too much humidity.


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